Homeless Hi-Rise at Admiral and Yale

[Gold]

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

You forgot to mention bananas.

How can we have a conspiracy without a banana republic?

Well, I don't want you knowing about the banana part of the conspiracy.

That's top secret.

Only people on the internet talk about it.

So it must be true.

[waterboy]

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

You forgot to mention bananas.

How can we have a conspiracy without a banana republic?

And Banana Republic is in Utica Square where all the oligarchs meet to shop and plan strategy.

[Gold]

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

You forgot to mention bananas.

How can we have a conspiracy without a banana republic?

And Banana Republic is in Utica Square where all the oligarchs meet to shop and plan strategy.

There's an F&M Bank at Utica Square, too.

And several places that sell the Tulsa World.

And I saw the fire marshall shopping there once.

See!  See!

[MichaelBates]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by MichaelBates

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

The fact is, almost no-one wants this near them, but no-one wants to pay bills, or go to work either. These are people that need this service and it's not just sticking homeless in a shack together, it is trying to get these people the help they need so they aren't homeless. As was pointed out by a sage purveyor of pies, if you put ANYTHING else in the place of the word "homeless" or "mentally ill" you would be billed as racist, sexist, etc. Imagine these headlines:

*Black Hi-Rise to be built near White City.

*Gay Condominiums to be built at straight intersection of Admiral and Yale.

*Muslim Motel makes waves in midtown.

So what does that say about the people who are working so hard to clear the YMCA and its residents out of downtown?

So now we're bashing the fire code?

Does the fire code ban indigents and the mentally ill from downtown?

Was Suzanne Stewart from the Convention and Visitors Bureau at the THA meeting last week because she was concerned about the fire code?

The need for sprinklers is not sufficient reason to tear down a building and relocate the people who live there.

In New York City, Common Ground renovated buildings that were already housing the homeless, mentally ill, and indigent in Times Square and in the Chelsea neighborhood. They allowed these people to stay in familiar, walkable neighborhoods with access to transportation, jobs, and services.

Building Tulsa, Building Lives could do the same for the residents of the YMCA, but they want them out of downtown badly enough to spend $17 million on the project. I believe they could fix up the Y, or perhaps one of Maurice Kanbar's empty buildings, for that amount.

BTBL wants to push YMCA residents from a location with a walkability score of 89 to a location with a walkability score of 45, from a place with 20 bus lines to a place with a single, daytime-only bus line. Is that really serving the interests of the YMCA residents?

[carltonplace]

Michael, I guess I need an education. What jobs are in our downtown? There are some construction gigs available but most of the jobs downtown are not exactly blue collar. What am I missing?

[RecycleMichael]

I wonder what the YMCA people think about all this?

Do they want to stay in the housing business?

Do they think the building doesn't need sprinklers? Do they have plans to renovate or sell once the building is empty? Do they think their tenants would be better off somewhere else?

How come nobody is talking to them?

[Gold]

quote:Originally posted by MichaelBates

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by MichaelBates

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

The fact is, almost no-one wants this near them, but no-one wants to pay bills, or go to work either. These are people that need this service and it's not just sticking homeless in a shack together, it is trying to get these people the help they need so they aren't homeless. As was pointed out by a sage purveyor of pies, if you put ANYTHING else in the place of the word "homeless" or "mentally ill" you would be billed as racist, sexist, etc. Imagine these headlines:

*Black Hi-Rise to be built near White City.

*Gay Condominiums to be built at straight intersection of Admiral and Yale.

*Muslim Motel makes waves in midtown.

So what does that say about the people who are working so hard to clear the YMCA and its residents out of downtown?

So now we're bashing the fire code?

Does the fire code ban indigents and the mentally ill from downtown?

Was Suzanne Stewart from the Convention and Visitors Bureau at the THA meeting last week because she was concerned about the fire code?

The need for sprinklers is not sufficient reason to tear down a building and relocate the people who live there.

In New York City, Common Ground renovated buildings that were already housing the homeless, mentally ill, and indigent in Times Square and in the Chelsea neighborhood. They allowed these people to stay in familiar, walkable neighborhoods with access to transportation, jobs, and services.

Building Tulsa, Building Lives could do the same for the residents of the YMCA, but they want them out of downtown badly enough to spend $17 million on the project. I believe they could fix up the Y, or perhaps one of Maurice Kanbar's empty buildings, for that amount.

BTBL wants to push YMCA residents from a location with a walkability score of 89 to a location with a walkability score of 45, from a place with 20 bus lines to a place with a single, daytime-only bus line. Is that really serving the interests of the YMCA residents?

The law is certainly a reason for someone to move out of a building.  Look at Table 704.1.  http://www.cityoftulsa.org/OurCity/Ordinances/ordinances/14PREVEN.pdf.  My understanding is that it's a misdemeanor to violate this ordinance.  So, again, another reason to close the facility.

Just because the fire code/sprinkler issue prevents them from staying at the Y doesn't mean the building comes down.  I thought it applied to residential space.  This issue is several years old and my understanding is that people have known for a long time that the Y was going to close.

Again, it would be interesting to see the numbers for retrofitting these sprinklers rather than both sides asserting that it is cheaper/more expensive to add them as opposed to building something new on cheaper real estate.

[Conan71]

Just a guess, as I've never set foot in the Y that I can remember, but I'm willing to bet the building needs a whole lot more than a fire sprinkler upgrade.

[Gold]

Yup.

[MichaelBates]

quote:Originally posted by carltonplace

Michael, I guess I need an education. What jobs are in our downtown? There are some construction gigs available but most of the jobs downtown are not exactly blue collar. What am I missing?

Believe it or not, there are still many blue collar jobs downtown, not to mention the industrial areas northeast and east of downtown and that wee oil refinery just across the river. Even in the office buildings and entertainment areas there are plenty of jobs that don't require a law degree or an MBA, but if you aren't looking for them, you might not notice.

Last I heard, 35,000 people work downtown. At its peak, back in the '80s, downtown employment was twice that number.

As a transit hub, downtown provides non-stop access to many more job-sites around Tulsa. There are 20 bus lines that serve the downtown bus station. Four of those are night lines that provide transportation for shift work and night courses.

At Admiral & Yale, there is only one bus line. It runs east and west along Admiral at 40 minute intervals. Transferring to any other line at the downtown station can mean a considerable wait. (The bus routes don't seem to be synchronized very well, partly because each route has a different frequency.) Being able to get where you need to go without a transfer makes bus travel much more practical.

RM, even if the Y wants to get out of the residence business, that doesn't mean they couldn't sell the facility to BTBL to remodel. And in response to someone who said they'd have to vacate the Y building to add sprinklers, buildings get modified all the time without clearing everyone out. Common Ground kept 200 residents of the Times Square Hotel in place when they remodeled it to become a 600-unit supported living facility.

[AMP]

Often times jobs are not performed at the same location from where the workers live and are dispatched from.  Many service businesses are located in the downtown area and use vans and service trucks to move helpers to job sites not in downtown. There are also several labor companies that deliver labor to job sites from their downtown branches.  

Lower cost labor typically lives in lower cost housing areas.  Just as in Branson, Missouri or other tourist areas, the service personnel typically comute from surrounding lower housing cost areas.  To be competitive, most businesses rely on lower cost labor.

[MDepr2007]

quote:Originally posted by Gold

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

You forgot to mention bananas.

How can we have a conspiracy without a banana republic?

And Banana Republic is in Utica Square where all the oligarchs meet to shop and plan strategy.

There's an F&M Bank at Utica Square, too.

And several places that sell the Tulsa World.

And I saw the fire marshall shopping there once.

See!  See!

Wow. now we get to see something smart finally. Too bad the only thing smart from this contains donkey

[MDepr2007]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

Just thought I'd sneak some facts in:

This would be the 3rd or 4th such facility in the city of Tulsa and will be the nicest by far.

Homeless will not be living here, the residents will be working and paying rent.

This is meant for people who either need someone making sure they don't mess up their meds, having trouble integrating due to problems like autism, those kinds of things. This is just an assisted living center for people with various mental conditions. Without this level of assistance, they would not be able to maintain a productive life or job and likely would eventually end up homeless.

Source??   or are you excempt ?

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by MDepr2007

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

Just thought I'd sneak some facts in:

This would be the 3rd or 4th such facility in the city of Tulsa and will be the nicest by far.

Homeless will not be living here, the residents will be working and paying rent.

This is meant for people who either need someone making sure they don't mess up their meds, having trouble integrating due to problems like autism, those kinds of things. This is just an assisted living center for people with various mental conditions. Without this level of assistance, they would not be able to maintain a productive life or job and likely would eventually end up homeless.

Source??   or are you excempt ?

excempt?

The three locations currently offering low-income housing and mental health assistance are Pioneer Plaza, Hewgley Terrace, & LaFortune Towers. One of which is downtown and the other two are about a mile outside the IDL. All involve staff from the Mental Health Association of Tulsa.

[MDepr2007]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by MDepr2007

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

Just thought I'd sneak some facts in:

This would be the 3rd or 4th such facility in the city of Tulsa and will be the nicest by far.

Homeless will not be living here, the residents will be working and paying rent.

This is meant for people who either need someone making sure they don't mess up their meds, having trouble integrating due to problems like autism, those kinds of things. This is just an assisted living center for people with various mental conditions. Without this level of assistance, they would not be able to maintain a productive life or job and likely would eventually end up homeless.

Source??   or are you excempt ?

excempt?

The three locations currently offering low-income housing and mental health assistance are Pioneer Plaza, Hewgley Terrace, & LaFortune Towers. One of which is downtown and the other two are about a mile outside the IDL. All involve staff from the Mental Health Association of Tulsa.

"exempt" yada yada

Now explain why one should beleive what you write over what someone writing a column that is published writes?

Pioneer plaza has daily fire calls due to someone burning toast. This will put firefighters at more of a strain possibly for those living near Admiral and Yale.

Lafortune has many fire calls too but not as many.

Hewgley security would be laughable if the problem with protecting residents inside from the danger of people who prey on the weak wasn't serious.