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Talk About Tulsa => Other Tulsa Discussion => Topic started by: Trams on September 13, 2007, 09:24:56 PM

Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Trams on September 13, 2007, 09:24:56 PM
We have a new Panel.  A panel designed to address "street needs."  Where is this going?

===================
Mayor, councilor announce panel to review street needs

By World Staff
9/13/2007  3:15 PM

Mayor Kathy Taylor and Councilor Bill Martinson on Thursday announced the formation of a panel that will look at how the city can best plan, fund and contract needed street repairs.

Dewey Bartlett Jr. and Sharon King Davis will lead the panel, which is expected to deliver a report by Dec. 1.

Taylor stopped short of saying that it is the first step toward putting together a streets tax package to send to voters.

"I think that's putting the cart before the horse," she said. "We have to look at all funding options that are available to us."

===================
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: cannon_fodder on September 14, 2007, 08:29:53 AM
lol, another tax proposal... this should go over well.

Street Needs:
1) Smooth
2) Convenient Traffic Flow
3) Preferably goes somewhere useful.

And there we have it!  No need to fund another panel.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Conan71 on September 14, 2007, 09:09:35 AM
Call me obtuse, but I always figured that street maintenance was a part of the annual budget of our city and there were supposed to be existing revenue streams to cover the costs.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: CitizenJulie on September 14, 2007, 09:16:18 AM
You're obtuse.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on September 14, 2007, 09:47:04 AM
I thought Conan was acute..

(note to self, no more math jokes)
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Sangria on September 14, 2007, 12:09:12 PM
Maybe they will figure out a reason why the entire county should pay to fix the city streets.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: izmophonik on September 14, 2007, 12:24:07 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Sangria

Maybe they will figure out a reason why the entire county should pay to fix the city streets.


because a vast amount of people that live in the county work in Tulsa.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on September 14, 2007, 02:14:34 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Sangria

Maybe they will figure out a reason why the entire county should pay to fix the city streets.



Because a large portion of the taxes the county collects are from city residents?
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Ed W on September 14, 2007, 09:07:33 PM
quote:
Originally posted by cannon_fodder


Street Needs:
1) Smooth
2) Convenient Traffic Flow
3) Preferably goes somewhere useful.



That's a starting point, though overly simplified.  This panel should address the needs of cyclists, pedestrians, and wheelchair users as well as motorists because the streets belong to all of us, not just motorized users.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sauerkraut on September 15, 2007, 08:28:59 AM
I thoght this topic was about "street people", and the needs of "street people" not about roads & streets.[:O]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: cannon_fodder on September 17, 2007, 08:14:13 AM
I'd like my street people to be smooth, not hinder traffic flow, and to go somewhere useful too.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Breadburner on September 17, 2007, 09:12:25 AM
That panel is a joke.....We need a street commisioner....And not some joker appointed by the Mayor....
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: tulsa1603 on September 17, 2007, 10:35:43 AM
I think the panel needs to figure out a way to get more money out of the state for some of the highways around town....The IDL is in horrendous condition.  Huge potholes all over the place, bridges with concrete crumbling to expose rebar (the stuff weakens when it's exposed and rusts).  This extends on down the BA to the 15th street and 21st Street bridges.  Absolutley scary looking.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Townsend on September 17, 2007, 10:44:08 AM
quote:
Originally posted by tulsa1603

I think the panel needs to figure out a way to get more money out of the state for some of the highways around town....The IDL is in horrendous condition.  Huge potholes all over the place, bridges with concrete crumbling to expose rebar (the stuff weakens when it's exposed and rusts).  This extends on down the BA to the 15th street and 21st Street bridges.  Absolutley scary looking.



Excellent idea.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on September 17, 2007, 10:48:09 AM
quote:
Originally posted by tulsa1603

I think the panel needs to figure out a way to get more money out of the state for some of the highways around town....The IDL is in horrendous condition.  Huge potholes all over the place, bridges with concrete crumbling to expose rebar (the stuff weakens when it's exposed and rusts).  This extends on down the BA to the 15th street and 21st Street bridges.  Absolutley scary looking.



(http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/489111/2/istockphoto_489111_you_win_vector_illustration.jpg)
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: rwarn17588 on September 17, 2007, 11:35:07 AM
Who is responsible for the IDL's maintenance: city, state or federal, or all of the above?
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: carltonplace on September 17, 2007, 11:50:09 AM
I75 and I244 both interstates should receive both state and federal funds for improvements. ODOT is responsible for maintenance of the whole thing.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Conan71 on September 17, 2007, 11:57:50 AM
quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle

I thought Conan was acute..

(note to self, no more math jokes)



Well I was acute kid according to my mother.  But as I've gotten older, adopted poor eating habits, and become more sedentary, I've become somewhat obtuse. [:P]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: swake on September 17, 2007, 12:36:04 PM
The whole IDL is Interstate highways, I-244 and I-444. The US-75 section is actually I-444 but there are no signs to mark it as such.  

The state is the responsible party using federal and state funds to maintain the highway.

I would like to then nominate the I-44 and US-75 interchange as the second worst maintained section of road in the metro.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: HazMatCFO on September 17, 2007, 09:52:57 PM
Gimmick to soothe some of the voters concerns about too much focus on the river as opposed to streets.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Rico on September 17, 2007, 10:17:44 PM
quote:
Originally posted by HazMatCFO

Gimmick to soothe some of the voters concerns about too much focus on the river as opposed to streets.



Exactly.... But I have to wonder why it is such a transparent attempt...

Is this a way of calming the "anti-river tax" folks.. or the accidental discharge of a warning flare.

 [}:)]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Double A on September 17, 2007, 10:25:28 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rico

quote:
Originally posted by HazMatCFO

Gimmick to soothe some of the voters concerns about too much focus on the river as opposed to streets.



Exactly.... But I have to wonder why it is such a transparent attempt...

Is this a way of calming the "anti-river tax" folks.. or the accidental discharge of a warning flare.

 [}:)]


A little from column A, a little from column B.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Conan71 on September 18, 2007, 09:33:50 AM
quote:
Originally posted by swake

The whole IDL is Interstate highways, I-244 and I-444. The US-75 section is actually I-444 but there are no signs to mark it as such.  

The state is the responsible party using federal and state funds to maintain the highway.

I would like to then nominate the I-44 and US-75 interchange as the second worst maintained section of road in the metro.




I actually saw a road repair crew working on the 75 to BA transition ramp at the river yesterday.  Two guys with shovels full of asphalt tossing it into the holes as cars whizzed past.

By the time I went over the ramp again at rush hour, instead of holes we now have speed bumps.

Great job fellas! [xx(]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: PonderInc on October 02, 2007, 05:38:45 PM
I noticed that the street repair panel includes a committee dedicated to "Smart Urban Design."  This is important b/c it means the city is beginning to understand the impact of urban design on street maintenance/infrastructure costs.  (ie: good urban design reduces auto traffic, increases pedestrian/bicycle/mass transit use, reduces wear and tear on roads, reduces $$ to repair roads...)

Exciting news!  (And, I think, in no small part due to TulsaNow and others who have been promoting smart urban design for years.)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=071002_1_A1_spanc11578
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Rico on October 02, 2007, 06:08:32 PM
quote:
Originally posted by PonderInc

I noticed that the street repair panel includes a committee dedicated to "Smart Urban Design."  This is important b/c it means the city is beginning to understand the impact of urban design on street maintenance/infrastructure costs.  (ie: good urban design reduces auto traffic, increases pedestrian/bicycle/mass transit use, reduces wear and tear on roads, reduces $$ to repair roads...)

Exciting news!  (And, I think, in no small part due to TulsaNow and others who have been promoting smart urban design for years.)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=071002_1_A1_spanc11578




Wishful thinking.... Just because you say a panel will address "Smart Urban Design" does not make it so.

Case in point "Urban Design WalMart"....

I don't think you want us to thank TulsaNow for this one...?

Not that I don't think the folks that have investments in Jenks wouldn't like Tulsa to drive less.... As long as they can still drive to Jenks to spend their money..
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: TheArtist on October 02, 2007, 06:37:23 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rico

quote:
Originally posted by PonderInc

I noticed that the street repair panel includes a committee dedicated to "Smart Urban Design."  This is important b/c it means the city is beginning to understand the impact of urban design on street maintenance/infrastructure costs.  (ie: good urban design reduces auto traffic, increases pedestrian/bicycle/mass transit use, reduces wear and tear on roads, reduces $$ to repair roads...)

Exciting news!  (And, I think, in no small part due to TulsaNow and others who have been promoting smart urban design for years.)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=071002_1_A1_spanc11578




Wishful thinking.... Just because you say a panel will address "Smart Urban Design" does not make it so.

Case in point "Urban Design WalMart"....

I don't think you want us to thank TulsaNow for this one...?

Not that I don't think the folks that have investments in Jenks wouldn't like Tulsa to drive less.... As long as they can still drive to Jenks to spend their money..




Just out of curiosity. Are you involved with any group trying to do something for Tulsa. Volunteer for anything? Everything seems to be an evil incompitent "they" or "them".  If you dont like the way something is or the way its going, get involved and make a difference. Instead of a "they are" it would be nice to hear a "we are" from you just once and quit griping about what everyone else is doing.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Rico on October 02, 2007, 06:44:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by TheArtist

quote:
Originally posted by Rico

quote:
Originally posted by PonderInc

I noticed that the street repair panel includes a committee dedicated to "Smart Urban Design."  This is important b/c it means the city is beginning to understand the impact of urban design on street maintenance/infrastructure costs.  (ie: good urban design reduces auto traffic, increases pedestrian/bicycle/mass transit use, reduces wear and tear on roads, reduces $$ to repair roads...)

Exciting news!  (And, I think, in no small part due to TulsaNow and others who have been promoting smart urban design for years.)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=071002_1_A1_spanc11578




Wishful thinking.... Just because you say a panel will address "Smart Urban Design" does not make it so.

Case in point "Urban Design WalMart"....

I don't think you want us to thank TulsaNow for this one...?

Not that I don't think the folks that have investments in Jenks wouldn't like Tulsa to drive less.... As long as they can still drive to Jenks to spend their money..




Just out of curiosity. Are you involved with any group trying to do something for Tulsa. Volunteer for anything? Everything seems to be an evil incompitent "they" or "them".  If you dont like the way something is or the way its going, get involved and make a difference. Instead of a "they are" it would be nice to hear a "we are" from you just once and quit griping about what everyone else is doing.




Gee thanks Will....

Who would have thought... Anne Landers on TulsaNow
[:O]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on October 02, 2007, 08:34:15 PM
Rico Suave works for the betterment of Tulsa, and like most others who have tried to make a difference, cynicism does tend to get the best of them at times.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Rico on October 02, 2007, 09:19:52 PM
quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle

Rico Suave works for the betterment of Tulsa, and like most others who have tried to make a difference, cynicism does tend to get the best of them at times.





Et tu sgrizzle........ First it was RM that you defrocked.. Now me..[:(]
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on October 03, 2007, 10:54:04 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Rico

quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle

Rico Suave works for the betterment of Tulsa, and like most others who have tried to make a difference, cynicism does tend to get the best of them at times.





Et tu sgrizzle........ First it was RM that you defrocked.. Now me..[:(]




I defrocked you.. and RM?

I was just trying to defend your honor against Le`Arteest.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Rico on October 03, 2007, 11:19:51 AM
quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:
Originally posted by Rico

quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle

Rico Suave works for the betterment of Tulsa, and like most others who have tried to make a difference, cynicism does tend to get the best of them at times.





Et tu sgrizzle........ First it was RM that you defrocked.. Now me..[:(]




I defrocked you.. and RM?

I was just trying to defend your honor against Le`Arteest.

Just kidding amigo...

I doubt either RM or myself were frocked to begin with...

Oh... [:O] that didn't sound quite right.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: RecycleMichael on October 03, 2007, 11:33:20 AM
I have had worse said about me, actually, pretty regularly.

Back to the topic...

I am very interested in the conclusions about the Tulsa street needs. It is a pretty good group of workers and their opinions might carry a lot of sway.

I was a paid campaign staffer back in the eighties for the street commissioner's re-election bid. If there is one thing I learned on the campaign trail is that everybody is a traffic engineer. Everyone thought that traffic would flow better and safer if you just put a stop sign here or timed the lights just so. I can't imagine where the group is going to start on issues like rehabilitation, widening, etc.

What projects get priority will be interesting.

J.D. Metcalfe used to say "It is very difficult to be politically correct, engineeringly sound and perfectly timed".
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: rwarn17588 on October 03, 2007, 11:42:03 AM
One thing the panel should do won't cost any local money -- lean on the state and feds to get busy in fixing the expressways through this town. The 15th Street Bridge on the BA comes to mind.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Sangria on October 03, 2007, 04:39:37 PM
I would love to volunteer to be on the Street decision making pannel - where do I go to volunteer?


All I lack of being one of the River Project beggers is a couple billion dollars and I am there.

Oh, and I have not perfected my kathy Taylor donkey kiss yet.... haven't had time to work on it.

I just don't think this should be made a county concern. If it's worth doing, someone will come up with the money and do it up right and not half assed like only the local governments can do. Just like they did on Jenks.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: TheArtist on October 03, 2007, 09:29:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Sangria

I would love to volunteer to be on the Street decision making pannel - where do I go to volunteer?


All I lack of being one of the River Project beggers is a couple billion dollars and I am there.

Oh, and I have not perfected my kathy Taylor donkey kiss yet.... haven't had time to work on it.

I just don't think this should be made a county concern. If it's worth doing, someone will come up with the money and do it up right and not half assed like only the local governments can do. Just like they did on Jenks.



Usually any project as large as this will have many different issues, questions, task forces, need to organize public meetings, do research, etc. They would probably love to have someone volunteer some time to help with different things. Be aware it will require a big commitment of your time. I would just call some city office and ask around, hopefully someone will know where to send you or to whome to talk to.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: YoungTulsan on October 03, 2007, 10:07:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Sangria


I just don't think this should be made a county concern. If it's worth doing, someone will come up with the money and do it up right and not half assed like only the local governments can do. Just like they did on Jenks.



The panel for street needs is not a county deal.  It is a city deal.  The county has nothing to do with maintainance and repair of streets within Tulsa City Limits.  They take care of the backwoods roads out in the sticks.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: Sangria on October 04, 2007, 05:51:26 AM
Did you see Randi Miller on tv last night?

She said something to the effect: People think this tax is going to pay to fix Tulsa streets. Even if it did , it could not be for 7 years down the road.

Sooooo, one can only assume that this is another temprary tax that will be a burden for the rest of our lives.
Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: swake on October 04, 2007, 08:11:39 AM
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan

quote:
Originally posted by Sangria


I just don't think this should be made a county concern. If it's worth doing, someone will come up with the money and do it up right and not half assed like only the local governments can do. Just like they did on Jenks.



The panel for street needs is not a county deal.  It is a city deal.  The county has nothing to do with maintainance and repair of streets within Tulsa City Limits.  They take care of the backwoods roads out in the sticks.



That's not entirely true, the county also handles streets when they fall on the city limits of two cities, like Memorial between Tulsa and Bixby or Garnett between Tulsa and BA.

Title: Panel for "Street Needs"
Post by: sgrizzle on October 04, 2007, 08:23:52 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Sangria

Did you see Randi Miller on tv last night?

She said something to the effect: People think this tax is going to pay to fix Tulsa streets. Even if it did , it could not be for 7 years down the road.

Sooooo, one can only assume that this is another temprary tax that will be a burden for the rest of our lives.



I don't interpret it that way, I think she is saying either possible overages taken in after 7 years or that is when we will start feeling revenue effects.