Here's one for the die-hard Tulsa Republicans

[waterboy]

Some things just never change.

"The Democratic Party is a political organization that has a heart--it cares about the people--it cares about all the people, rich and poor alike. The Republican Party is ruled by a little group of men who have calculating machines where their hearts ought to be.

"Sometimes the Republicans aid their clientele by special favors--like the rich man's tax cut bill which was passed by the... Congress...or like their attempts to give away the Nation's oil resources to all the big oil interests.

"Sometimes the Republicans aid their special friends by doing nothing--by a philosophy of each man for himself and the devil take the hindmost. That's why they've fought such measures as minimum wage laws, social security, and the protection of the right of labor unions to organize. All these things and others like them have been opposed by the Republicans."

[iplaw]

I like lamp.

Got any more rusty old liberal canards you want to throw out while you're taking out the trash?

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

I like lamp.

Got any more rusty old liberal canards you want to throw out while you're taking out the trash?

I don't know why you neo-cons continue to debate.  I mean, you guys already know Oklahoma has its 7 electoral votes locked up Red, right?  Not like you're gonna change our minds or vice-versa, right?

Just keep on wasting that time while I chuckle away watching it and McCain's campaign.  I've finally figured that one out after a month or so.

I've got beer to drink!

[waterboy]

Liberal stuff? Gassy? Crash?

[iplaw]

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

I like lamp.

Got any more rusty old liberal canards you want to throw out while you're taking out the trash?

I don't know why you neo-cons continue to debate.  I mean, you guys already know Oklahoma has its 7 electoral votes locked up Red, right?  Not like you're gonna change our minds or vice-versa, right?

I could ask you the same question.

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

I like lamp.

Got any more rusty old liberal canards you want to throw out while you're taking out the trash?

I don't know why you neo-cons continue to debate.  I mean, you guys already know Oklahoma has its 7 electoral votes locked up Red, right?  Not like you're gonna change our minds or vice-versa, right?

I could ask you the same question.

Answer a question with a question.

Inveigle....typical.

[iplaw]

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

I like lamp.

Got any more rusty old liberal canards you want to throw out while you're taking out the trash?

I don't know why you neo-cons continue to debate.  I mean, you guys already know Oklahoma has its 7 electoral votes locked up Red, right?  Not like you're gonna change our minds or vice-versa, right?

I could ask you the same question.

Answer a question with a question.

Inveigle....typical.

Why I choose to post on this forum is none of your business.

If it's inevitable, that pretty much seals the deal for both sides doesn't it?  Why are you still around then?

[Gaspar]

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

Some things just never change.

"The Democratic Party is a political organization that has a heart--it cares about the people--it cares about all the people, rich and poor alike. The Republican Party is ruled by a little group of men who have calculating machines where their hearts ought to be.

"Sometimes the Republicans aid their clientele by special favors--like the rich man's tax cut bill which was passed by the... Congress...or like their attempts to give away the Nation's oil resources to all the big oil interests.

"Sometimes the Republicans aid their special friends by doing nothing--by a philosophy of each man for himself and the devil take the hindmost. That's why they've fought such measures as minimum wage laws, social security, and the protection of the right of labor unions to organize. All these things and others like them have been opposed by the Republicans."

We come from different sides of the spectrum, therefore our perceptions are vastly different.

I actually like the old adage that "Democrats are the heart of the country and Republicans are the mind."

I have voted for both, granted I usually vote for Republicans.  We debate in different ways too.  It's no stretch to say that liberals have taken over the democrat party, and liberals tend to debate with a lot of heart and passion.  Conversely Conservatives now own the Republican party, though there are still some very liberal republicans.  Conservatives tend to debate on logic only, and you are correct, the "calculator" and the lessons of the past tend to rule conservative debate.

I have no anger or hatred for the other side, I also understand that there is very little chance of changing the minds of any of you.  The debates that take place here simply serve as examples to others.  The lurkers, the undecided, the non political, and those trying to educate themselves or entertain themselves.

The way we conduct ourselves is a window into how our differing philosophies shape who we are.  It is wonderful that we can provide this example, and that we take the time away from our busy days to participate, so that we and others can grow.

I have never learned anything from anyone who thinks as I do.  I rely on the perception and interpretation of those who think differently, like you, to help me grow and understand why I believe what I believe.  Thank you.

We are all speculators in the political game, we just come to the table with differing values and information, and we should be thankful that we can participate in this small way.

[waterboy]

Well said and thoughtfully presented Gaspar. I can identify.

The quote that I posted was mostly intended to entice mr. Crash and others like him. It actually is from a speech by Harry Truman in 1952.

I wanted to show a respected politician from the past making observations about the differences in our views of the world that are still accurate even today. A politician who is often quoted by both sides of the aisle today. A guy who took responsibility and didn't pass the buck. Even though he was a Democrat, no one referred to him as Marxist, Fascist or Pinko. Then or now. He inherited the fight against Nazism in WWII and extended the battle against Communism in Korea even though it cost him a second term. He knew the difference between the two "isms".

Interesting that IP thought it was liberal trash. Not many at the time or even now considered Truman as a liberal. Adlai Stevenson was the liberal. It was also remarkable to me that the issues he referred to in 1952 and the resulting solutions are the exactly the same some 56 years later.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by waterboy

Well said and thoughtfully presented Gaspar. I can identify.

The quote that I posted was mostly intended to entice mr. Crash and others like him.

Nooooo. Why would you do that, morbid curiosity? []

[Hometown]

Well Waterboy, one thing about growing up in Tulsa in the 50s and 60s is that we were well acquainted with the radical fringe of the Republican Party long before they ascended to power on the national stage.  

We had the John Birch Society and the Impeach Earl Warren signs that dotted the landscape.  Who was that Right Wing pillar Ann ? that Republican locals adored?

If you veered from the narrow path you were automatically labeled Communist and Queer.

The echoes are still reverberating.

Democrats in Tulsa have been tested over and over and over.  We are a hardy bunch.

[waterboy]

I don't remember an Ann?? HT. But I sure remember the Impeach Warren signs that were all over the area. There were also billboards for a local commentator on ch 6. They read, "Jack ? Fiery Commentator" but I don't remember his name either. His remarks came after the news had been presented and were always very conservative. Don't remember anyone complaining though.[]

[Hometown]

Ayn Rand, We the Living, Anthem, The Fountainhead, Atlas Shrugged.  A co-worker refreshed my memory.

This was a Democrat era so the radical right had been driven out of sight just about everywhere other than here.  But I remember the Mike Payne (sp?) Show out of LA that was very low rent.  A precursor to Limbaugh.

Of course William F. Buckley, but he was so high brow he could make the Right Wing's issues sound reasonable, even kind of sexy.

I look back at my friend and me going over to Southroads Mall in 1973 to canvas people on gay rights and a woman's right to an abortion and I'm just amazed at my innocence.  It's a miracle we didn't get our heads blown off ala Karen Silkwood.

The best and brightest of our generation lined up on the left, I guess so that they could wear their hair long because it certainly didn't last.

Then Reagan and radical shifts in the culture happened, the sad part is that the Left was in the process of achieving its goals.  It was working.  In many ways we were much better off in 1979 than we are now.

Oh Michael Stipe's Ignoreland is on the radio.  Gotta go.  Last point here.  My guess is that Tulsa's long standing relationship to the Republican Party goes back to one thing -- Oil.