|
Title: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: TulsaGoldenHurriCAN on May 20, 2015, 02:54:17 pm http://topgolf.com/us/company/press-room/press-releases/2015/topgolf-aims-for-2016-tulsa-opening/
Quote The premier golf entertainment company looks to expand its Oklahoma presence TULSA – May 20, 2015 – Topgolf International is only one month shy from opening its first Oklahoma location in Oklahoma City, and the company today confirmed it is already looking to expand in the state. Topgolf is actively seeking site locations in the Tulsa market with the hope of opening there within the next 12-18 months. Topgolf is the only entertainment center of its kind, offering competitive golfing games for all ages and skill levels and advanced technology to track every player’s shots. The company, based in Dallas, has 16 locations worldwide with another 11 under construction. “We are incredibly grateful and excited for the support and anticipation the Oklahoma market has shown for Topgolf,” said Topgolf Vice President of Real Estate Zach Shor. “Tulsa is a vibrant and fast-growing city with a great history, so it is a natural fit for a potential Topgolf location.” Topgolf’s economic impact in its community is remarkable, creating more than 450 jobs at each location and serving as an anchor tenant that tends to attract other popular franchises to the area. In fact, its economic output in Oklahoma City is expected to exceed $264.5 million over a 10-year-period, according to a third-party audit. Meanwhile, Topgolf Oklahoma City will open to the public on June 19. Residents can follow Topgolf’s progress in Oklahoma at facebook.com/topgolfokc and @TopgolfOKC on Twitter and Instagram. About Topgolf Topgolf is a global sports entertainment community creating the best times of your life, with 16 locations serving more than 4 million guests annually. Players hit golf balls containing computer microchips that track each shot’s accuracy and distance while awarding points for hitting targets on the outfield. Each facility offers an upscale and playful experience, featuring an impressive food and beverage menu, music, games, climate-controlled hitting bays, and hundreds of HDTVs. Topgolf also brings fun, interactive experiences to the community through its Topgolf U lessons, leagues, tournaments, KidZone parties, and social and corporate events. To learn more about Topgolf, visit www.topgolf.com. Media Contact: Adrienne Chance Director of Corporate Communications, Topgolf Ph: (469) 546-5370 E-mail: adrienne.chance@topgolf.com Link to Tulsa World Article:http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/consumer/topgolf-looking-to-tee-off-in-tulsa/article_0cada0e5-2f40-5e84-9c75-58656b39179a.html (http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/consumer/topgolf-looking-to-tee-off-in-tulsa/article_0cada0e5-2f40-5e84-9c75-58656b39179a.html) This is an interesting development considering the $22 million FlyingTee Entertainment and Golf Complex going in at RiverWalk Crossing in Jenks. Although that is an indoor digital gaming setup whereas TopGolf is outside on a multistory decked building with big targets to hit at and micro-chipped balls so you can track your shots. It sounds a bit like bowling but with golf (compete against others in your group to get shots closer to targets). It looks pretty neat. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: LandArchPoke on May 20, 2015, 11:39:52 pm Word on the street is they are locating downtown. My guess would be the Fintube site, but I do not know for sure where.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: TulsaGoldenHurriCAN on May 21, 2015, 08:03:12 am That would be an interesting addition downtown. It might be good in the parking crater or SE downtown. I doubt it will create too much of a walkable area though but will most certainly be a big draw.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: DowntownDan on May 21, 2015, 09:05:06 am Word on the street is they are locating downtown. My guess would be the Fintube site, but I do not know for sure where. The ones I've seen in Dallas are set up in the upper-middle class suburbs with oceans of parking. It would be interesting if they try to do this anywhere near downtown. I would expect BA or Jenks. Title: Re: Post by: LeGenDz on May 21, 2015, 09:39:43 am BA off 51 somewhere or by Warren would be my guess. Would have guessed Bixby if it wasn't so close to Riverwalks plans (and the had the space).
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: swake on May 21, 2015, 09:47:36 am The ones I've seen in Dallas are set up in the upper-middle class suburbs with oceans of parking. It would be interesting if they try to do this anywhere near downtown. I would expect BA or Jenks. Jenks already has one of these places under construction at Riverwalk, the movie theater was bought out and torn down for the facility. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: LandArchPoke on May 21, 2015, 10:20:31 am TopGolf is very focused on two key things - White collar office concentration and Young Professionals. Downtown is the key merger of those two in Tulsa. They do need surface parking and I think about 20 acres... which is why it leads me to think it's the Fintube site or maybe some of the OSU land, with views back towards downtown. I don't think they could make a site work inside the IDL, and I don't really think they would be a good thing to go inside the IDL based off the size and parking needs they have. Just outside of downtown they could be a good fit for the right site.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: DowntownDan on May 21, 2015, 11:21:21 am Jenks already has one of these places under construction at Riverwalk, the movie theater was bought out and torn down for the facility. I thought the Riverwalk development was indoor "virtual reality" type golf. Does it have an outdoor component like Top Golf? Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: SXSW on May 21, 2015, 02:12:02 pm TopGolf is very focused on two key things - White collar office concentration and Young Professionals. Downtown is the key merger of those two in Tulsa. They do need surface parking and I think about 20 acres... which is why it leads me to think it's the Fintube site or maybe some of the OSU land, with views back towards downtown. I don't think they could make a site work inside the IDL, and I don't really think they would be a good thing to go inside the IDL based off the size and parking needs they have. Just outside of downtown they could be a good fit for the right site. Is the Evans Fintube site east or west of the tracks by OSU-Tulsa? I thought it was where the old industrial buildings are now but may be wrong. That would be an interesting location. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: swake on May 21, 2015, 02:16:35 pm I thought the Riverwalk development was indoor "virtual reality" type golf. Does it have an outdoor component like Top Golf? They are advertising three levels of hitting bays. I think it's just like Top Golf. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: owenix on May 21, 2015, 02:39:05 pm So I looked at the page source for [flyingteegolf.com](http://flyingteegolf.com/) and made some interesting finds that lead me to believe it is indeed a Top Golf clone.
Here is my evidence: 1. [Multi-Story Driving Deck](http://flyingteegolf.com/images/0f6ff786.slider-4.jpg) 1. [Chipped Ball Tracking System](http://flyingteegolf.com/images/06f8616c.slider-3.jpg) 1. This HTML from the page <img src="images/06f8616c.slider-3.jpg" alt="Sophisticated tracking system helps serious golfers perfect their technique"> <div class="overlay"> <div> <p>Sophisticated tracking system helps serious golfers perfect their technique</p> </div> </div> I'm SO much more excited about this development now. It also leads me to believe the Top Golf will build near the Warren Theater. imgur rehost of the images above [Driving Deck](http://imgur.com/xwASN6Q) [Tracking System and Size of Course](http://imgur.com/lJhflrq) pastebin rehost of source http://pastebin.com/2bFviD7c Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: Stanley1 on May 22, 2015, 01:11:35 pm FlyingTee is indeed outdoor, but it is not chip technology like Top Golf.
IF I understand correctly, FlyingTee uses cameras that "measure" real, outdoor golf shots, and then shows you how that shot would track on a "real" course. If that makes sense. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: rdj on May 22, 2015, 01:40:04 pm Lasers.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: sooneralum2012 on June 03, 2015, 08:37:16 pm TopGolf is very focused on two key things - White collar office concentration and Young Professionals. Downtown is the key merger of those two in Tulsa. They do need surface parking and I think about 20 acres... which is why it leads me to think it's the Fintube site or maybe some of the OSU land, with views back towards downtown. I don't think they could make a site work inside the IDL, and I don't really think they would be a good thing to go inside the IDL based off the size and parking needs they have. Just outside of downtown they could be a good fit for the right site. its even more so in OKC, yet they chose to build in far NW okc. Maybe it was the price of the land, but the development in OKC between the river and the old I-40 is primed for development and would have been a great option for. So what i'm getting at is they rarely if ever build in urban areas, didn't in dallas or OKC, and won't in Tulsa. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: LandArchPoke on June 03, 2015, 09:40:18 pm its even more so in OKC, yet they chose to build in far NW okc. Maybe it was the price of the land, but the development in OKC between the river and the old I-40 is primed for development and would have been a great option for. So what i'm getting at is they rarely if ever build in urban areas, didn't in dallas or OKC, and won't in Tulsa. I'll put it to you this way... I know for a fact they have put in offers on land within the CBD. Wether it will happen, I don't know. I actually hope it doesn't because the site plan I've seen would require closing a street. While I want TopGolf here... not if they are going to do that. I think the Fintube site just east of OSU and west of US 75 would be perfect for them and would offer incredible views of Downtown. Downtown OKC is not the merger of those two market, and neither is Downtown Dallas. There is an infinite more amount of Class A office in north Dallas which is where Topgolf has located there. Which is why they are located close to the 75 corridor so they are easy to access from Richardson to Downtown. They are also smack next to Dallas' major Young Professional neighborhoods Lower Greenville, Lakewood, Uptown, etc. Their other North north Dallas location is close to all the new office developments in Frisco and very close to Plano - this area is very popular for young families in Dallas. NW OKC is the largest office market in OKC, and by far the largest Class A market. This is a key demographic they look at, because they want to near these areas for corporate events. Northern OKC is the highest concentration of Young Professionals in OKC - I've analyzed these demographics. Tulsa's largest is actually near 71st/Mingo. Downtown has about 1,000 less in a 2-mile radius (so they are basically the same), but in terms of percentage of population downtown is the highest with nearly 30% being Young Professionals. The downtown market in Tulsa is the largest office area too... Tulsa does not have an area similar to the Quail Springs Office Park. The second largest office area is 61st & Yale and that has a high percentage of medical office, not corporations. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: SouthTulsaCountyDude on June 08, 2015, 09:09:48 am I say the Creek Nation do away with their FlyingTee plan... and replace it with TopGolf.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: Stanley1 on June 10, 2015, 09:41:01 pm I say the Creek Nation do away with their FlyingTee plan... and replace it with TopGolf. Far too late for that. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: EricGarcia on February 17, 2016, 11:04:48 am Is there an update on TopGolf in Tulsa? They are not going to be opening in 2016, but has anyone heard rumors of their plans?
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: AngieB on February 17, 2016, 11:51:51 am I think one big difference between Flying Tee and TopGolf will be (I suspect) a gambling component at Flying Tee.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: swake on February 17, 2016, 12:58:26 pm I think one big difference between Flying Tee and TopGolf will be (I suspect) a gambling component at Flying Tee. The Creek Nation did put the land in reserved status, they certainly could do slot machines or something there. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: Conan71 on February 17, 2016, 01:50:47 pm Is there really room for both in this market?
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: cannon_fodder on February 17, 2016, 03:35:18 pm The Creek Nation did put the land in reserved status, they certainly could do slot machines or something there. My understand is that reserve status means nothing. To be in compliance with the gaming compact it must be Indian Trust Land look at the Assessor map for the Creek Casino, the deed is held by the United States Government in trust for the Creek Nation). IN that this land was previously developed and owned by NOT the tribe itself, it cannot be trust land. In that it was owned outside of tribal members it is also not original allotment land (which is called something else, but gets less-awesome non-sovereign special treatment). Short version - it is very doubtful they can have any sort of gaming there. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: swake on February 17, 2016, 04:11:04 pm My understand is that reserve status means nothing. To be in compliance with the gaming compact it must be Indian Trust Land look at the Assessor map for the Creek Casino, the deed is held by the United States Government in trust for the Creek Nation). IN that this land was previously developed and owned by NOT the tribe itself, it cannot be trust land. In that it was owned outside of tribal members it is also not original allotment land (which is called something else, but gets less-awesome non-sovereign special treatment). Short version - it is very doubtful they can have any sort of gaming there. Reserved means it is land held in trust. When the Creek Nation bought the land and had it moved into trust status Jenks and Oklahoma lost all taxation rights to the land. There's no difference. The Creek Nation even paid an amount to Jenks to offset the lost revenue so the city wouldn't fight the action. Anyway, I looked it up and The Indian Gaming Act of 1988 does state that new trust land cannot have gaming, but there are two exceptions that would apply here. 1. Oklahoma tribes are exempt when the land is within their national boundaries. Which this land is. 2. When the land is contagious with other older reserved land, which the Riverwalk site is as well. Quote http://www.nigc.gov/images/uploads/Indian%20Gaming%20Regulatory%20Act.pdf Sec. 2719. Gaming on lands acquired after October 17, 1988 (a) Prohibition on lands acquired in trust by Secretary. Except as provided in subsection (b), gaming regulated by this Act shall not be conducted on lands acquired by the Secretary in trust for the benefit of an Indian tribe after the date of enactment of this Act [enacted Oct. 17, 1988] unless-- (1) such lands are located within or contiguous to the boundaries of the reservation of the Indian tribe on the date of enactment of this Act [enacted Oct. 17, 1988]; or (2) the Indian tribe has no reservation on the date of enactment of this Act [enacted Oct. 17, 1988] and-- (A) such lands are located in Oklahoma and-- (i) are within the boundaries of the Indian tribe's former reservation, as defined by the Secretary, or (ii) are contiguous to other land held in trust or restricted status by the United States for the Indian tribe in Oklahoma; Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: cannon_fodder on February 18, 2016, 10:27:19 am I'm not expert on the subject (a wise man would stop reading now!), but I know someone who is a preeminent expert in this area and will ask them for the answer.
But my understanding is that there is Federal Trust Land which is land held by Uncle Sam for the tribe and has the strongest rights and requires approval of the Secretary of the Interior to alter (their land, their rules). Restricted Land/Original Allotment land, which is held in trust for the family to whom it was originally allotted (and has special tax treatment and exemptions from some state laws, think smoke shops and firework stands, in addition to other small businesses you don't hear about). There is fee land inside the Nation (tribe owns the land, not in trust). Then basically everything else. Here is what the deed to Trust land looks like for Federal Trust Land, in this instance the land that the River Spirit Casino sits on: Quote USA IN TRUST FOR THE MUSCOGEE CREEK NATION Here is what the RiverWalk deeds read: Quote MUSCOGEE (CREEK) NATION At this time it appears to be held in fee by the tribe. They could petition the Secretary to take the land in Trust, and would likely cite exactly what you did to try to get it approved for gaming. I'm not sure how the contiguous thing works out (I think the trust land ends at the river), but it certainly is within their former reservation and they did not have a reservation in 1988. But that is a longer process than we are talking about. Also worth noting that they have kept saying they "have no plans" to do that. Jenks raised concerns about sales tax, property tax, and gaming and they were told it was a non-issue. Then again, it would be hard to really blame a tribe for saying one thing to the "white man" and then backing out of the deal. Stupid karma. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: cannon_fodder on February 18, 2016, 10:43:54 am Friend got back to me...
It was purchased in fee and is held in fee at the moment. Assuming they have no notes on it, they could petition for it to be Trust land but my friend was not aware that such a thing has happened. Given that it is within their territory and arguably contiguous to existing trust land (something about the river bottom argument), it would likely be approved for gaming eventually. Friend said they would be surprised if a petition for trust wasn't made at some point even if they didn't intend for their to be gaming (I'm assuming to get the competitive advantage of taking it outside the jurisdiction of Oklahoma and Jenks?). they also said I have a "tenuous grasp" of Indian Law as it concerns land. Which I choose to take as a compliment, though I'm confident it was meant as an insult. ;D Kudos on your 2719 analysis, appears you were spot on. Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: Stanley1 on February 23, 2016, 02:55:33 pm You guys are making it too complicated. Simply check out the websites, listen to them (Creeks and those running it) talk about it, and everything else. There will be no gaming at Flying Tee.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: sgrizzle on February 23, 2016, 03:35:38 pm The tribes are making plenty money off gaming, but they have been spending a lot of it on developing non-gaming sources of revenue. Putting a slot machine at a golf complex would just be silly. The thing has three restaurants in it and everything is golf-themed. I don't play golf and I kinda want to go.
Title: Re: Topgolf Aims for 2016 Tulsa Opening Post by: sgrizzle on February 23, 2016, 03:48:32 pm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bHPJ8RDq2U&feature=youtu.be
Construction video |