Interesting info on Community Organizers

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by USRufnex



You, sir are a propagandist...

Quick Ruf, name one person who posts on the political section of TNF who is NOT a propagandist.

Can't do it can you?

[]

[USRufnex]

[USRufnex]

[waterboy]

FB, did you go to OU? I remember a poli-sci class my sophomore year that the professor was attempting to compare and contrast the different 'isms to a class. Capitalism, Marxism, etc. He noted the advantages and disadvantages of each. When he pointed out that Communism had an advantage in planning resources the guy next to me suddenly bolted upright and yelled at the professor, "You're teaching Communism!! My parents warned me about you commie professors!" We were all stunned. How did he make it to college and not understand the difference between teaching something and embracing it? How did he make it to college without understanding that even a faulty system can have elements that are successful?

Well, how did you?

[Conan71]

Remember this one Ruf?

[USRufnex]

[Conan71]

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

Now that's actually pretty damned funny right there.

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

What a waste of thread. There are no new ideas Gas. Just differing ways of presenting the same info. You seem to think this packaging of old ideas is dangerous to our country or you wouldn't bring it up.

You know who else was a radical not long after Lucifer? Jesus. Radical for his times and attacked for his beliefs, methods, and his work within the masses as an unpaid agitator against the existing system. But then, you guys might see him more as a Marxist, Socialist. And psst....they wrote a book about him that McCain and his cohorts often read and quote! Obama does too!!

Then you show mock surprise that people won't jump into your traps and just answer your questions. Indeed.

Oh good Lord, I have nothing against radicals.  Radicals shake up our perception of society and open our eyes to new possibilities.  

Again, I never said anything negative about radicals. . . and if you feel this is old information than please feel free to ignore it.  

That said, I have finished my little reading assignment, and I must say I am a bit disappointed.  This playbook is THE PLAYBOOK, down to Obama's mantra of Hope for Change.  

Ok, so here's my book report:

You see, Aliniski understands that "the world as we believe it should be" is our fantasy.  A fantasy that we can realize, but only if we take the necessary steps to change our condition.

So I'm ok with this.  I believe this.  It's the way to live your life and realize your dreams.  When you are not in the situation you want, you change your situation.  All good with me.

Oh but how he turns. Rather than using his wit, his intelligence, and his rather Sartresque writing style to encourage organizers to refine themselves, and push the communities towards enlightenment, education, and personal responsibility, he encourages them to use deceit, camouflage and subterfuge to achieve their goals.

He encourages his followers to shape public perception through deception.  No lie is to great if it serves the cause aye?

Oh and that little Rule #10 that no one wants to post on their web sites, that little rule encourages organizers to incite violence.  It instructs them to push hard enough to promote violence from their opponent.  Then to use it as a public example.

He goes almost as far as promoting martyrdom as a means to manipulate public perception.


I am so disappointed that I never got the chance to read this book earlier in my life.  It has opened my eyes to so much more of what is taking place on the political playing field.  This is a guide to manipulating the poor and uneducated into doing your political bidding.  It's a "How To" on creating a motivated army of people who have no understanding what they are fighting for.

Unfortunately, now I am not nearly as impressed with Obama's strategies.  I thought they were new, fresh, avant-guard, but this is old flawed angry class warfare stuff.  There is nothing here for the individual.  It's the "my hive mentality is better than your hive mentality" crap.  It's reactionary and really sad.

Here's my Rule for Radicals.  A prisoner that does not like his cell has two choices.  He can work towards obtaining the tools to escape, or he can demand that the guards repaint his cell.



Edit: Capitalized "Lord"  Thanks WB.  Your piety is without question.

[waterboy]

Gas, you really should capitalize "Lord" even when used in vain.

[USRufnex]

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

What a waste of thread. There are no new ideas Gas. Just differing ways of presenting the same info. You seem to think this packaging of old ideas is dangerous to our country or you wouldn't bring it up.

You know who else was a radical not long after Lucifer? Jesus. Radical for his times and attacked for his beliefs, methods, and his work within the masses as an unpaid agitator against the existing system. But then, you guys might see him more as a Marxist, Socialist. And psst....they wrote a book about him that McCain and his cohorts often read and quote! Obama does too!!

Then you show mock surprise that people won't jump into your traps and just answer your questions. Indeed.

Oh good Lord, I have nothing against radicals.  Radicals shake up our perception of society and open our eyes to new possibilities.

Again, I never said anything negative about radicals. . . and if you feel this is old information than please feel free to ignore it.  

Edit: Capitalized "Lord"  Thanks WB.  Your piety is without question.

[waterboy]

Radical was in the first sentence of your post describing the man who wrote what you think is the current playbook for politics. That's why I responded to it.

I don't believe anything you've posted about power, acquisition of power, and manipulating of masses is anything new or particularly shocking. Just my observation that little is new in human relations, simply new to the latest reader of history or practitioner of politics. Perhaps some new interpretations of old stuff but not really new. The Bible is really helpful in proving my opinion. So are heiroglyphs!

We tend to think that our generation, our time in history, our level of education and technology makes us superior to the past. It is an arrogant illusion. Unearthing of ancient texts describing trade between countries 3000yrs ago show they used accounting principles, inventory methods and shipping practices no different than today.

I do admire your passion for making connections with these things. I would be more willing to delve into such a discussion if it was non partisan in nature and simply a revelation in thinking. Unfortunately its a playbook used by all sides and you're choosing a side as am I. I'm taking your advice and ignoring it as old news.

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

Radical was in the first sentence of your post describing the man who wrote what you think is the current playbook for politics. That's why I responded to it.

I don't believe anything you've posted about power, acquisition of power, and manipulating of masses is anything new or particularly shocking. Just my observation that little is new in human relations, simply new to the latest reader of history or practitioner of politics. Perhaps some new interpretations of old stuff but not really new. The Bible is really helpful in proving my opinion. So are heiroglyphs!

We tend to think that our generation, our time in history, our level of education and technology makes us superior to the past. It is an arrogant illusion. Unearthing of ancient texts describing trade between countries 3000yrs ago show they used accounting principles, inventory methods and shipping practices no different than today.

I do admire your passion for making connections with these things. I would be more willing to delve into such a discussion if it was non partisan in nature and simply a revelation in thinking. Unfortunately its a playbook used by all sides and you're choosing a side as am I. I'm taking your advice and ignoring it as old news.

Well said.

[Gaspar]

ACORN has been busy preparing for this election.  I wonder how many dead Ohioans will be voting this year?

Washington
July 26, 2007,Seattle Times
Felony charges filed against 7 in state's biggest case of voter-registration fraud. The defendants, who were paid employees and supervisors of ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now

Michigan
September 14, 2008, Detroit Free Press
Several municipal clerks across the state are reporting fraudulent and duplicate voter registration applications, most of them from a nationwide community activist group working to help low- and moderate-income families.The majority of the problem applications are coming from the group ACORN, Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now ...

Florida
Oct. 13, 2007, PRNewswire
A Florida state attorney is investigating thousands of potentially fraudulent voter registrations associated with the leading organizer of Florida's Amendment 5 ballot initiative. But this is just the tip of an iceberg of illegalities, fraud and contradictions connected to the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) ... Former ACORN Miami-Dade field director Mac Stuart has declared an intent to sue ACORN and has made charges of rampant voter fraud operations. Stuart was employed and specifically tasked by ACORN to generate 103,000 new voter registrations from Dade County. He reports that ACORN threw out Republican registrations while paying for Democratic ones. Stuart also charges that ACORN targeted ex-cons and that he personally set up registration tables outside the Miami police department and Dade County jail.

New Mexico
Sept. 18, 2008, Judicial Watch Blog
This week officials in New Mexico's most populous county (Bernalillo) notified federal authorities that more than 1,000 fraudulent voter registration cards were submitted to the clerk's office. ACORN, which pays workers for each registration, is the prime suspect since it has handled thousands of new voter registrations in New Mexico since January. County workers subsequently discovered that at least 1,100 new registrations list Social Security numbers for people already in the county's database of registered voters, names of registered voters with different birth dates and addresses that don't exist.

Wisconsin
Aug. 6, 2008, Milwaukee Journal Sentinel
Criminal investigations could be launched against at least six voter registration workers who tried to add dead, imprisoned or imaginary people to the voter rolls, according to the Milwaukee Election Commission and the organization that employed them. "One woman called us to complain because her husband has been dead for 10 years and a voter registration was submitted," Edman said. In about 12 cases, deputy registrars paid by ACORN were "making people up or registering people that were still in prison," said Carolyn Castore, ACORN's state political director. And in other cases, workers used the same address for numerous voters or used driver's license numbers that did not fit the voters' birth dates, Edman said. But most of the fraud involved submitting duplicate cards for voters who were already registered, and forging the voters' signatures, Castore said.

Ohio
August 27, 2008, The Plain Dealer
A national organization that conducts voter registration drives for low-income people has curtailed its push in Cuyahoga County after the Board of Elections accused its workers of submitting fraudulent registration cards. Board employees said ACORN workers often handed in the same name on a number of voter registration cards, but showing that person living at different addresses. Other times, cards had the same name listed, but a different date of birth. Still another sign of possible fraud showed a number of people living at an address that turned out to be a restaurant. ACORN has submitted about 75,000 voter registration cards to the Cuyahoga board this year.

Pennsylvania
Sept. 18, 2008, The Bulletin: Philadelphia's Family Newspaper
A community organization, with longstanding ties to Barack Obama, has, according to numerous reports, repeatedly run afoul of voter registration laws both locally and nationally. Philadelphia election officials recently accused ACORN, of filing multiple fraudulent voter registrations during the 2008 Pennsylvania primary. The case has been referred to the U.S. Attorney's office, according to Philadelphia Deputy Election Commissioner Fred Voight. Delaware County election officials have made similar allegations against the group, and criminal indictments are pending. This past July 24, Dauphin County detectives offered a $2,000 reward for information about the whereabouts of Luis R. Torres-Serrano, an ACORN worker, who was accused of submitting more than 100 fraudulent voter registrations.

Nevada
July 7,2008, Las Vegas Review Journal
ACORN, which stands for the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, claims to have collected 60,000 new voter registrations in Clark County since February ... Lomax said while he supports the goal of getting more people registered to vote, he sees rampant fraud in the 2,000 to 3,000 registrations ACORN turns in every week.

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by Gaspar

ACORN has been busy preparing for this election.  I wonder how many dead Ohioans will be voting this year?

Washington
July 26, 2007,Seattle Times
Felony charges filed against 7 in state's biggest case of voter-registration fraud. The defendants, who were paid employees and supervisors of ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now

Michigan
September 14, 2008, Detroit Free Press
Several municipal clerks across the state are reporting fraudulent and duplicate voter registration applications, most of them from a nationwide community activist group working to help low- and moderate-income families.The majority of the problem applications are coming from the group ACORN, Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now ...

Florida
Oct. 13, 2007, PRNewswire
A Florida state attorney is investigating thousands of potentially fraudulent voter registrations associated with the leading organizer of Florida's Amendment 5 ballot initiative. But this is just the tip of an iceberg of illegalities, fraud and contradictions connected to the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) ... Former ACORN Miami-Dade field director Mac Stuart has declared an intent to sue ACORN and has made charges of rampant voter fraud operations. Stuart was employed and specifically tasked by ACORN to generate 103,000 new voter registrations from Dade County. He reports that ACORN threw out Republican registrations while paying for Democratic ones. Stuart also charges that ACORN targeted ex-cons and that he personally set up registration tables outside the Miami police department and Dade County jail.

New Mexico
Sept. 18, 2008, Judicial Watch Blog
This week officials in New Mexico's most populous county (Bernalillo) notified federal authorities that more than 1,000 fraudulent voter registration cards were submitted to the clerk's office. ACORN, which pays workers for each registration, is the prime suspect since it has handled thousands of new voter registrations in New Mexico since January. County workers subsequently discovered that at least 1,100 new registrations list Social Security numbers for people already in the county's database of registered voters, names of registered voters with different birth dates and addresses that don't exist.

Wisconsin
Aug. 6, 2008, Milwaukee Journal Sentinel
Criminal investigations could be launched against at least six voter registration workers who tried to add dead, imprisoned or imaginary people to the voter rolls, according to the Milwaukee Election Commission and the organization that employed them. "One woman called us to complain because her husband has been dead for 10 years and a voter registration was submitted," Edman said. In about 12 cases, deputy registrars paid by ACORN were "making people up or registering people that were still in prison," said Carolyn Castore, ACORN's state political director. And in other cases, workers used the same address for numerous voters or used driver's license numbers that did not fit the voters' birth dates, Edman said. But most of the fraud involved submitting duplicate cards for voters who were already registered, and forging the voters' signatures, Castore said.

Ohio
August 27, 2008, The Plain Dealer
A national organization that conducts voter registration drives for low-income people has curtailed its push in Cuyahoga County after the Board of Elections accused its workers of submitting fraudulent registration cards. Board employees said ACORN workers often handed in the same name on a number of voter registration cards, but showing that person living at different addresses. Other times, cards had the same name listed, but a different date of birth. Still another sign of possible fraud showed a number of people living at an address that turned out to be a restaurant. ACORN has submitted about 75,000 voter registration cards to the Cuyahoga board this year.

Pennsylvania
Sept. 18, 2008, The Bulletin: Philadelphia's Family Newspaper
A community organization, with longstanding ties to Barack Obama, has, according to numerous reports, repeatedly run afoul of voter registration laws both locally and nationally. Philadelphia election officials recently accused ACORN, of filing multiple fraudulent voter registrations during the 2008 Pennsylvania primary. The case has been referred to the U.S. Attorney's office, according to Philadelphia Deputy Election Commissioner Fred Voight. Delaware County election officials have made similar allegations against the group, and criminal indictments are pending. This past July 24, Dauphin County detectives offered a $2,000 reward for information about the whereabouts of Luis R. Torres-Serrano, an ACORN worker, who was accused of submitting more than 100 fraudulent voter registrations.

Nevada
July 7,2008, Las Vegas Review Journal
ACORN, which stands for the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, claims to have collected 60,000 new voter registrations in Clark County since February ... Lomax said while he supports the goal of getting more people registered to vote, he sees rampant fraud in the 2,000 to 3,000 registrations ACORN turns in every week.

Nice job on resurrecting a two week old thread.  That reeks of desperation.

[:O]