What would you like to see contructed in the Sand Springs Keystone Corridor?
What is the Keystone Corridor? One can imagine, but I really don't know.
The area in Sand Springs between Hwy 97 on the West, Adams Road on the East, Morrow Road on the South and First Street on the North. It was a blighted area that was recently cleared using Vision 2025 money and is slated for redevelopment into a retail and commercial center, but nobody has said what stores will be built there. Any ideas or suggestions?
Here's an aerial of the area with surrounding areas as well.
(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1072/525177781_a54adc6420.jpg?v=0)
Second Try!
(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1072/525177781_4f6bc9890e_o.jpg)
It is a boulevard of broken dreams.
Behind schedule - Building was originally supposed to begin this spring.
So far:
Acquiring the land cost more than it should have.
Utility relocation has yet to begin.
Developer is dragging his feet.
No potential tenants lined up.
Street improvements haven't even begun the design phase.
That little property just above the words Morrow Road in that picture is my Sand Springs Recycling Center!
quote:
Originally posted by recyclemichael
That little property just above the words Morrow Road in that picture is my Sand Springs Recycling Center!
I use it often.
I just wish curbside recycling was available.
http://www.ci.sand-springs.ok.us/shell.asp?pg=103
quote:
Originally posted by breitee
The area in Sand Springs between Hwy 97 on the West, Adams Road on the East, Morrow Road on the South and First Street on the North. It was a blighted area that was recently cleared using Vision 2025 money and is slated for redevelopment into a retail and commercial center, but nobody has said what stores will be built there. Any ideas or suggestions?
I was told it was a future location for a Home Depot and others..?
According to the city newsletter the new name for the corridor area is River City Crossing. city leaders have just returned from Las Vegas with unnamed prospects for anchors of the delvelopment.
Bells part II
New signs have gone up in "River City Crossing". What would you like to see built there?
Anybody have any new information on the progress (or lack of) development of this project. Is the city using the same company that is "improving" the Keystone Expressway?
quote:
Originally posted by breitee
Anybody have any new information on the progress (or lack of) development of this project. Is the city using the same company that is "improving" the Keystone Expressway?
They are having trouble getting parties interested in putting stores/restaurants in there. Rumor has it that the developer is asking outrageous prices.
At least that is what I have been told.
It's not the perfect storm type site and the market for retail expansion is about to shrival up like a ....never mind.
Sand Springs had some tremendous volume stores....back in the 60's.
quote:
Originally posted by FOTD
It's not the perfect storm type site and the market for retail expansion is about to shrival up like a ....never mind.
Sand Springs had some tremendous volume stores....back in the 60's.
So it will remain no mans land for the forseeable future. Great! One step forward, two steps back.
I did not say that. Sheeesh, no retail and that makes it no man's land?
I like Sand Springs. Close to the lakes, no traffic and goat hill.
One day, it's places like Sand Springs people will want to live.....peace, quiet, and nature.
I like Sand Springs too. I live there. I just want to see some progress instead of promises.
Any word on whats going on here?
Not a damn thing. It is a muddy sea of weeds. The city keeps promising us some news but we never hear anything. The latest is that they are still conducting "tests" to determine if the land is contaminated from the old Federated smelter that used to be where the Wal-Mart supercenter is now. Meanwhile, Tulsa Hills is almost completed while the city sits on their donkey and lets the business and commercial world go by.
quote:
Originally posted by breitee
Not a damn thing. It is a muddy sea of weeds. The city keeps promising us some news but we never hear anything. The latest is that they are still conducting "tests" to determine if the land is contaminated from the old Federated smelter that used to be where the Wal-Mart supercenter is now. Meanwhile, Tulsa Hills is almost completed while the city sits on their donkey and lets the business and commercial world go by.
That is one of the reasons we left Sand Springs. The city leadership doesn't really seem interested in moving the city forward.
They pay a lot of lip service to it...but actions speak louder than words.
Latest update (//%22http://tulsabusiness.com/article.asp?aID=43852777.8358471.613704.4599081.8479179.340&aID2=47199%22).
They can hope in one hand and crap in the other. Which one do you think will get filled first?
Since then, the property has sat vacant.
That speaks volumes about the lack of vision and leadership in SS.
They have a neat little downtown. I wish they would have focused on that first, THEN connected it to the river. I could see their downtown being a kind of downtown Eureka Springs, artsy shops, getaway, type place and they could really have done a lot to push that along. They just dont have the draw yet to try and do what they are wanting done. Rather than trying to build a large new, same ol same ol area. They should have capitalized on what they have, grown that and created something funky, truly unique to the area, and very desirable. We are gonna have enough "clean new village shopping" type places in the area. To have something real like they could have done would have been great. Ya just want to smack people sometimes and yell "What are you thinking?!" lol
I have to agree with everything TheArtist said, and I want to add that though I don't live "near" sand springs, living on the edge of downtown I have to say I would much rather go to Sand Springs for a weekend getaway then say Jenks. But as it is right now there is nothing to do unless your idea of fun is going to Wal Mart.
Anyway it would be nice if groups like the Charles Page Foundation spread their wings a bit and expanded their services into not just the improvement of the less fortunate and battered women but to also help improve SS by commercial development. Which at the end of the day would end up helping the people they are already helping thus not leaving there core mission. They own allot of land lots of it is vacant or unused might be a good time to see to the right developers, will not only spuere development but will also help mine there budgets with a much needed injection of cash.
Kind of funny but part of their problem downtown is the same as ours, they have allot of I can't call them homeless in this case but they have plenty of less fortunate people around walking between the different services. Though I have to say they have a great work program but alas that's not the point.
Somewhere the peoples vision is being lost on their leaders and they need to do something about it.
Either way I look forward to any development in Sand Springs.
Whenever I go to St. Louis, for instance, I am blown away by how their burbs keep growing. Tulsa is behind them in development for sure. Sounds strange to say given all the construction everywhere. What my point is, people live and shop within their communities when the means is available to them. Each community in St. Louis has a major shopping mall nearby as well as some special attraction to draw in the surrounding communities. We have one indoor mall I believe, Woodland Hills, and Sand Springs, Bixby, Owasso, Collinsville, Broken Arrow , Jenks and on and on all have to drive and cram 71st street to go to an indoor mall. Hey developers, if you build it in their community they will spend their money there.
Sand Springs was expecting passage of some sort of river development that would allow them to build a low water dam and feed off the momentum of the convergence of river development, the extension of main street retail and removal of the city's only slums and decrepit industrial sites. All they got out of it was the removal of the low income neighborhood and industrial sites. Not sure you can blame their leaders for lack of action though. Without a focal point and a willing sugar daddy, they sort of lost traction. The question is who has the money AND the interest in building a RiverWalk type center in Sand Springs? Where's the SS Home when you need them?
quote:
Originally posted by waterboy
Sand Springs was expecting passage of some sort of river development that would allow them to build a low water dam and feed off the momentum of the convergence of river development, the extension of main street retail and removal of the city's only slums and decrepit industrial sites. All they got out of it was the removal of the low income neighborhood and industrial sites. Not sure you can blame their leaders for lack of action though. Without a focal point and a willing sugar daddy, they sort of lost traction. The question is who has the money AND the interest in building a RiverWalk type center in Sand Springs? Where's the SS Home when you need them?
But why whould you want to build in Sand Springs? One chooses, from many options, where to build. If you have the money, you look around and go.... Hmmm, where is everyone going? A business needs eyeballs and traffic to have a chance at making money. What are the development trends, what direction is development now heading thus may continue to go in the future? Whats area is going to be the safest bet for my hard work and money?. You sure as heck dont want to lose your shirt. Every development is a risk. Even the RiverWalk in Jenks with its fantastic growth and demographic area. So why Sand Springs versus plenty of other places?
Sand Springs is seeing some new housing growth. Not quite enough yet to spur a new "directional or area" trend. It could see a good growth spurt, or it could continue to meander along. Creating a funky, interesting downtown and or creating some sort of image for themselves, could be one way to get that little bit of extra attention they need and get things to take off.
Does sound a lot like Tulsa in many ways lol.
Because not everyone has the same tastes as risk averse businessmen and developers I guess. I also love the downtown SS feeling and would like to see them expand on it. Things can still progress without the proposed low water dam being in place. In fact it might be better without the dam. Jenks certainly has leveraged their never materialized dam into action.
Since they made such a large swath of land available and actually have a pretty good plan I am just surprised that no one, namely the SS home foundation, has stepped up to keep things moving. Many people are not aware of how much influence they have and how much land they control in SS.
Still no word on this project?
It is still a sea of mud and weeds. The city keeps promising big things but nothing happens. In the meantime Tulsa Hills is open and getting all the west side business. Way to go Sand Springs "leaders". Continue on your path to mediocrity.
I can understand your frustration with this, but city leaders can't make the minds up for potential developers. If the demographics, market trends, and pops aren't there at the moment, it would be foolish to build there. What's the other alternative? Jack Sand Springs' sales tax rate again and start building blindly?
I think the big retail developers are going to be tepid to commit to any major projects in the next year, as retail numbers are not expanding at a geat rate this year. Higher steel and fuel prices aren't helping that picture either. It's a good piece of property and I'm sure something good will come of it, just not in the next year.
City leaders in Sand Springs. Oh man that is comedy gold!
That good ol boy network that runs that town is so entrenched that it would take a nuke to blast them out of the rut they are in.
I mean they do have a councilman who's claim to fame is that he played for Henry Iba at OSU, but I've never really understood how that helps with city government. Helped him get elected though.
Any word on what is going to be the anchor store fro this project?
No, it is "confidential". Also known as bull**** on a platter.
quote:
Originally posted by roscoe
Any word on what is going to be the anchor store fro this project?
Knowing the leadership in Sand Springs it will either be a Big Lots or a Cheapo Depot.
There was a big story in WSJ yesterday about Steve & Barry's one of the faster-growing mall retailers. Pretty interesting insight into the payola required of the landlord to get a major anchor and attract smaller stores.
This is simply not a good time for retail to be expanding. I'm willing to bet the project in Jenks gets shelved for a couple to three more years, due to nervousness over national economics and what the price of gas is doing to retail industries.
I'm usually the last to buy into "sky is falling" rhetoric, but this could be a very brutal year for retail.
Update: http://www.ci.sand-springs.ok.us/news-entry.php?cat=1063&month=7&year=2008&id=1155#entry1155
quote:
Originally posted by Nik
Update: http://www.ci.sand-springs.ok.us/news-entry.php?cat=1063&month=7&year=2008&id=1155#entry1155
More doubletalk bull****!
TO: Media
CONTACT: Douglas Enevoldsen, 246-2502
September 15, 2008
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Lowe's to Anchor River City Crossing Development
A Lowe's home improvement store will anchor Sand Springs' River City Crossing development at Highway 97 and the Sand Springs Expressway.
The 120,000 sq. ft. store will be located on the east end of the development toward Main Street and will face south toward Morrow Road. Other retail stores will continue to fill out the development to the west. Restaurants are expected to occupy several out parcels along Morrow Road.
Site preparation should begin by early 2009, and the center is expected to open in 2010.
Finally some news!
I thought the original intention of this redevelopment plan was to connect main street to the river. I thought they wanted to create a nice, pedestrian friendly, retail/shopping and dining district from the upper part of town down to the river parks area? So far its not sounding as if thats what they are doing. Not bad to have a Lowes if its behind outparcel buildings that are up to the street and sidewalk. But I get the sinking feeling they arent going to have the sense to do that.
Lot of my first generation US/Tulsa relatives used to live in the Sand Springs area. Lot of history there. They were the Morrows, aka Morrow Road. Sand Springs has a lot of potential. Sad to think they will screw this opportunity up by simply placing the buildings in the wrong place to take advantage of the potential this corridor could have.
Sand Springs Lowe's may cause problems for small family business
Last Update: 9/16 9:36 pm
Home improvement giant Lowe's is coming to Sand Springs. The store will anchor a new commercial development. City leaders say the project will bring jobs and added tax revenue to the city, as well as revitalize an area that used be occupied by blighted homes and businesses.
But not everyone is excited about the store. For the past 54 years Morrow-Gill Lumber Company has served residents of Sand Springs. Current owner Victoria Sisney tells 2NEWS, "My dad Dale Morrow started this company and worked here everyday until he was 90. And he was a kind of legend unto himself. He was the mayor of Sand Springs and they named Morrow Road after him."
The new Lowe's store will be built on Morrow, just across the railroad tracks from the lumber company. Sisney hopes her family's business will be able to survive so close to such a large competitor. "It does make you a little bit nervous you know. But God has blessed us here. And if it's his will that we stay, then we will make it. So we're just going to do our best to take care of our customers and hope they keep coming."
City Manager Doug Enevoldsen believes small businesses will survive the competition. He calls the development an asset to Sand Springs. Enevoldsen says, "The Vision 2025 investment came in and help clean up an old blighted neighborhood. And it's going to convert that to a retail shopping and dinning center. And that will literally pay for itself, the investment over multiple years in the future to enhance the Tulsa County tax base."
If Morrow Gill lowers their pricing and beefs up customer service they MIGHT survive, if not, they are DOOMED!
I am happy for Sand Springs.
Getting a Lowe's is a start to commercial growth. It is seen that way in many other communities like Owasso. Lowe's was one of the first retailers on 96th street before the big boom. After Wal-Mart and Lowe's came The Home Depot, Kohl's, Target, Belk, etc.. We will probably see the same here. Broken Arrow is experiencing the same around 71st and the Broken Arrow Expressway. Lowe's opened a several years ago and we are now seeing a Target go up around it as well as some other places. Broken Arrow will probably be seeing a second Lowe's in the future around the Wal-Mart at the Creek Turnpike.
quote:
Originally posted by breitee
Sand Springs Lowe's may cause problems for small family business
Last Update: 9/16 9:36 pm
Home improvement giant Lowe's is coming to Sand Springs. The store will anchor a new commercial development. City leaders say the project will bring jobs and added tax revenue to the city, as well as revitalize an area that used be occupied by blighted homes and businesses.
But not everyone is excited about the store. For the past 54 years Morrow-Gill Lumber Company has served residents of Sand Springs. Current owner Victoria Sisney tells 2NEWS, "My dad Dale Morrow started this company and worked here everyday until he was 90. And he was a kind of legend unto himself. He was the mayor of Sand Springs and they named Morrow Road after him."
The new Lowe's store will be built on Morrow, just across the railroad tracks from the lumber company. Sisney hopes her family's business will be able to survive so close to such a large competitor. "It does make you a little bit nervous you know. But God has blessed us here. And if it's his will that we stay, then we will make it. So we're just going to do our best to take care of our customers and hope they keep coming."
City Manager Doug Enevoldsen believes small businesses will survive the competition. He calls the development an asset to Sand Springs. Enevoldsen says, "The Vision 2025 investment came in and help clean up an old blighted neighborhood. And it's going to convert that to a retail shopping and dinning center. And that will literally pay for itself, the investment over multiple years in the future to enhance the Tulsa County tax base."
If Morrow Gill lowers their pricing and beefs up customer service they MIGHT survive, if not, they are DOOMED!
Morrow Gill is awful. As you said their customer service is bad. Hell last time I was in there, which was some time ago, it was almost like it was a burden when I asked them if they had something and if so where was it located.
That is the other problem. Granted it is a smaller old fashioned style hardware store, but you would think I would have been able to find a brass shut off valve in there. Nope. Had to drive to the Home Depot on Elgin to get what I needed. That seems to happen a lot with various items.
Anyone know what is being built at west 81st and Sand Springs expressway?
quote:
Originally posted by ruaokie2
Anyone know what is being built at west 81st and Sand Springs expressway?
Early Childhood Development Center a.k.a. a Kindergarten.
quote:
Originally posted by wavoka
quote:
Originally posted by ruaokie2
Anyone know what is being built at west 81st and Sand Springs expressway?
Early Childhood Development Center a.k.a. a Kindergarten.
Will this replace the one currently on the NW corner of Hwy 97 & Morrow Rd? I'm assuming they are going to start making room for the Hwy 97 expansion they are supposedly doing in 2011.
From the Tulsa World:
Weak U.S. economy delays Lowe's store in Sand Springs
By MANNY GAMALLO World Staff Writer
11/13/2008
Last Modified: 11/13/2008 4:19 AM
SAND SPRINGS — A souring national economy has forced Lowe's Cos. Inc. to delay construction of a store here by a year, city officials said Wednesday.
According to the officials, the home- improvement chain is still committed to building the 120,000-square-foot store at the east end of the Keystone Corridor redevelopment area, along Main Street facing south onto Morrow Road. But with the economic downturn, the company has decided to delay the project. Completion of the store is now targeted for the fall of 2011.
In September, city officials announced that Mooresville, N.C.-based Lowe's would locate in Sand Springs, with construction beginning in the fall of 2009 and a completion the following year.
The retailer would be the "anchor store" for what is being called the River City Crossing shopping plaza. Other smaller retail operations, including restaurants, were to follow.
Two months ago, when the Lowe's project was announced, city leaders had expected to have other retailers sign up by year's end. However, now that Lowe's has announced its delay, officials don't expect those smaller retailers to announce their intentions until later next year.
Site preparation and construction of the
store has been estimated at $40 million.
Once the shopping plaza is fully developed, it is expected to generate around $1.75 million in annual sales tax for the city.
The 30-acre River City Crossing site is an outgrowth of the Keystone Corridor revitalization project.
Five years ago, Tulsa County voters approved $14.5 million in Vision 2025 funds to buy 180 properties in the Keystone Corridor. From 2004 to 2007, officials bought and demolished blighted properties in the corridor.
City Manager Douglas Enevoldsen said the Lowe's delay was disappointing but not surprising.
The national economy has forced other retailers in Tulsa and Oklahoma City to pull back on their development plans.
"We're not an island," Enevoldsen said.
Can't say I'm not surprised. Still disappointed it took as long as it did to get the Lowe's announcement.
I'd like to see a extention of the jogging trail, but that would have to be done so that trail users won't have to cross any streets. The trail system could be tied in to the Tulsa Trails. SandSprings has some trails but they have street crossings.
They should really think of this area as an extension to downtown Tulsa and think high density. Sand Springs has so much potential and they haven't even come close to realizing it's full potential. Sand Springs seems to be going in reverse.
Might be getting off subject here, but I don't know how the mayoral election is shaping up for Sand Springs but if the current Mayor is rerunning, he will not be getting my back. Having lived in Sand Springs for over three years now, I have to ask myself what improvements have I seen in the city in those three years. Even to make it easier, what changes have I seen. Nothing. Lights on Hwy 97. That's it. No more commercial development. No additional retail or restaurants. By far the worst Tulsa suburb, which is sad given its proximity to Tulsa. Its closer to downtown than probably any other suburb.
Quote from: Nik on June 01, 2009, 10:33:37 AM
Might be getting off subject here, but I don't know how the mayoral election is shaping up for Sand Springs but if the current Mayor is rerunning, he will not be getting my back. Having lived in Sand Springs for over three years now, I have to ask myself what improvements have I seen in the city in those three years. Even to make it easier, what changes have I seen. Nothing. Lights on Hwy 97. That's it. No more commercial development. No additional retail or restaurants. By far the worst Tulsa suburb, which is sad given its proximity to Tulsa. Its closer to downtown than probably any other suburb.
The Mayor is SS is a figurehead. The real problem is the City Council. Might as well have the Three Stooges, The Marx Brothers and the Keystone Cops running the city.
Quote from: Nik on June 01, 2009, 10:33:37 AM
Might be getting off subject here, but I don't know how the mayoral election is shaping up for Sand Springs but if the current Mayor is rerunning, he will not be getting my back. Having lived in Sand Springs for over three years now, I have to ask myself what improvements have I seen in the city in those three years. Even to make it easier, what changes have I seen. Nothing. Lights on Hwy 97. That's it. No more commercial development. No additional retail or restaurants. By far the worst Tulsa suburb, which is sad given its proximity to Tulsa. Its closer to downtown than probably any other suburb.
As far as proximity to downtown/midtown, natural beauty with the river on one side and hills to the north and south, and proximity to lakes Keystone and Skiatook, it would
seem that Sand Springs is in a great position for explosive growth like Jenks, Glenpool, Owasso, or BA. Yet it's not, why? Lack of retail and restaurants is part of it, and wouldn't be an issue if downtown were more developed. Also the schools there aren't as good as the other suburbs. And there is a blue collar 'industrial' stigma to that town that may turn people off. That area always sorta reminded me of Pittsburgh or Cincinnati, industry along the river with steep, forested hills.. I'd rather live there than in former flood plain farms and ranches that you find new neighborhoods being built in Bixby and Broken Arrow, but that's me.
Part of it is just that developers are like a bunch of lemmings, they just follow each other. Its easier to do so.
I wouldnt really say that having a lot of retail was why people are moving to Jenks and Glenpool. The herd is moving that way so developers know its a fairly safe bet. The rooftop trend heads that way, the retail developments start moving in and the cycle reinforces itself from there.
As for schools, Glenpool isnt known for having great schools. looking at their old test score averages, they suck. But as new, upwardly mobile families and their kids move in, the scores are going to shoot up.
SS is trying to be a typical suburb, but really cant be for several reasons. The herd isnt moving in that direction so they need a special "catch" to make them unique. Their downtown and some older neighborhoods had great bones to be the bucolic, ideal, quaint town that suburbanites so long for. But they havent capitalized on that or tried to extend that with the new development going down to the river. Instead the new same ol same ol development destroys that potential and is creating a lame atmosphere for the city. It could have also been a more artsy, Eureka Springs, resort type place. Its always been interesting to me that although its very close to Tulsa, it has the feel of being,,, some place else. A get away type place. Hilly, rocky, river, big trees, quaint downtown,,, so much potential to be something unique. Yet everything they do is bleh. Pedestrian friendly should be their mantra, not please please please let us have a strip mall. That will just reinforce any average/blue collar image it has and not build up that "special place" image it could really capture.
Besides lethargic, myopic leadership, SS has other elements not discussed. They have a blue collar image because...there is a huge foundry right at the crossroads of 97 and 64, just South of their downtown. That is a building that has the same impact on development as the Sunoco refinery at 11th street. Secondly, the SS Home, a foundation set up by the city's founder, controls large quantities of developable land. All the locals are familiar with the political power of the "home". And lastly, there are mining companies who lust after the minerals in those lovely hills. They want to blast them, mine them and leave them.
Artist you can't just blame it on lemming behavior or simplistic statements about building not trending that way. There is plenty of quality development in the hills North of SS around the casino, Shell Creek, the airport etc. When you talk about movements of rooftops, it is because those flat, flood prone areas by Owasso, Glenpool and Jenks are easier to build on than hilly beautiful landscapes AND those flat communities are more responsive to development than a foundation. Note the similarity of the SS Home Foundation to such organizations as TDA in Tulsa who also have held on to properties for years with little incentive to develop them.
As I pointed out in the "tale of two cities" thread you ignored, this leadership is excited about taking land that is similarly situated as the Jenks shopping centers and anxiously looking forward to using it as "a first rate Industrial Park". There is something wrong when land with a nearby highway, proximity to Downtown Tulsa, infrastructure, utilities and lake shore frontage with great vistas doesn't attract first rate development. It simply isn't being marketed well. Perhaps because the entities I've described, don't care to see quality development.
So,with the steel mill closing would it make better sense to move this project to that location? Just think how much river development you could have from this location.just me think out loud...