Punch To The Gut

[Gaspar]

That's what it feels like. .  .

Lobbyists will be the only ones to know what's in the health or energy bills before they are passed.

A pledge was sent through congress on Tuesday pleading that members read the bills before passage.  Only two members signed it.

The most important, expensive and potentially damaging pieces of legislature in our lifetimes and our representatives won't even agree to read them. 

This congress is officially a joke!

Word has it that they may hire that speed reader again.

[nathanm]

That's what it feels like. .  .

Lobbyists will be the only ones to know what's in the health or energy bills before they are passed.

A pledge was sent through congress on Tuesday pleading that members read the bills before passage.  Only two members signed it.

The most important, expensive and potentially damaging pieces of legislature in our lifetimes and our representatives won't even agree to read them. 

This congress is officially a joke!

Word has it that they may hire that speed reader again.

You act as if Congresspeople (or more realistically, their staff..I doubt it's been physically possible for any sitting congressperson to personally read every bill for a hundred years or more) haven't been not reading bills for at least the last decade and probably much longer.

[Gaspar]

You act as if Congresspeople (or more realistically, their staff..I doubt it's been physically possible for any sitting congressperson to personally read every bill for a hundred years or more) haven't been not reading bills for at least the last decade and probably much longer.

Strange. . .

I seem to be able to get on the library of congress website (Thomas) and read most any bill with the exception of the most recent thousand + pagers.

Call me odd, but I even enjoy going through the yearly supplemental budget bills to pick out nuggets, and they are quite long.  Indexed well, but long.

Before the Thomas system you used to be able to get summaries from the office of your congress person.  Now we seem to have moved past all that.

To assume that bills are simply too long to read is a bit frightening, don't you think?

We elect these people to legislate employing thorough consideration and representative scrutiny.

To say that it's silly for them to have to read the laws, is like saying it's silly for a bus driver to keep his eyes on the road.

[Conan71]

Gaspar, some people are simply satisfied to sit around and let government happen to them.

[Gaspar]

Gaspar, some people are simply satisfied to sit around and let government happen to them.

So, this is the equivalent of a congressional Roofie?

I fear that we're going to be sore in the morning.

[cannon_fodder]

I largely agree Gas.  I don't know if this legislation is good or bad. . . it is too complex for me to "get a feel for" and there is no way I can read it all.  And EVEN IF I was able to read it, I still probably wouldn't be able to figure it out and/or know how the agencies in charge of implementing it will actually do so. 

Thus, I have to rely on my representatives to do so for me.  Who won't read it.  90% of whom will just follow the thumb of the party whip . . . who probably hasn't read the the bill either.

Yay for a two party system!

[nathanm]

To say that it's silly for them to have to read the laws, is like saying it's silly for a bus driver to keep his eyes on the road.

No, I'd much prefer they read all the bills personally. I was saying that it's silly for you to expect them to given the massive volume. It's simply not physically possible to thoroughly read every page of every bill and still have time left over for bodily functions, much less the other responsibilities that come with being a Congressperson.

That's why they have staff. Hopefully the staff are reading the bills. If not, the Congressperson ought to be fired. But again, I don't expect a Congressperson to read every bill any more than I expect a CEO to read every purchase order or sales contract.

[cannon_fodder]

I expect a CEO to reach each document he personally signs.   Congressmen vote on bills personally.  Thus, I would expect them to read them.

I agree that practically that is nearly impossible.  However, if legislation wasn't 1200 pages long with 1,000 specific earmarks, provisions, take backs, alterations, and other unrelated crap stuck it . . . it would be possible.  It will take a speed reader 9 hours to read this stupid thing with 34 seconds per page.  That's absurd.

Since all legal writing, particularly legislation,  follows certain rules of construction and important among them is the interplay between sections; it is the entirety of the document which makes the law.  You can not know in detail what passage 1002(A)5(b)1.2ii means unless you have read the preceding sections.  How far back you have to go depends on the situation.

IN essence, this means no one actually knows what this new law will mean or how it will, or should be interpreted.

[Cats Cats Cats]

It is pretty crazy to have all this crap nobody reads (except for lobbyists) getting passed.  Esp important documents like the Patriot Act, etc.  These are probably the single most important bills of the next 100 years.

[Conan71]

Big group hug, I think we are all in agreement.

Now read the bucking bill, Mr./Ms. Congressman/Senator

[guido911]

I wonder how this guy really feels about crap and slave: