Mayor Taylor To Give BOK $7 Mil for Great Plains

[zstyles]

Good luck...just from watching this in short bits on the news...and wondering pancakes is going on with this ...it is obviouse there is MUCH MORE going on..and the CITY of TULSA is hoping that its citizens will just stroll down the road......

[Double A]

quote:Originally posted by inteller

If anyone knows of a lawyer experienced in qui tam cases please forward their information to me.


I am serious.  


After what I watched take place tonight, a qui tam suit is only a start.  It is time to bring in the state and maybe even the feds on CoT.  Corruption reached all new heights this evening.

No doubt about it, Tulsa needs some tough love to get us out of this dysfunction junction we're in. I think it will take a grand jury. That's where this needs to go. I'd love to serve on that grand jury, BTW.

[Wilbur]

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

The following is the link to the Council agenda item.

Word out of City Hall is she is giving the full $7 million to BOk based on an argument of a "moral" obligation.

Administration was trying to get Airport land to deed to BOk, but FAA said "no way."

Not confirmed yet if Council approval is necessary, but new councilors woefully unaware of particulars, the decision is expected immediately and the timing around the holiday seems designed to minimize public fallout.

For more, Bates will be on my show at 2:30.

The Bank of Oklahoma enters a business deal and loses, now the City of Tulsa wants to make it right and claim the payment is moral.

Here's a moral question:  had the business skyrocketed and made millions of dollars for BOK, how much of that money was BOK going to give the City of Tulsa because is was the moral thing to do?

The BIG FAT ZERO!

Seriously thinking about pulling all my money out of BOK.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

The following is the link to the Council agenda item.

Word out of City Hall is she is giving the full $7 million to BOk based on an argument of a "moral" obligation.

Administration was trying to get Airport land to deed to BOk, but FAA said "no way."

Not confirmed yet if Council approval is necessary, but new councilors woefully unaware of particulars, the decision is expected immediately and the timing around the holiday seems designed to minimize public fallout.

For more, Bates will be on my show at 2:30.

The Bank of Oklahoma enters a business deal and loses, now the City of Tulsa wants to make it right and claim the payment is moral.

Here's a moral question:  had the business skyrocketed and made millions of dollars for BOK, how much of that money was BOK going to give the City of Tulsa because is was the moral thing to do?

The BIG FAT ZERO!

Seriously thinking about pulling all my money out of BOK.

Didn't Mayor Taylor "settle" the matter at lunch earlier this week with the bank's CEO?

She was fed a Lie-Burger.


[]

[tim huntzinger]

Holy $#!^, what a crock: KOTV forgets to mention the Mayor in their story, like it was the Council's idea! And the World devoted three times more words to the story, not mentioning the Mayor by name, just lil' 'm'!

[Wrinkle]

There is no justification for the way it happened, much less the thing that happened.

As for 'putting it behind us', we already did, but it's now going to haunt for a long time.

At least the Council (in a hands-tied situation) did the best they could in preventing the 'Emergancy Clause' portion from passing. That means the money cannot be paid on Monday as was a requirement of the 'deal'.

Makes the 'deal' invalid, if it ever was.

Whatever the intent, it was centered on settlement prior to July, 1, 2008. It'd be interesting to know why that was important. So, important that people risked their political futures.

Where's the WrecKall Kitty Petition going to be available?

[Wrinkle]

quote:Originally posted by inteller

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by inteller

If anyone knows of a lawyer experienced in qui tam cases please forward their information to me.


I am serious.  


After what I watched take place tonight, a qui tam suit is only a start.  It is time to bring in the state and maybe even the feds on CoT.  Corruption reached all new heights this evening.

They NEED to FEED their GREED.

If you know a lawyer experienced in qui tam matters please forward their name to me.

Per  §373 I need nine others to join me on qui tam action, so if you know anyone else that would like to join me in the endeavor forward their names to me.

Not a lawyer (disclaimer), but from what I read about Qui Tam, it's a Federal deal. Not sure it can be applied to State/Local government without specific State/Local law. But, if you can, those ten filers could obtain up to the full amount ($7.1Mil) if found correct. How's that for incintive?

I'm for the Federal Grand Jury, too.

[cannon_fodder]

1) FOTD, your response was... YET AGAIN, totally not related to the matter at hand.

2) Kudos to GT Bynum and the other counselor who recused themselves.  The only thing that smells right on this whole damn thing.

3) We were added to the lawsuit recently.  The proposal for payment came to light Monday.  It was published on Tuesday and approved on Thursday.  Fastest $7mil ever.

So we have the mayor, much of the council, and the city attorney all with interests in the transaction.  Also interested are one of the largest companies, the richest man, and the cities major newspaper.  All on a debt that is not legally owned (the city was not unjustly enriched IMHO) and was "settled" for the asking price (generally you settle somewhere lower than that).

I just wish it was not rushed and given more scrutiny.

Inteller,

When I have time I'll see if I can find a starting point for you in Oklahoma law.   Qui Tam as you refer to it is a Federal Statute and I am ignorant of a State equivalent.  Also will see about the stand for "unjust enrichment" as a cause of action.

[zstyles]

So in reality is there anything that can really be done about this? I think its funny..(now that I don't live in the city limits) so it really does not affect me...but I think its still a SHAM!

[MichaelBates]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder


Inteller,

When I have time I'll see if I can find a starting point for you in Oklahoma law.   Qui Tam as you refer to it is a Federal Statute and I am ignorant of a State equivalent.  

See 62 O.S. 372 & 373

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

1) FOTD, your response was... YET AGAIN, totally not related to the matter at hand.

2) Kudos to GT Bynum and the other counselor who recused themselves.  The only thing that smells right on this whole damn thing.

3) We were added to the lawsuit recently.  The proposal for payment came to light Monday.  It was published on Tuesday and approved on Thursday.  Fastest $7mil ever.

So we have the mayor, much of the council, and the city attorney all with interests in the transaction.  Also interested are one of the largest companies, the richest man, and the cities major newspaper.  All on a debt that is not legally owned (the city was not unjustly enriched IMHO) and was "settled" for the asking price (generally you settle somewhere lower than that).

I just wish it was not rushed and given more scrutiny.

Inteller,

When I have time I'll see if I can find a starting point for you in Oklahoma law.   Qui Tam as you refer to it is a Federal Statute and I am ignorant of a State equivalent.  Also will see about the stand for "unjust enrichment" as a cause of action.

Wonder if the $7 million gain to BOK will be offset by their WRITE-OFF of the carrying value of the Arena Naming Rights?

The VALUE of those naming rights just got depreciated!

How?

Every time a Tulsan drives by, sees or attends an event in the BOK Arena, they'll fondly remember how Mayor Taylor hastily paid the bank $7 million of their tax dollars that she simply didn't have to.  

Besides being mad a Mayor Taylor, they just might not be too happy with the bank.

You don't want existing or potential bank customers to get MAD when they think of your brand name.

Thanks, for the memories.

[:O]

[FOTD]

The owner of BOK does more for this community than any other individual in town.

Years ago, Boone Pickens tried to use his money and power to manipulate the community of Amarillo. The citizens turned their back on Boone and he took his circus and moved to Dallas. GBK would not engage in such antics. Instead, he takes a beating and just keeps giving.

What does BOK do for this community in support? How many employees work for the bank in Tulsa? How does this growing corporation continue to add to our economy here through nation wide acquisitions? What does the bank do in support of civic activities and sponsorships of events you attend mostly for free?

What does the owner do for this town? He gives at least $50,000,000 here annually through his foundations. It goes mainly to education and early childhood development programs. Would the Kendall Whittier area still be in poverty and crime ridden without his input? He set up a community foundation which allows individuals the ability to give back to their city through estate planning which in turn will benefit Tulsa forever. Do you know all the other wonderful things this kind person does for you indirectly over and above $27 a person? You all need a lesson in civics and in getting life in perspective.
Put politics aside this time and move on to a more positive outlook.

If you are looking for a witch hunt go down the pike to the Suckretary of State. She probably had to beg the bank to get involved in her scheme. No bank would have been so generous as to make this type of loan structure in the first place. And the bank forgave almost $5,000,000 in interest due.

GT Bynum did not need to bail until he realized his vote was unnecessary. He is a republican....Forgoing the emergency clause was cya for a few councilors.

Mean people suck. This hateful political game reflects poorly on all here who believe that walking on a small debt is the way to go. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth? The benefits of paying off this amount far outweigh the cost to continue the fight. Does it help maintain our community credibility with lenders and rating agencies going into the future?

[cannon_fodder]

AOX, no one argued that Kaiser and his Family Foundation nor that BOk has not done a lot for this community.  I have extolled his virtuous giving many times.  

But the argument "George Kaiser gives lots of money to Tulsa, so lets give lots of money to him" is not a winning argument.  Sorry.  Not only is not sound logic, this matter is a legal matter... the city can not give million to whomever it deems worthy.

Then there is philanthropy and business, his philanthropy to the city should not be tied to our willingness to give him $7 million, or it really isn't philanthropy.  If he steps up and blackmails the city for $7mil he should get it - he's worth it to the community.  BUT, if that's what's going on then my opinion of him would hcange drastically.  

If you actually read, above I indicated a compromise if he was interested in philanthropy which would see the money essentially returned to the city with the benefits still given to BOk. Nothing like that was discussed that I am aware of.  BOk added Tulsa to the suit and we nearly instantly handed over the entire sum they asked for.

For the record, $7,100,000.00 is not a small amount.  It is what the average Tulsan makes in about 160 years of working.  If it is a trivial matter, why would a multi billion dollar company care, or why don't you just pay it off?  Time to step to the plate.

AND, I want full disclosure.  What relationships do you have here because your "give the money to the rich and screw it" position is contrary to your normal banter.  I'm operating on the assumption that either you or someone close to you will personal bennefit from this.  Your comments have lacked rationale for your position - "he's nice so pay him $7mil" notwithstanding.

[FOTD]

You didn't actually expect a re-THUG-lican to have any honor or ethics did you? And a reich-wingnut at that? CF, you're easy to figure out. You are an obstructionalist. You are the type who likes 5 year divorces because they pay good fees for the inability to mediate.

Move on if you are going to avoid answering my questions.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

AOX, no one argued that Kaiser and his Family Foundation nor that BOk has not done a lot for this community.  I have extolled his virtuous giving many times.  

But the argument "George Kaiser gives lots of money to Tulsa, so lets give lots of money to him" is not a winning argument.  Sorry.  Not only is not sound logic, this matter is a legal matter... the city can not give million to whomever it deems worthy.

Then there is philanthropy and business, his philanthropy to the city should not be tied to our willingness to give him $7 million, or it really isn't philanthropy.  If he steps up and blackmails the city for $7mil he should get it - he's worth it to the community.  BUT, if that's what's going on then my opinion of him would hcange drastically.  

If you actually read, above I indicated a compromise if he was interested in philanthropy which would see the money essentially returned to the city with the benefits still given to BOk. Nothing like that was discussed that I am aware of.  BOk added Tulsa to the suit and we nearly instantly handed over the entire sum they asked for.

For the record, $7,100,000.00 is not a small amount.  It is what the average Tulsan makes in about 160 years of working.  If it is a trivial matter, why would a multi billion dollar company care, or why don't you just pay it off?  Time to step to the plate.

AND, I want full disclosure.  What relationships do you have here because your "give the money to the rich and screw it" position is contrary to your normal banter.  I'm operating on the assumption that either you or someone close to you will personal bennefit from this.  Your comments have lacked rationale for your position - "he's nice so pay him $7mil" notwithstanding.

The promoters of Great Plains Airlines, who have all left town by now, had pitched their "Direct Flights to the Coasts" deal to 2nd tier cities like Wichita and Tulsa.  

All the other cities had the sense to turn them down.

Then, the promoters used a network of gifted grifters to garner $30 million in State Tax Credits courtesy of their lobbyist Martha Erling Frette.

Then, got TAIT to pledge 22 acres of land right in the heart of the airport to the bank.

Then, in exchange for $600K in free advertising, they made World Publishing Co. the largest equity owner of GPA, despite today's Tulsa World's repeated Half-Truth that World Publishing only owned 3% of the shares.  

PREFERRED shares are not counted the same way as the common stock.  

Repeat:  The World Publishing company was the single largest equity owner of the airlines.  And, that ownership interest bought GPA many, many favorable "news" articles right up to the point when the airline crashed.

WHY didn't anyone exercise some adult leadership over the promoters when the first planes they acquired, they leased two airplanes that were incapable of flying non-stop to either coast.  

THAT was a serious RED FLAG.

In a Banana Republic like Tulsa, a few immensely rich families like the Lortons, the Helmerichs, the Kaisers, the Warrens, the Siegfrieds, the Flints, the Rooneys, and the Schusterman's have an influence far, far in excess of what is healthy for what we mistakenly persist in calling our "democracy".

It isn't really a democracy.

It is a Banana Republic.  

It only has the edifices of a democracy:

Elections.  

Courts.  

Judges.  

These ruling Oligarch families select our political leaders, the Mayor and a majority of our city councilors.

Their paid paladins like Cameron and Reynolds populate our city boards, commisions and authorities (like TAIT, TMUA, TARE, TIA, TDA, etc.), doing their bidding, and breaking our backs with bad, bad deals like the Trash-to- Energy Plant, clean water piped at cost to subsidize development of our suburbs, Great Plains Airlines, an arena sole-sourced to the Flint-Rooney Oligarchia Familias, etc., etc., etc.

Very scarily, they also select our District and Federal Court judges.

Newly appointed Federal judge Gregory Frizzell is Senator Inhofe's "dear" friend.  

Really scary if you are foolish enough or unlucky enough to have a legal tangle with the local Oligarchia Familias.

Their wholly-owned District Judge Jane Wiseman, took all of FIVE minutes to rule that a log-rolled 2003 Vision 2025 ballot, that figuratively sugar-coated voter rat poison, was actually not a log-rolled ballot.

Don't believe your eyes.  Believe the judge.

Dear Judge Wiseman's reward:  

Shortly thereafter, rewarded with a state Appellant Judgeship.

Welcome to the Banana Republic of Tulsa.

[:O]