Interesting USA Today Story

[Gaspar]

Why is it when someone is pictured with an Obama poster over their head . . .

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-06-10-ohio-lethal-injection_N.htm?csp=34

Do you get a free Che Guevara poster with every Obama poster?

I keep seeing photos of people in Obama campaign headquarters with Guevara posters.  Why is this?

Makes you think.

I don't think Obama would like to be pictured next to one of the most brutal killers in history?

Must be some kind of Right-Wing media conspiracy.  Yeah that's it.

[Gaspar]

This is his Houston office.

[Gaspar]

I do like the new posters though. . . I mean from an artistic perspective!

[tim huntzinger]

I thought Obama was more Maoist than Marxist, but then the proof is in the puddin.  Wonder how many Reagan posters are up in McCain offices? Goldwater? Lincoln? Uncle Ho? Even if the Obamites do not know exactly what they mean, at least they are idealistic.

In my campaign offices, I would want to show support for gun rights:

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by tim huntzinger

I thought Obama was more Maoist than Marxist, but then the proof is in the puddin.  Wonder how many Reagan posters are up in McCain offices? Goldwater? Lincoln? Uncle Ho? Even if the Obamites do not know exactly what they mean, at least they are idealistic.

In my campaign offices, I would want to show support for gun rights:

Good flick!

[cannon_fodder]

quote:Originally posted by tim huntzinger

at least they are idealistic.

Hitler was an idealist too...  I didn't share his ideals, but he had a strong vision.  (half in jest, half to show that just having ideals is not always a good trait of itself)

The vast majority of people who espouse the greatness of Che, have no idea what they are talking about. Take the idiot who Gas talked about when starting this thread:



First, he is wearing a pretty designer shirt. tie in a nice clean office while wearing a gold watch.  The legendary Marxist Che would walk up to this man and rip out his throat. (the real Che would rob him and put his treasure in his Villa or on his yacht).

Second, the guy is whining about the death penalty laws in Ohio.  Saying they are cruel and unusual.  Che "the Butcher" Guevara tortured people, some sources say for pleasure (he was ruthless enough to get booted from Cuba!).  He executed political dissidents.  He even ran internment camps for undesirables.  But this guy has a poster of Che on his wall while complaining death in Ohio "can cause pain?"

It is a bit disturbing how often Che and Obama posters turn up together.  I don't hold it against him on a personal level but still...

Houston campaign HQ:

[we vs us]

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

I don't think Obama would like to be pictured next to one of the most brutal killers in history?

Wow, that's pretty ripe.  I have to ask, where can I read about his place in history as one of the most brutal killers on the globe, ever?

Guevara's legacy isn't all roses, but, I mean, c'mon.  There's been lots of killing and lots of brutality through the ages, and if you're gonna put him up on that stage, please help me to understand better by providing me with some solid sourcing.

But I think it's also worth looking at Che Guevara in popular culture, which might help explain some of the resonances Obama campaigners feel with Che. In other words, I can pretty much guarantee you that the Obama campaign isn't much into executing political prisoners, though I have to admit I haven't been to Obama's Houston offices yet, and as we all know, people DO do things differently down there in Texas.

[dbacks fan]

FWIW, my problem is that they are presenting a flag of another country in a campaign office for some one running for the President of the UNITED STATES.

I just don't like seeing the Cuban flag in the same shot with the US flag. I don't care if it has a picture of Che on it or not, it's just not right.

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by we vs us

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

I don't think Obama would like to be pictured next to one of the most brutal killers in history?

Wow, that's pretty ripe.  I have to ask, where can I read about his place in history as one of the most brutal killers on the globe, ever?

Guevara's legacy isn't all roses, but, I mean, c'mon.  There's been lots of killing and lots of brutality through the ages, and if you're gonna put him up on that stage, please help me to understand better by providing me with some solid sourcing.

But I think it's also worth looking at Che Guevara in popular culture, which might help explain some of the resonances Obama campaigners feel with Che. In other words, I can pretty much guarantee you that the Obama campaign isn't much into executing political prisoners, though I have to admit I haven't been to Obama's Houston offices yet, and as we all know, people DO do things differently down there in Texas.

OMG in 1959 Castro put him in charge of La Cabaña prison where he was dubbed the butcher.  He executed 179 people that year.  Most for simply being capitalists.  Some because they had family in the US.  Some for pleasure.

Javier Arzuaga was a chaplain at the prison who has been quoted in several texts saying that Che grew fond of the execution of prisoners and that the staff at the prison "We called him the butcher because he enjoyed giving the order to shoot."

By the time his reign at La Cabaña was over, nearly 800 prisoners had been executed.

Félix Rodríguez, a CIA agent who was part of the team in charge of the hunt for Guevara in Bolivia, wrote that after his capture Che proudly admitted to about 2,400 executions for which he was responsible during his lifetime.

There dozens of books that account for his murderous deeds.    But if you want to defend him.  Go right ahead.  I would stay away from this one! []

[Conan71]

If people campaigning for Obama wanted to put up a symbolic likeness of an agent of change, why not pick FDR, Kennedy, Johnson, Lincoln?

I can't believe how glib people are when it comes to Che Guevara.

[rwarn17588]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

If people campaigning for Obama wanted to put up a symbolic likeness of an agent of change, why not pick FDR, Kennedy, Johnson, Lincoln?

I can't believe how glib people are when it comes to Che Guevara.

I have a photo of Johnny Cash next to my picture of Obama.

Both are men in black, you see. []

Isn't this issue, like, so February?

[TulsaFan-inTexas]

WTH?!! WHY, please tell me WHY Obama supporters would like to associate their candidate with a brutal murderer?

Seriously, this disturbs me to no end. I actually LIKE Obama personally. Although I don't line up with him politically, he's proven himself an intelligent person that is hard to dislike.

But WHY (and I'm seriously asking this) would his supporters allow such things?

[rwarn17588]

quote:Originally posted by TulsaFan-inTexas

WTH?!! WHY, please tell me WHY Obama supporters would like to associate their candidate with a brutal murderer?

Seriously, this disturbs me to no end. I actually LIKE Obama personally. Although I don't line up with him politically, he's proven himself an intelligent person that is hard to dislike.

But WHY (and I'm seriously asking this) would his supporters allow such things?

Remember, you vote for the candidate, not the supporters. If you dismissed a fellow because of a few crackpots, nobody'd be getting any votes.

[we vs us]

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

There dozens of books that account for his murderous deeds.    But if you want to defend him.  Go right ahead.  I would stay away from this one! [

Thanks for inviting me to not participate in this discussion. Very cool of you.  

For the record, I'm not defending Che Guevara's communist legacy or his prison killings or his torturings or his little black beret or his egregious facial hair.  To me, this has very little to do with his historical legacy, and mostly to do with him being an emblem of change and political rebirth.  And believe it or not, Gaspar, he works really well as the latter two, as well. But if you want to insist that yours is the only way to interpret a figure like Guevara then go right ahead and get your moral outrage on.

I agree, Conan, that I'd rather see an American up there.  But I'm assuming this isn't part of the Obama Campaign Headquarters Starter Kit, and is an unofficial sign of overenthusiasm, or maybe just fad behavior.

[Conan71]

I'd think, as the candidate, I'd distance myself and my official campaign offices from anything to do with a man who was joined at the hip with Fidel Castro and who was the poster boy for communism in the '50's and '60's.

Sure, our stance on Cuba has softened some since 1960, but not enough that I'd want any association with it in my campaign.  

Cuban flags with Che on them and no sight of the American flag in the offices.  That would have never flown 20 to 30 years ago.