Mayor Taylor To Give BOK $7 Mil for Great Plains

[Hometown]

If this ends up in court there might be some light shed on it, preferably a venue other than Tulsa where everyone that counts belongs to the same little club.  I've heard from those in the know that Kaiser's gifts always carry more than the usual number of strings.  FOTD this isn't about touchy feely impulses, nothing with this many zeros behind it ever is.  I'm waiting for the issue that drives Tulsans to the point of saying the same old good old boys aren't going to get away with this one.  

[Wrinkle]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

Personally, I would've let TAA/TAIT go bankrupt and rebuild from the ground up, after first relieving all of their positions.

These people shouldn't be handling any money, especially ours.

They're just an Authority; they were acting on a political decision by the City at that time.  If the City loses the Authority, then they can't act on anything.  Or was that just hyperbole?

"Just an Authority" underminds the very definition of an 'authority', which is to segregate ongoing operations from political will.

They are a descrete entity and can (did) bankrupt themselves.

I was trying to imagine the political decision to which you are referring. The City was not a participant in the 'deal' from the get go. Nor was it named in any suits until the 26th of this month, yesterday. In fact, it was never named, Ms. Kitty voluntarily had us placed there with the amended patition.

The founding of a new airline is not a public decision, political or otherwise. Besides, it wasn't structured for public benefit, just attempts to offload liabilities.

IMO, crimes were committed, which is all now being attempted to get covered. Katbox.

No hyperbol, that's what I would've done four years ago, or today.

That authority would disappear and we'd create a new one. As for credit ratings, theirs should be in the hopper anyway. The only way they can borrow money now is for someone to ignore the facts.

[Wrinkle]

Was just thinking this may have a good effect in having us re-evaluate all public trusts (i.e., 'Authorities').

Their ability to conjur up and execute a plan which brought us to this point with Great Plains Airline should be fair warning on the scope of power these 'authorities' weld.

The intent of authorities was, as I mentioned above, to segregate 'operations' from political will.

As it is, they operate like totally free businesses with little public input. They are granted the power to borrow money, build things, then, give them away at will.

In most cases, City assets are transferred to these operations, by Council authorization, and then are subject only to the whims of these authorities, without further public input.

The recent fuss over the old City Hall building being requested of the Council to transfer to the Public Facilities Authority is a good example of how loss of control occurs in those transactions.

All authorities, established by State Law and local Ordinance, have these powers.

IMO, this needs to change so that 'ongoing operations' does not include such broad powers of debt and decision.

They can do all the things they currently do, but should have to stop and ask their constituants once in awhile, "Do you wish to form a new airline?".

This is a major problem with how things get done in this City.

[FOTD]

Could this be the TIF of the iceberg?

"A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul."
George Bernard Shaw

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

"Just an Authority" underminds the very definition of an 'authority', which is to segregate ongoing operations from political will.

...and this would undermine your notion that they were a separate and distinct entity.  The mayor is on the board.

quote: SECTION 1.1 TULSA AIRPORT AUTHORITY CREATED. There is hereby created an agency of the City of Tulsa to be known as the Tulsa Airport Authority which shall consist of the Mayor and four (4) members appointed by the Mayor, subject to confirmation by a majority vote of the entire membership of the Council.

This should help you understand how closely their operations are linked to the city...

quote: SECTION 1.9 POWERS. The Tulsa Airport Authority may adopt, amend, or repeal rules and regulations for the maintenance and operation of any and all airports belonging to the city and may enter into contracts for the acquisition, establishment, operation, improvement, maintenance, leasing, or other disposition of the airports of the city; provided, all such rules and regulations shall to be subject to the approval of the Council and all of such contracts shall be subject to the approval of the Mayor. The Tulsa Airport Authority may employ, engage, or contract for the services of an attorney, auditors, and other special qualification personnel, subject to the approval of the Mayor.

quote:
They are a descrete entity and can (did) bankrupt themselves.

No, they are a public trust charged with carrying out a narrowly defined mission of the city.  They have the ability to enter into agreements that the city cannot, that's why they are there.  And the Mayor has final say on those contracts, and who's on the boards for that matter.

quote:I was trying to imagine the political decision to which you are referring. The City was not a participant in the 'deal' from the get go. Nor was it named in any suits until the 26th of this month, yesterday. In fact, it was never named, Ms. Kitty voluntarily had us placed there with the amended patition.

Sure they were, if you believe that the above is true.

quote:The founding of a new airline is not a public decision, political or otherwise. Besides, it wasn't structured for public benefit, just attempts to offload liabilities.

No, but part of the financing was most certainly a public, political decision by the previous mayor and council.  They called it a public purpose, and so it was.

quote:IMO, crimes were committed, which is all now being attempted to get covered. Katbox.

No hyperbol, that's what I would've done four years ago, or today.

That authority would disappear and we'd create a new one. As for credit ratings, theirs should be in the hopper anyway. The only way they can borrow money now is for someone to ignore the facts.

I don't know about crimes.  And Mayor Taylor is simply doing what she has to do to protect the city's bond rating; they're as inextricably tied as the organizations themselves.  The Mayor can recreate that organization in no time at all if need be.  When you get to be Mayor, so can you.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

Was just thinking this may have a good effect in having us re-evaluate all public trusts (i.e., 'Authorities').

Their ability to conjur up and execute a plan which brought us to this point with Great Plains Airline should be fair warning on the scope of power these 'authorities' weld.

The intent of authorities was, as I mentioned above, to segregate 'operations' from political will.

As it is, they operate like totally free businesses with little public input. They are granted the power to borrow money, build things, then, give them away at will.

In most cases, City assets are transferred to these operations, by Council authorization, and then are subject only to the whims of these authorities, without further public input.

The recent fuss over the old City Hall building being requested of the Council to transfer to the Public Facilities Authority is a good example of how loss of control occurs in those transactions.

All authorities, established by State Law and local Ordinance, have these powers.

IMO, this needs to change so that 'ongoing operations' does not include such broad powers of debt and decision.

They can do all the things they currently do, but should have to stop and ask their constituants once in awhile, "Do you wish to form a new airline?".

This is a major problem with how things get done in this City.

I had just been thinking recently about our systems of "boards" and authorities. I've had some dealings with the Park Board, which was the first time I noticed that there are some ceremonial appointments like Dale McNamara (former TU golf coach), Yvonne Hovell (owner ET Dodge), Walt Helmerich (Helmerich & Payne, Utica Square), the mayor, and finally Joe Schulte (I believe is the owner of Soutwood Nursery).

Right there, you have at least four people you have to wonder what expertise they bring to the table and a fifth person whose business could benefit from a cozy relationship with the Parks & Rec dept.  Not saying Southwood does benefit from that relationship, just saying there'd be room for it.  Just an odd selection process.  I certainly appreciate the mayor wanting to be up on issues, but I don't necessarily think the mayor should be on any advisory boards.

Take a look at the Airport authority and any other board or authority in Tulsa or Tulsa County.  There are those well-connected in the community who are appointed who don't really have a clue about operations, and perhaps one or two who have business related to the authority.  Personally I don't think it's a good idea to have Meredith Siegfried (Nordam) on the Airport Board.

Here's a lengthier report of the FAA investigation, 35 pages if anyone is interested.  The summary did, in fact, find conflict-of-interest by former board members:

http://www.oig.dot.gov/StreamFile?file=/data/pdfdocs/cc2003062.pdf

"Title: Report to Senator Inhofe on Tulsa Airport Authority's Management and Operations
Date: May 06, 2004
Type: Correspondence
Project ID: CC-2003-062
Summary: We issued our investigative report regarding contracting irregularities, conflicts of interest, and other issues at the Tulsa Airports, undertaken in response to a request from Senator James M. Inhofe, chairman of the Committee on Environment and Public Works. We found instances where the Tulsa Airport Authority's procurements of professional services, which were funded by the Airport Improvement Program, did not adhere to FAA's required competitive-selection procedures. We also found conflicts of interest on the part of former authority officials, poor recordkeeping by the authority, and a lack of sufficient oversight by FAA, in addition to other issues. The report identifies areas we are continuing to investigate and includes the audit report sent to FAA."

[Double A]

The bond rating argument is steaming hot B.S. to scare the public into accepting this deal and somehow lull the public into a false sense of security that Da Mare is somehow protecting us from the boogeyman. The public won't be scared or silenced into submission and subjugation like little children under the spin of this patronizing condescension.

[FOTD]

Credibility with the bond underwriters and rating agencies seems essential for municipalities and affiliate employers to get the terms and conditions at a good pricing to market.

Would welshing on a debt or a debt outstanding impact an issuance?

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by FOTD

Would welshing on a debt or a debt outstanding impact an issuance?

Is that a rhetorical question?

[FOTD]

yes

[Wrinkle]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

"Just an Authority" underminds the very definition of an 'authority', which is to segregate ongoing operations from political will.

...and this would undermine your notion that they were a separate and distinct entity.  The mayor is on the board.

quote: SECTION 1.1 TULSA AIRPORT AUTHORITY CREATED. There is hereby created an agency of the City of Tulsa to be known as the Tulsa Airport Authority which shall consist of the Mayor and four (4) members appointed by the Mayor, subject to confirmation by a majority vote of the entire membership of the Council.

This should help you understand how closely their operations are linked to the city...

quote: SECTION 1.9 POWERS. The Tulsa Airport Authority may adopt, amend, or repeal rules and regulations for the maintenance and operation of any and all airports belonging to the city and may enter into contracts for the acquisition, establishment, operation, improvement, maintenance, leasing, or other disposition of the airports of the city; provided, all such rules and regulations shall to be subject to the approval of the Council and all of such contracts shall be subject to the approval of the Mayor. The Tulsa Airport Authority may employ, engage, or contract for the services of an attorney, auditors, and other special qualification personnel, subject to the approval of the Mayor.

quote:
They are a descrete entity and can (did) bankrupt themselves.

No, they are a public trust charged with carrying out a narrowly defined mission of the city.  They have the ability to enter into agreements that the city cannot, that's why they are there.  And the Mayor has final say on those contracts, and who's on the boards for that matter.

quote:I was trying to imagine the political decision to which you are referring. The City was not a participant in the 'deal' from the get go. Nor was it named in any suits until the 26th of this month, yesterday. In fact, it was never named, Ms. Kitty voluntarily had us placed there with the amended patition.

Sure they were, if you believe that the above is true.

quote:The founding of a new airline is not a public decision, political or otherwise. Besides, it wasn't structured for public benefit, just attempts to offload liabilities.

No, but part of the financing was most certainly a public, political decision by the previous mayor and council.  They called it a public purpose, and so it was.

quote:IMO, crimes were committed, which is all now being attempted to get covered. Katbox.

No hyperbol, that's what I would've done four years ago, or today.

That authority would disappear and we'd create a new one. As for credit ratings, theirs should be in the hopper anyway. The only way they can borrow money now is for someone to ignore the facts.

I don't know about crimes.  And Mayor Taylor is simply doing what she has to do to protect the city's bond rating; they're as inextricably tied as the organizations themselves.  The Mayor can recreate that organization in no time at all if need be.  When you get to be Mayor, so can you.

You are, of course, referring to the Tulsa Airports Authority (TAA). Shall we discuss TAIT?

Please Refer to Chapter 8 of Title 39

Has anyone wondered why we have both a TAA and a TAIT? Especially since to become a board member of TAIT, you first are required to be a board member of TAA. Same club, different purpose.

And, the original suit is the Tulsa Industrial Authority (TIA) suing TAIT, not TAA.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Double A

The bond rating argument is steaming hot B.S. to scare the public into accepting this deal and somehow lull the public into a false sense of security that Da Mare is somehow protecting us from the boogeyman. The public won't be scared or silenced into submission and subjugation like little children under the spin of this patronizing condescension.

Or a thinly-veiled threat from one of our members who travels in the same circles as Kaiser talking about all the people BOK employs and what all they give back.  BOK wouldn't get up and walk out on Tulsa if they were not re-paid the $7.1mm.  

If there is some sort of banking reg which would enjoin the city in liablility on this, sure I could see us paying up.  I've not heard that yet.  In the instance where a debtor puts up collateral, disposes of the collateral and the bank cannot repossess it, it still does not alleviate the debtor of the debt.  If they have the ability to pay otherwise, the are legally obliged.  However, the city was not a party to the defense on this until this week.

Dick Stupidity screwed us, he needs to be run out of town on a rail, straight to the ocean.

[Wrinkle]

Was just listening to Chris Medlock's show and he brought up the possibility that a new emergency meeting might yet be called before July 1, 2008 IF, somehow, one of the two no votes last night decided to change.

A public meeting would still require 24 hours prior notice posting before any vote could be had.

On a hunch, I decided to check the City's website to see if any new meetings had been scheduled, ....and here's what I got:



Seems someone should be going down to the parking level bulletin board and checking for new postings.

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

You are, of course, referring to the Tulsa Airports Authority (TAA). Shall we discuss TAIT?

Please Refer to Chapter 8 of Title 39

Has anyone wondered why we have both a TAA and a TAIT? Especially since to become a board member of TAIT, you first are required to be a board member of TAA. Same club, different purpose.

Because they can issue tax-exempt bonds and TAA cannot? I'm pretty sure this is the sole reason for two trusts and why the membership is identical.

quote:And, the original suit is the Tulsa Industrial Authority (TIA) suing TAIT, not TAA.

Because this transaction involved tax exempt bonds?

These are just public trusts.  The former mayor and council, and thus the city, made the decisions.  It therefore makes some sense that the city would have to pony up in the end.

[Wrinkle]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by Wrinkle

"Just an Authority" underminds the very definition of an 'authority', which is to segregate ongoing operations from political will.

...and this would undermine your notion that they were a separate and distinct entity.  The mayor is on the board.

quote: SECTION 1.1 TULSA AIRPORT AUTHORITY CREATED. There is hereby created an agency of the City of Tulsa to be known as the Tulsa Airport Authority which shall consist of the Mayor and four (4) members appointed by the Mayor, subject to confirmation by a majority vote of the entire membership of the Council.

This should help you understand how closely their operations are linked to the city...

quote: SECTION 1.9 POWERS. The Tulsa Airport Authority may adopt, amend, or repeal rules and regulations for the maintenance and operation of any and all airports belonging to the city and may enter into contracts for the acquisition, establishment, operation, improvement, maintenance, leasing, or other disposition of the airports of the city; provided, all such rules and regulations shall to be subject to the approval of the Council and all of such contracts shall be subject to the approval of the Mayor. The Tulsa Airport Authority may employ, engage, or contract for the services of an attorney, auditors, and other special qualification personnel, subject to the approval of the Mayor.

quote:
They are a descrete entity and can (did) bankrupt themselves.

No, they are a public trust charged with carrying out a narrowly defined mission of the city.  They have the ability to enter into agreements that the city cannot, that's why they are there.  And the Mayor has final say on those contracts, and who's on the boards for that matter.

quote:I was trying to imagine the political decision to which you are referring. The City was not a participant in the 'deal' from the get go. Nor was it named in any suits until the 26th of this month, yesterday. In fact, it was never named, Ms. Kitty voluntarily had us placed there with the amended patition.

Sure they were, if you believe that the above is true.

quote:The founding of a new airline is not a public decision, political or otherwise. Besides, it wasn't structured for public benefit, just attempts to offload liabilities.

No, but part of the financing was most certainly a public, political decision by the previous mayor and council.  They called it a public purpose, and so it was.

quote:IMO, crimes were committed, which is all now being attempted to get covered. Katbox.

No hyperbol, that's what I would've done four years ago, or today.

That authority would disappear and we'd create a new one. As for credit ratings, theirs should be in the hopper anyway. The only way they can borrow money now is for someone to ignore the facts.

I don't know about crimes.  And Mayor Taylor is simply doing what she has to do to protect the city's bond rating; they're as inextricably tied as the organizations themselves.  The Mayor can recreate that organization in no time at all if need be.  When you get to be Mayor, so can you.

BTW, wanted to ask about your source document for the above. It's not in Title 39, either in Chapter 1-Airports & Aircraft, or Chapter 4 - Tulsa Municipal Airport Trust (what happened to this anyway?), nor in any Title 39 (Trusts) document is Tulsa Airport Authority mentioned, much less defined.

REFER to: TITLE 39 - TRUSTS

Oddly, Tulsa Airport Authority seems to not exist in any Tulsa Ordinance as of this date.

The Chapter 4 - Tulsa Municipal Airport Trust, offhand, seems to have all the powers formerly attributed to TAA. In several places in that document it refers to both the Tulsa Municipal Airport Trust AND the Tulsa Airport Authority. In fact, it's unclear if TAA is something else being referenced, as in the Tulsa Park Board, or intended to mean the Tulsa Municipal Airport Trust as one in the same.

Members of the Board of Tulsa Municipal Airport Trust, as defined, are to be selected from members of the Tulsa Park Board, oddly.

Either the online document has not been updated lately, or something's amiss.