People on this board love to criticize Dallas but it looks pretty good to me. Thumbed through a copy of "Dallas magazine the other day. In the first 10 pages I saw:
1. A tear down in University Park for only $899,000
2. A two bedroom condo in Crescent Sq for only $1,300,000
3 The fact that Dallas is headquarters to over 40 large corporations.
My guess is that property owners and job holders like it there -- no wonder so many OK college grads head that way.
Let me have the butler fetch the Rolls, I need to see this condo for myself!
I don't see anything wrong with Dallas other then its in Texas. lol! But seriously, it probably the only Texas city that I would consider living in. I go down there quite a bit because the company I work for has a regional office there. There is a lot of building going on there. From new highways to office and residential buildings.
One thing that is even worse then Oklahoma is the dry county thing. All the cities are connected together so it's hard to tell when you get into a dry county. Not a huge deal but it is even more screwed up the Oklahoma IMO.
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
Let me have the butler fetch the Rolls, I need to see this condo for myself!
two bedroom for only $1.3M? I should move now. At only 5-10 times local housing costs, that's a steal!
I'l willing to be I can find an 5 bedroom in Tulsa for $1.3 Million - probably with a guest house (I assume you chose those housing units as a joke, as you can get a comparable apartment in San Francisco or Honolulu for $1+ mil).
I dont like Dallas-Fort Wroth because in my opinion it is just a sprawling mid western city. The only thing neat or interesting about Dallas is how big it is. If I wanted to move to a big city why not one that has something unique about it: Chicago, San Fran, Seattle, NYC, Miami... at least they have character. Even Minneapolis and certainly Austin has more character than Dallas.
If I wanted to spend 1+ Million USD to live in the center of a big city Dallas would be near the bottom of my list. Along with Houston for that matter.
Other than its size, I dont see what it offers. Maybe I'm missing something.
quote:
Originally posted by cannon_fodder
I'l willing to be I can find an 5 bedroom in Tulsa for $1.3 Million - probably with a guest house (I assume you chose those housing units as a joke, as you can get a comparable apartment in San Francisco or Honolulu for $1+ mil).
I dont like Dallas-Fort Wroth because in my opinion it is just a sprawling mid western city. The only thing neat or interesting about Dallas is how big it is. If I wanted to move to a big city why not one that has something unique about it: Chicago, San Fran, Seattle, NYC, Miami... at least they have character. Even Minneapolis and certainly Austin has more character than Dallas.
If I wanted to spend 1+ Million USD to live in the center of a big city Dallas would be near the bottom of my list. Along with Houston for that matter.
Other than its size, I dont see what it offers. Maybe I'm missing something.
It offers money and a lot of things to do and spend it on when you get it... If thats your thing.
as with anywhere, you take the good with the bad.
Things I didnt like about living in Dallas.
1. The traffic...rush hour, people drive like they have a death wish and one for you too.
2. The local streets, once you get off the highways its like Tulsa out there.
3. All the people. Its too big. With that comes crime, though Tulsa seems to be keeping up well.
4. The parks are a joke for a city that size, have you been to the Dallas Zoo? Talk about depressing.
5. It is truly the epitome of urban sprawl.
Things I liked.
1. umm...I like the Texas Rangers.
2. The shopping is nice.
3.There were some good Mexican restaruants I found.
4. The freeways are in great shape.
5. The beer is better.
as to the dry county...in Dallas County it varies city by city. For example two adjacent cities, Mesquite and Garland. Garland passed beer and wine sales in 04 or 05, Mesquite has tried and cant get the votes to pass it. Its so strange to go to restaraunts and they are BYOB.
Dallas has changed DRAMATCALLY in the last 10-12 years or so. It can't be accurately defined by urban sprawl, although it admittedly has had lots of it in it's history. DART was accepted very well in spite of the naysayers.
The Uptown area has succeeded beyond anyone's wildest predictions and the Victory is going to take it to the next level. These are all intown development that would have been unheard of in Dallas back the the 80's and before. It's important to note that, with the exception of DART, both Uptown and Victory were the result of a very small group of individuals in the private sector taking a very bad situation and making something postive out of it. (Brownfields and crack houses)
With regard to home prices you must keep things in perspective. We live in University Park and it's not quite as bad as the article implies but it is getting a bit crazy. Outside of the Park Cities Dallas has a LOT of very affordable housing, which is one of the reason's cited when companies relocate here. No state income tax but real estate taxes can be killer.
quote:
Originally posted by DM
I don't see anything wrong with Dallas other then its in Texas. lol! But seriously, it probably the only Texas city that I would consider living in. I go down there quite a bit because the company I work for has a regional office there. There is a lot of building going on there. From new highways to office and residential buildings.
One thing that is even worse then Oklahoma is the dry county thing. All the cities are connected together so it's hard to tell when you get into a dry county. Not a huge deal but it is even more screwed up the Oklahoma IMO.
Dallas = HellHole...
I lived in Houston for three years in my twenties, but I was in Dallas enough to know the following:
Their drivers suck
They all act stuck up (as if they have the right)
Living in Houston made me appreciate it even more. I like Tulsa better, but there are only two cities I'd even consider relocating to: back to Houston, or Kansas City.
Teeeechnically speaking, Dallas has a lot less sprawl and is far more dense than Tulsa. Its the suburbs around Dallas that sprawl.[:P]
quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
Let me have the butler fetch the Rolls, I need to see this condo for myself!
two bedroom for only $1.3M? I should move now. At only 5-10 times local housing costs, that's a steal!
Literally. And not to mention annual real estate taxes. From what I can gather, on average property taxes are about twice as much per taxable $ value in Texas vs. Oklahoma. For me, Dallas and all of Texas is a nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there.
Keep in mind Texas has no state income tax, but yes, real estate taxes are MUCH higher here. We pay more per month in property taxes alone than my whole house payment on the home I owned in Tulsa. What I have not done is try to figure out what's better/cheaper...no state income tax and sky high property taxes or relatively low real estate taxes AND state income tax.
Dallas people are among the most arrogant in the country .... I couldn't live there.
I lived in the D/FW area in the 1980's and I loved it. The weather is better than Olkahoma, it's milder and warmer. Texas has no state income tax and they also do not tax food I beleive. The drawbacks are prop. tax is higher in Texas and they do have some violent gangs there. Texas has motor vehicle safety inspections and smog/emmission inspections for cars. Fort Worth has a great jog/bike trail system The Trinity Trail, miles of open car free jogging. Oklahoma's income tax rate is a bit on the high side, and Oklahoma taxes food, Oklahoma has alot of toll roads too.
I live in Hurst, a suburb of Fort Worth, and property taxes are getting out of control down here.
The lack of a state income tax defrays that cost somewhat, but still, it's expensive. I have an 1800 square foot home that is valued at around 140K in Hurst and my property taxes run about 3600 dollars a year. That's 300 dollars a month added to my monthly mortgage payment in property taxes alone.
Most of those property taxes are for the school district in which we live. But, the really lousy thing is that (as of 3 years ago) our school district was designated one of the wealthy districts. So, now our money is distributed across the state to poorer districts (Robin Hood plan).
I understand the taxes on a similar home in Oklahoma are less than 1000 dollars a year. I guess it matters which school district one lives in though.
quote:
Originally posted by sauerkraut
I lived in the D/FW area in the 1980's and I loved it. The weather is better than Olkahoma, it's milder and warmer. Texas has no state income tax and they also do not tax food I beleive. The drawbacks are prop. tax is higher in Texas and they do have some violent gangs there. Texas has motor vehicle safety inspections and smog/emmission inspections for cars. Fort Worth has a great jog/bike trail system The Trinity Trail, miles of open car free jogging. Oklahoma's income tax rate is a bit on the high side, and Oklahoma taxes food, Oklahoma has alot of toll roads too.
The Trinity River Trail is going through a lot of revitalization and upgrades lately sauerkraut; you'd really like the improvements. All in all, I enjoy living in the Fort Worth area much more than I would in Dallas. But, I do like Dallas. Yes, many of the problems people have noted about traffic and such is true. The downtown area in Dallas has really blown up big time (in a good way, i.e. Victory Plaza) over the last five to ten years and many more improvements are on the way. The transportation systems (Dallas Area Rapid Transit and Trinity Railway Express) are covering more and more of the metropolitan area all of the time. There is even a four or five mile section of the railway (DART) in North Dallas that is all underground. BTW, the DART and TRE rail systems are superb. They are clean and safe. The double-decker train that runs from Fort Worth to Dallas is awesome. I harp on Texas some, but they are making some great improvements around the area.
(http://web2.iadfw.net/ahhughes/transitpictures/images/Dallas%20dart%20citiplace%20subway%20station.jpg)
(http://web2.iadfw.net/ahhughes/transitpictures/images/Dallas%20look%20at%20dart%20Cityplace%20station.gif)
(http://www.greatestcities.com/1275pic/550/CP16550.jpg/P1010183-dart1.jpg)
(http://www.greatestcities.com/1701pic/555/CP16555.jpg/P1010195-dart1.jpg)
(http://www.nationalcorridors.org/df/df08182003b.jpg)
(http://trinityrailwayexpress.org/images/TandP_Platform.jpg)
Indeed, that prop. tax on a $140,000 home is very high. In Columbus, Ohio such a home would run about $1,500 in prop. taxes- depending on what part of the city you live it. When I lived in Texas I loved the Trinity jogging trail, The warm mild climate lets you jog in every season. I ran there in Jaunary shirtless many times and it was about 70 degrees. It does always get cold at night in a Texas winter but it sure beats Ohio's weather. The Dallas Metroplex has great summers clear blue skys and lots of Sun! I miss the weather. I lived in Fort Worth in the early 1980's and moved to Arlington, Texas in the late 1980's. I moved to Ohio in 1990. I understand that Trinity jogging trail is now 35 miles long. Back in the 1980's it was only 14 miles long. I ran many miles on that pavement.[:)]
I remember Trinity Park in Fort Worth used to have a little train that ran around the area in the summer it was full of people, kids and families. They also have planetarium near the area I think it's on Mountgomery Street We went there a few times. Texas has alot of fun things to do. I wish I still lived there. The only bad thing is the high crime/gangs in parts of the city and heavy traffic all over.... May 1st they had a "Mayfest" in Trinity Park a TV station and a radio station used to do a tug-of-war contest over the river, the loser team wound up in the river. I guess they still have "Mayfest" every year.
Sauerkraut's old stomping grounds! Sorry, I'm in picture mode today.
(http://www.spencerthelion.com/images/2005%20FWM43.jpg)
(http://photos.fortwortharchitecture.com/albums/userpics/10001/pier1-trail.jpg)
that is true, one of the nice things about Dallas was (is) DART. I had used it several times, once to go downtown for OU-UT and once to go to a Mavs game. Its great not paying for parking at the station, paying 2.00 or so to ride a train downtown and not have to hassle with parking and traffic.
Yes Tulsa Fan In Texas- I have to agree with you that Fort Worth is nicer than Dallas. Dallas has more crime and traffic, traffic and more traffic and that was 20 years ago. Today the roads must even be worse. Arlington is nice too, but I understand alot of apartments are section 8 now. I used to live at the Indian Creek Apartments at Park Row and highway 360 it was not a bad area and rents were low, today they have alot of crime there, it's also bad on Collins all the way to Lamar. They had a famous night club there (Colins & Lamar) in 1980 called "Players" it was the "in" spot to be. A Thom Thumb Page food store was in that area.It was a brand new state of the art store back then. It brings back alot of memories of my youth.
WOW, Thanks for posting those pictures. They look great. That one building in downtown Fort Worth is all new. Yes that's my old famous jogging trail by the Tandy Center & downtown Fort Worth,...To the west down past University Drive the trail opens up and it was mostly all open field in my day. Today alot of those fields must be built up. After work I used to drive from my job in Grand Prairie and catch I-30 West and go down to Trinity Trail for a quick run. My wife never liked that much. I took my running gear to work with me. I went for a run one hot afternoon on the Trinity Trail and the far western sky had some dark clouds I figured I had time for a short run before the storm hit. That storm moved in very fast, I had to turn around and race back to my truck. I just made it back to my truck with 5 minutes to spair before the storm hit. As fast as the storm it it was over. Ah Texas. No Place like it.[:)]
That's the Pier One building, finished in 2004.
The low Oklahoma tax argument is bunk! My brother in law is a developer in Dallas and I have seen the numbers. For someone with $100,000 in income and a $350,000 home the Dallas property tax number is less than the SUM of the Oklahoma State Income Tax and the Tulsa property tax.
You could very well be right doren. All I have to compare from are the property taxes. For all I know, with my income up in Oklahoma, a state tax might negate any advantages that low property tax values would have.
What about utilities. Have a friend that lives down that way and he said the utilities each month are higher than here. I could have been wrong on what I heard, for it does sound strange that gas, electric, water, etc. utilities would be any different.
Utilities are pretty high. My house is electric and gas (gas for hot water/heater). The average electric gas bills for the summer and winter are (for me, wife, daughter):
Summer
Electricity: $180
Gas: $40
Winter
Electricity: 90
Gas: 90
So, either way you cut it, I run about 200 dollars a month in utilities. And my bills are actually pretty low. Many of the larger houses in the area run 500 and 600 dollar electric bills in the summer. My neighbors' say their electric bill in the summer is more like 300 dollars a month, and it's just two people. Our house is pretty well insulated.
according to the cost of living calculator I only have to make 114000 to maintain my current standard of living in Dallas. I'm not sure if it takes taxes into consideration though. not bad though, only 10% more than Tulsa. at least its not like Hawaii where I'd have to make $243000 to maintain my standard of living (yeah right).
inteller, you're correct that the cost of living here isn't that high, compared to other major cities. For a major city/metropolitan area, the cost of living between Dallas/Fort Worth and the cities in Oklahoma are probably closer than in any other major metropolitan area.
However, you have to be careful where you live because property values do seem to be getting out of control somewhat, especially in Dallas county (and probably soon to be FW).
I have a friend that lives in Richardson (North of Dallas), his 1960s home (comparable to mine) is appraised by Dallas County at $270K. That's about twice the value it was appraised at when he bought it 10 years ago. Many people would say, "Wow, what a great deal, my value has increased 100 percent!" However, he can NEVER sell his house for near that much, and hIs property taxes are twice that of mine, so he pays $600 a month in property taxes alone.
Tarrant County, with the exception of places like Colleyville, Southlake, and other very high dollar areas where the median home value is something like 400K is rather reasonable and probably very close to the cost of living in Tulsa or OkC. I wouldn't doubt that Hurst, where I live, is probably even less than the cost of living in Tulsa proper.
In fact, I just did a cost of living comparison between Fort Worth and Tulsa. The cost of living calculator at bankrate.com says it would take a 1.6 percent INCREASE in my income to live in Tulsa. It quotes the Home Price as being the major difference, an increase of about 5%.
Alot of the times it all comes out in the wash, and it's pretty much even. Texas would have lower heating bills than Tulsa, Texas has no sales tax on food items, Oklahoma taxes all food items. Oklahoma's income tax is pretty high. I understand that Nashville, TN. is a good place to live They have low prop. taxes and no state income tax. The state of Oregon has high income tax rates, but no sales taxes at all. So,If you'd live in Vancover Wash.- across the river from Portland Oregon- you'd have the best of both worlds. The state of Wash. has no income taxes and oregon has no sales taxes, so you just live & work in washington, and shop in oregon. You'd pay no income taxes and no sales taxes.[:)]
quote:
Originally posted by TulsaFan-inTexas
Utilities are pretty high. My house is electric and gas (gas for hot water/heater). The average electric gas bills for the summer and winter are (for me, wife, daughter):
Summer
Electricity: $180
Gas: $40
Winter
Electricity: 90
Gas: 90
So, either way you cut it, I run about 200 dollars a month in utilities. And my bills are actually pretty low. Many of the larger houses in the area run 500 and 600 dollar electric bills in the summer. My neighbors' say their electric bill in the summer is more like 300 dollars a month, and it's just two people. Our house is pretty well insulated.
The rates per kwh are at least 20% higher in texas following electric deregulation. Individual results vary, of course.
of course, in the year following "deregulation" (utilities are insanely regulated for being deregulated, but I know what you refer to) the consumption of electricity in Texas expanded exponentially as the industrial sectors as well as the population has boomed in the last 20 years. As this boom went on, the DOE and EPA as well as hippies have done well in preventing supply from keeping up with demand.
Therefor, prices go up to help stymie demand. The price of electricity is still regulated to the penny.
quote:
Originally posted by doren50
The low Oklahoma tax argument is bunk! My brother in law is a developer in Dallas and I have seen the numbers. For someone with $100,000 in income and a $350,000 home the Dallas property tax number is less than the SUM of the Oklahoma State Income Tax and the Tulsa property tax.
Depends on your income/housing situation. I have a friend who is lucky enough to have enough cash to buy a house outright worth $350,000. His taxes eat him alive, approximately $7,000 a year, even though he only makes $50k a year. So he's being punished for having a nice house. My parents dismissed Texas a place to retire for this reason, they can afford a much more expensive house than someone at their retirement income level would normally be able to, but it would be punitive due to the taxes. If they were willing to live in a cheaper house, it might work out to their benefit.
quote:
The low Oklahoma tax argument is bunk! My brother in law is a developer in Dallas and I have seen the numbers. For someone with $100,000 in income and a $350,000 home the Dallas property tax number is less than the SUM of the Oklahoma State Income Tax and the Tulsa property tax.
Don't give me that song and dance about a bunk argument. Since I moved to Houston 15 months ago, I've discovered one thing... I'd rather file for state AND income taxes than pay gouging property taxes. At least a get a check from Oklahoma for overpayment.
Do you get exemptions or a refund when you pay property taxes? No. Do you claim dependents and standard deductions on your property taxes? No. Oklahoma has been reducing the state income tax rate every year since 2002. Has Texas reduced its property tax rates? Nope. Does Oklahoma allow its income tax rate to increase 10 percent a year? Nope.
And Texas does tax some of its groceries. It's on all of my Kroger receipts! Thank you!
I never knew Texas prop. taxes were that high. The state of Tennessee has no income taxes and they still have low prop. taxes. Texas does have better weather than Oklahoma, The Dallas/FortWorth MetroPlex has more days of warmer weather then does Oklahoma, less snow and less cold. That means alot to many people. The heating bills will be alot lower in Texas. Tulsa gets very cold in winter.Brrrrrr!
quote:
Originally posted by okcpulse
quote:
The low Oklahoma tax argument is bunk! My brother in law is a developer in Dallas and I have seen the numbers. For someone with $100,000 in income and a $350,000 home the Dallas property tax number is less than the SUM of the Oklahoma State Income Tax and the Tulsa property tax.
Don't give me that song and dance about a bunk argument. Since I moved to Houston 15 months ago, I've discovered one thing... I'd rather file for state AND income taxes than pay gouging property taxes. At least a get a check from Oklahoma for overpayment.
Do you get exemptions or a refund when you pay property taxes? No. Do you claim dependents and standard deductions on your property taxes? No. Oklahoma has been reducing the state income tax rate every year since 2002. Has Texas reduced its property tax rates? Nope. Does Oklahoma allow its income tax rate to increase 10 percent a year? Nope.
And Texas does tax some of its groceries. It's on all of my Kroger receipts! Thank you!
And to boot, the property taxes here can be increased at the whim of the county by them overvaluing your home. You can protest that, of course, but guess who you protest to? The county, of course. That's what happened with the friend of mine in Richardson (N. Dallas). His property taxes have doubled in ten years; he now pays twice what I pay (7200/yr). It's ridiculous. We'll be forced to move from here in five years if the rates keep going up. Can't afford it. And Sauerkraut, the heating bills may be less, but the cooling bills certainly aren't. Texas electric rates are among the highest in the country.
It should be easy to figure out if the Oklahoma state income tax is worse than the Texas prop. taxes. Find out on the Oklahoma income tax table in the back of the Oklahoma tax booklet what you'd be paying in Oklahoma income taxes for your income level. If it's less than what the Texas prop. taxes are, odds are you'd be better off in Oklahoma. If it's higher you'd be better off in Texas- It'll give a ruff guess anyhoo. Such as if the tax table says you'll pay $4,000.00 in income taxes in Oklahoma at your a income level- and you pay $3,600.00 in Texas prop. taxes your still more ahead by living in Texas. Texas also has few toll roads, (All Tulsa interstate roads are toll roads).- no sales tax on foods, warmer weather. Texas would be the place to live IMO.
I wouldn't give up Tulsa's spring and fall just so I could avoid winter. I often wonder what it would be like to not have that change of seasons like we have. Winter may have its problems with the occasional bit of ice,snow, and cold. But lots of great places in the world have that, plus can't snow be beautiful, isnt it nice to snuggle up under a quilt in front of a fireplace or watching a good movie, drinking hot coco?
And heck, if anything winter makes you look forward to spring and appreciate it all the more. Do you have that expectation in a place where its always warm?
Spring is here! Everyone hits the garden stores, the river parks, woodward park and the rose gardens, the anticipation of watching things grow and flower. I love it. And then there is fall. The colors, not that they are as great as some parts of the country, but the beauty of driving through those old neighborhoods with the leaves blowing through the air catching the sunlight is wonderful. Pulling out the sweaters, perhaps dressing up a bit and going shopping for the holidays at Utica Square.
Winter here may be about 1 month longer than I would like lol, but thats a great time to head on that vacation to Florida or elsewhere, and if you know what to expect you just learn to do different things according to the season and look forward to and appreciate each one for what it is. When your indoors for the winter, read or write that novel you have always wanted to do, or a painting, or other hobby, work on the inside of your house, have friends over for game night and food. Then when spring comes, get out there and really enjoy every moment of it with gusto.
We have real traditional holidays that are far more likely to look and feel like they are suposed to, with the exception of white Christmases, those are rare lol, flowers at Easter, hot forth of July's, fall colors and temps for Thanksgiving and Halloween.
I often wonder what it would be like to not have real seasons that so surely mark the passage of time, where every month and year just blurred together one after the other with no real difference. To each his own I guess.
I'm with you Artist. Not that the seasons in Fort Worth are nondescript as they are places such as Florida or the Gulf coast, but I like some variety throughout the year.
Regardless if I get too cold once in awhile, a virtual "groundhog day" of weather throughout the year would be very, very boring.
I couldn't hack it up in Ohio where Sauerkraut is though! Tulsa has pretty much the perfect mix of seasons for me.
I would think the perfect weather is in places like Phoenix, AZ and Las Vegas. I go there offten and I just love it. Blue skys and mild temps, sometimes it stays around 85 degrees overnight. The summers are great The days can get up over 100 degrees with no clouds in the sky. Super nice. Phoenix is one of the fastest growing cities in the nation. It can get cold in winter but lucky the cold does not last long. Crime is high in Phoenix, wages are low., As for Texas I think D/FW weather beats Tulsa weather. I just do not like cold seasons at all.. I found a 2005 Oklahoma income tax booklet it said for filing single and earning $50,000 your income tax is $4,200.00 -For married it's $3800.00. No doubt they have raised the rates since then. That's alot of money.
Your numbers are way off.
According to this year's tax form, A person making $50,000 (after the many deductions allowed) would pay $2,825 filing single and $2,569 if filing married.
http://www.tax.ok.gov/it2006/511-PKT-06.pdf
Oklahoma also voted this past year to lower state income tax to 4.75% from 5.25% over a phased number of years.
Taking those last numbers into consideration, I would basically be about where I am right now. No state tax and high property taxes in Texas, or a state tax with lower property taxes in Oklahoma.
I often wonder why all of these relocation calculators that are in abundance on the Internet don't take into consideration property taxes and state taxes (or the lack of) in their formulas.
Essentially all they look at are home costs and other factors, such as food and medical costs. I realize you might have to plug in a few numbers, but those two variables alone can make a lot of difference, although not in my case.
And by the way, the bankrate.com cost of living calculator says that "total energy costs" are more in Tulsa than in Texas where we have some of the highest electric rates in the country? I don't trust those numbers..
Sauerkraut, we need to take up a fund of some sort and get you out of the cold. Anyone that likes 100+ temps with lows of 85 at night doesn't belong up in Ohio! [:)]
quote:
Originally posted by recyclemichael
Your numbers are way off.
According to this year's tax form, A person making $50,000 (after the many deductions allowed) would pay $2,825 filing single and $2,569 if filing married.
http://www.tax.ok.gov/it2006/511-PKT-06.pdf
Oklahoma also voted this past year to lower state income tax to 4.75% from 5.25% over a phased number of years.
OK that's good news. Most of the time taxes up,-not down. I was going by the tax table in back of the 2005 Oklahoma full-year resident income tax booklet. The tax tables stop at $50,000. Those numbers that I posted came right from the booklet.
I'm stuck in Ohio due to my job. I make alot of money currently. I am sorry I left Texas in 1990 after my divorce. If I had to do it over I'd have stayed. Anyhoo, I do plan to retire in Phoenix, or Las Vegas. From the "Places Rated Almanac" it says that Dallas has 40 days a year with temps below 32 degrees, and 100 days a year of temps 90 and above with 138 clear days and 90 partly cloudy....Tulsa is alot colder they have 80 days of temps 32 and below and only 70 days with 90 and above.... Austin/San Marcos TX has 110 days above 90 degrees and 21 days below 32.... San Antonio has 111 days with temps of 90 & above and 21 days days below 32 degrees. Not much better than Dallas.... Phoenix beats them all, in Phoenix they have 170 days a year of temps above 90 and only 10 days with temps below 32.. Climate is not everything but it does play a big part on lifestyle and where to move to. It's no wonder Phoenix is the fastest growing city in the USA! But you also need a job and crime rates play a part too.
http://www.nbc5i.com/news/11350906/detail.html?dl=mainclick
R.I.P. You will be missed.
I've been following the Corporal Nix story MH, and it is sad. It seems that over the last year, about once every two months a Dallas Police Officer dies in the line of duty. I know the fraternity of police is a tight-knit one, regardless of location. My heart goes out to this young man's family, friends, and fellow Police Officers.
quote:
Originally posted by sauerkraut
... Phoenix beats them all, in Phoenix they have 170 days a year of temps above 90 and only 10 days with temps below 32.. Climate is not everything but it does play a big part on lifestyle and where to move to. It's no wonder Phoenix is the fastest growing city in the USA! But you also need a job and crime rates play a part too.
In my opinion, Phoenix and Las Vegas have absolutely no logical reason to even exist, except for maybe golf and gambling. 120 degree summer days and 85-90 degree nights is my idea of hell on earth. 4,000,000+ people living in the middle of the desert is just plain crazy. I think both of these cities are on an eventual crash course in the future due to looming water supply problems and rising energy costs. Both of these cities (and California) are sucking the Colorado river dry with their insatiable appetite for water. They can in no way sustain their recent growth for much longer.
quote:
Originally posted by Steve
quote:
Originally posted by sauerkraut
... Phoenix beats them all, in Phoenix they have 170 days a year of temps above 90 and only 10 days with temps below 32.. Climate is not everything but it does play a big part on lifestyle and where to move to. It's no wonder Phoenix is the fastest growing city in the USA! But you also need a job and crime rates play a part too.
In my opinion, Phoenix and Las Vegas have absolutely no logical reason to even exist, except for maybe golf and gambling. 120 degree summer days and 85-90 degree nights is my idea of hell on earth. 4,000,000+ people living in the middle of the desert is just plain crazy. I think both of these cities are on an eventual crash course in the future due to looming water supply problems and rising energy costs. Both of these cities (and California) are sucking the Colorado river dry with their insatiable appetite for water. They can in no way sustain their recent growth for much longer.
Have you ever been in Las Vegas or Phoenix? I have and I love it. They are our fastest growing cities. 4 million people can't be wrong. Nevada and Arizona are two of our fastest growing states. Not too many people are moving to Fargo, N.D. are they? I wonder why, and Some Alaska town near Fairbanks is/was offering free land if you move there, looks like not too many people want to live in the cold otherwise they would not have to make such a offer. It gets to -70 below Zero in Alaska. No Thanks, that's not for me. Give me 120 degrees in the shade in Phoenix, Arizona any day over that cold stuff.[:)]
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Originally posted by sauerkraut
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Originally posted by Steve
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Originally posted by sauerkraut
... Phoenix beats them all, in Phoenix they have 170 days a year of temps above 90 and only 10 days with temps below 32.. Climate is not everything but it does play a big part on lifestyle and where to move to. It's no wonder Phoenix is the fastest growing city in the USA! But you also need a job and crime rates play a part too.
In my opinion, Phoenix and Las Vegas have absolutely no logical reason to even exist, except for maybe golf and gambling. 120 degree summer days and 85-90 degree nights is my idea of hell on earth. 4,000,000+ people living in the middle of the desert is just plain crazy. I think both of these cities are on an eventual crash course in the future due to looming water supply problems and rising energy costs. Both of these cities (and California) are sucking the Colorado river dry with their insatiable appetite for water. They can in no way sustain their recent growth for much longer.
Have you ever been in Las Vegas or Phoenix? I have and I love it. They are our fastest growing cities. 4 million people can't be wrong. Nevada and Arizona are two of our fastest growing states. Not too many people are moving to Fargo, N.D. are they? I wonder why, and Some Alaska town near Fairbanks is/was offering free land if you move there, looks like not too many people want to live in the cold otherwise they would not have to make such a offer. It gets to -70 below Zero in Alaska. No Thanks, that's not for me. Give me 120 degrees in the shade in Phoenix, Arizona any day over that cold stuff.[:)]
I live in Phoenix, and Steve brings up some valid points. There is a big stuggle for the sharing of the Colorado River water, and when they don't get suuficient snow in Utah and Colorado it puts a strain on the system. We took a week vacation with friends last year to Lake Powell for a week on a house boat. Powell was at about 60% capacity. That's why the cities encourage xeriscaping with plants that are native and require less water. Urban sprawl? Here is an example; The Town of Gilbert where I work had a population of about 90,000 in 1998 when I moved to Phoenix from Tulsa. Gilbert now has a population of 200,000 residents. Utility problems? our house is 2200 sqft the electric bill on an equal pay plan is $258.00/month,(no pool) natural gas is $65.00/month. Groceries and such are not that much more than Tulsa. Crime? yes we have crime. What city doesn't? Will have to see if I can get some specifics for the Valley to provide real numbers. Not very many days are 120+ during the summer, but it is not un common for the high to be 118 and then at 10pm it's still 107. That's why we go to Southern California to vacation in the summer, or take a 3 day weekend and go up to northern parts of the state. The big problem now is the smog and dust. Where we live in North Phoenix, about 15 miles from downtown, we are just outside of the metro area and up higher than the valley floor, so when we drive into downtown we can see the brown cloud as we go into town.
Traffic? My commute is 38 miles one way,(MY choice and not complaining about)and it takes an hour each way. But if it rains? add 20 to 40 minutes to that.
Taxes: The property tax on our house for 2006 is about $2100. We bought it for $154k in 1998.
Our state income tax for 2005 was about $1200.00 for a joint income of $98k.
Sales tax in Phoenix is 7.815%, and if you smoke cigarettes are $5.70 per pack.
Current gas prices are $2.70/gal.
I do miss the change of season, altough when spring training ends the snow birds start to head back north that is the sign that summer will soon be here.
Best months October thru March.