Anti-Obama Sign Could Get You Arrested--OKC

[guido911]

pancakes is this all about:

http://www.enidnews.com/localnews/local_story_049225155.html

A while back CF and I got into it a bit over police misconduct wherein I vehemently defended the police. This cop is an abject moron.

[cannon_fodder]

[edit]It was pointed out to me that they did not break into the mans house.  They were "AT" the man's house.  I left the post as is nonetheless with added clarification in my subsequent post[/edit]

For the record, I am not strongly pro-life and I voted for Obama.  So Guido and I aren't on the same page there.  But still...

100% stupid.  How many people were pulled over for the W signs?  Or any of the other (and sometimes clever) anti Bush signs?  Were the ones that gave his last day in office a threat to kill him on that day?  How about Obama's "change" signs, I think those meant they wanted to kill GW to effect that change.

Stupid.  It was an attempt at a clever political statement, not an threat of any kind.

But it was one cop doing one stupid thing.  That I can live with I suppose, maybe I will even give him the benefit of the doubt and he thought he really was doing the right thing (I have to doubt that, otherwise this officer may not be intelligent enough to carry a gun).  When it took it into his precinct there may very well be regulations that require they consult with the secret service, so I'll give the department a pass (I don't know).  If the officer just wasn't thinking and the department had a policy on these matters - I'll give them a stupid pass (still not right, mind you).

What disturbed me the most is what followed:

quote:According to Harrison, the supervisor said the Secret Service had been contacted on the matter and had told them the sign was not a threat to the president.

Harrison was asked if he would like to file a complaint. He said he was not sure but would take the paperwork, just in case.

But his run-in with the law wasn't over yet.

"The Secret Service called and said they were at my house," Harrison said.

The Secret Service said it was not a threat, and then broke into this man's home anyway?

Pardon me, but get the hell out of my house.  I expressed my political point of view on my property and made no threats of harm to anyone.  Political speech is THE MOST PROTECTING class of speech.  When in doubt, I can say it.

Am I a member of any hate groups?  Sir, who I may or may not hate is not the business of the federal government so long as such a belief is not converted into illegal action.  Without answering your question I will tell you that I am not a member of any group that is planning nor advocating for illegal action of any kind.

Now I understand you are doing your job, and I respect you for it and am not trying to make it difficult on you.  But if this is following procedures then your procedures need to be changed.   As a citizen of the United States I a free to express my political views as I see fit, the burden is on YOU to show that I have done something illegal.

Please tell me what I have done that is illegal or what probable cause you have to believe I am engaged in illegal activities, and kindly get out of my house.

- - -

Seriously.  If this tame statement is interpreted as enough of a threat to break into someones house then what good is the 4th Amendment?   Not all threatening statements are actually threats.  I'd like to think the police and secret service are sophisticated enough to tell them apart.

When political speech leads to the search of your home, something is wrong.  I HOPE this gets to Obama or someone in his office and they address the over handed approach.  Really, it's flirting with big brother.

(over reacting?  Of course I am. It's what I do.  But honestly, the erosion of rights is far more dangerous than a dictator just taking them away because it usually comes with apathy.)

[nathanm]

While I think there was some severe stupidity involved in all this, that particular wording can easily be construed as a threat.

The anti-abortion activists have done a very good job of associating "abort" with "kill" and "murder," after all. They've been hammering on it for 30 years now.

[TeeDub]

Wow for misleading comments and thread titles.


1.   He didn't get arrested.

2.  The secret service didn't break into his house.

[guido911]

quote:Originally posted by TeeDub


Wow for misleading comments and thread titles.


1.   He didn't get arrested.

2.  The secret service didn't break into his house.

I said "COULD" get you arrested. Can't you read? Oh, and I gather you are okay with this cop and secret service's conduct given you are more concerned about how I titled this thread.

[grahambino]

the best part of the entire article is that the cop got this guy to admit abortion isn't murder.

way to stand up for your convictions there, pro-lifer.

[}:)]

[USRufnex]

ABORT GUIDO911..... just thought I would exercise my freedom of speech this morning.

[TeeDub]

quote:Originally posted by guido911

I said "COULD" get you arrested. Can't you read? Oh, and I gather you are okay with this cop and secret service's conduct given you are more concerned about how I titled this thread.

heh.   Normally I would be all over the abuses of power which are inferred to by the article.   It is the secret service's duty to protect the president.   I would bet the story they heard about the sign was a skewed version of the truth and therefore merited investigation.  

The sad thing is he let them inside his house.

You can't hang the entire police force over the actions of one angry black cop.  (Yes, that is a guess.)

[cannon_fodder]

I'm sorry.  You are correct.  The secret service was AT his house, not IN his house.  I stand corrected.

Nonetheless, it remains political speech and should be protected without harassment.  While my tone would have been somewhat softer if I had taken the time to critically read the article, it still seems somewhat of an over reaction. Clearly this sticker was political speech and not a threat.

And again, thanks for pointing out what the article really said.  Guess I wanted to smell blood.

[Conan71]

Curious to hear from our resident civil rights attorney, Bledsoe, on this issue.  Or does he only protect the civil rights of liberals?

[USRufnex]

If Bledsoe doesnt defend the guy, I am sure the ACLU will... conservatives who cant pratice free speech in OKC?  Well, color me badd... sounds like a classic "man bites dog" story to me...

[we vs us]

quote:Originally posted by USRufnex

If Bledsoe doesnt defend the guy, I am sure the ACLU will... conservatives who cant pratice free speech in OKC?  Well, color me badd... sounds like a classic "man bites dog" story to me...

+2 for the Color Me Badd reference!

[HazMatCFO]

I would file a formal complaint and request the officer be reprimanded.

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by HazMatCFO

I would file a formal complaint and request the officer be reprimanded.

A later AP story named Sergeant Phil Paz and an unidentified partner as the two fellows who just put Oklahoma on the laughing stock map again.

A sanitized version of the police report is at
http://s3.amazonaws.com/content.newsok.com/newsletters/f19chipscan0001.pdf

[Conan71]

Sanitized??? Home address and tag number are still on there.  Not real cool for someone to realease it with that info to the media.  Not bagging on you, but that's pretty wrong for the OKCPD to release that.  

We can be certain the G-men know who he is now.  He's "got a file".