Domestic Right Wing Terrorists!

[mr.jaynes]

Numbers or not, Conservative christians have significant political power because they've  voted in a solid bloc since Reagan came to power. 

Which is kind of sad, since voting for one candidate or another should be a matter of persuasion and not coercion. Nobody wants to be painted as unchristian, so they give into that kind of pressure. That could be a theory to explore. I've seen some religious leaders imply that to vote for, say, Bill Clinton in 1992 was a sin unto God, and even some of the rank and file behaving as if one cannot call themselves a Christian if one does not view a certain issue in a specific way.

For another instance, I remember back in the 1980s during the Iran Contra scandal, we had Jerry Falwell pushing to get Oliver North a Presidential pardon, and others claiming that the Contras were God-fearing, moral and good Christian people. And from what I got from that was, not to support Oliver North in what he did, not to supposrt the Contras was not only unchristian, but also unpatriotic. And if they can be as inflamed about just this issue, by calling one's religious commitment into question as well as their patritoism in some cases, just think what it's like come election season! And with the abortion issue, it is just as polarizing!

[tim huntzinger]

Numbers or not, Conservative christians have significant political power because they've  voted in a solid bloc since Reagan came to power.  Catholics used to have that same sort of power but they really splintered after Vatican II liberalized the church.  What's still on the table is how much the Bush presidency did or did not splinter the political power of the CC bloc.  They're also going through a major generational change, with lots of Gen X and Yers taking over leadership positions from the old skool fire and brimstone guys.   

Ha! Numbers, denominations, whatever! No matter? Big difference, apparently. Someone does not know the difference between a denomination and a religion!

[Conan71]

Here's a taste of conservative bigotry from some closed minded "anti constitutionalists"....

http://www.americafirstparty.org/docs/principles.shtml

Huh???  Bigotry and "anti-Constitutionalists?

"FOUNDING PRINCIPLES
OF THE AMERICA FIRST PARTY
PRESERVE AND PROTECT OUR PEOPLE AND OUR SOVEREIGNTY
Support a military whose mission is to protect our nation, not police the world
Strengthen our borders and promote rational immigration policies
Protect English as our common language
Seek friendship with all nations, but avoid entangling alliances
Work to maintain our nation's sovereignty and oppose all attempts to make our nation subservient to the precursors of global government
Apply American values to our foreign policy

PROMOTE ECONOMIC GROWTH AND INDEPENDENCE
Restore accountability and Constitutionality to budgets and taxes
Promote tax policies that adhere to the Constitution, enhance individual freedom, encourage savings and investment, and promote the family
Eliminate unconstitutional portions of the federal government
Rebuild our manufacturing base and protect American workers
Protect our right to fair trade and oppose free trade, exit NAFTA and the WTO
Help American businesses stay in America
Promote a Buy American policy
End taxpayer bailouts of corporations and foreign governments
Implement a self-sufficient energy policy

ENCOURAGE THE TRADITIONAL VALUES OF FAITH, FAMILY, AND RESPONSIBILITY
Protect and recognize the sanctity of all human life
Defend the traditional family unit based on one man and one woman
Promote the primacy of parents in the lives and education of their children
Respect the free exercise of religion
Recognize the Judeo-Christian heritage of our shared values

ENSURE EQUALITY BEFORE THE LAW IN PROTECTING THOSE RIGHTS GRANTED BY THE CREATOR
Defend the self-evident truth, "that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"
Preserve and protect all of the Bill of Rights
Oppose all quota systems.  Merit and behavior must prevail
End judicial tyranny and restore balance to our political system
Restore property rights and restrict government land confiscation

CLEAN UP OUR CORRUPTED POLITICAL SYSTEM
Remove the primary source of corruption by sharply reducing the size and scope of the federal government to its limited powers under the Constitution, and return control over all other matters to the states
Require that all political donations be promptly disclosed and come from voters
Enforce fair uniform standards for ballot and debate access to give voters more choice
Implement clean election practices—restore paper ballots
Reform the lobbying system so that the only organizations permitted to lobby are those organizations whose money is acquired strictly from voter donations.  Reasonable individual voter donation amount limits must be established.
End lavish Congressional pensions-put them on Social Security
Ban taxpayer funded Congressional campaign mailings
Restore the rights of states in the manner of choosing Senators and Representatives and promote the citizen legislator"

If you think opposing quota systems is bigotry or maintaining the sanctity of all human life is anti-Constitution, your brain is too baked in THC.

[Conan71]

Numbers or not, Conservative christians have significant political power because they've  voted in a solid bloc since Reagan came to power.  Catholics used to have that same sort of power but they really splintered after Vatican II liberalized the church.  What's still on the table is how much the Bush presidency did or did not splinter the political power of the CC bloc.  They're also going through a major generational change, with lots of Gen X and Yers taking over leadership positions from the old skool fire and brimstone guys.   

I think the CC wing of the GOP is in disarray.  More moderate and socially-liberal Republicans don't welcome nor care for their influence on the party and I think the CC's are starting to feel disenfranchised from the GOP.  It's been a powerful bloc, but I think we are all realizing there's Hell to pay for allowing too much influence from one group or another within any political party, and you are right, they did wield a huge amount of influence for about 20 years.

If it weren't so important to me to be able to vote in primaries, I would have changed my registration from Republican to "unaffiliated" already.

[Conan71]

Perhaps Southern Baptists are the largest denomination by weight? 
Deserves further exploration.

"If You Gave Jerry Falwell an Enema He Could be Buried in a Matchbox"

Christopher Hitchens

[tim huntzinger]

I think the CC wing of the GOP is in disarray.  More moderate and socially-liberal Republicans don't welcome nor care for their influence on the party and I think the CC's are starting to feel disenfranchised from the GOP.  It's been a powerful bloc, but I think we are all realizing there's Hell to pay for allowing too much influence from one group or another within any political party, and you are right, they did wield a huge amount of influence for about 20 years.

If it weren't so important to me to be able to vote in primaries, I would have changed my registration from Republican to "unaffiliated" already.

I would say feeling disaffected, annoyed, lied-to, used, taken for granted, turned off, tuned out.  Their simplistic views helped propel the GOP to majorities in the Fed.  For me, at the local level the tax-and-spenders are no different in the GOP versus the Dems.  I refuse to register Partisan despite the primaries because my yard, bumper, and blog can do more than my single vote. The CC is not in disarray, they are in rebellion.  And even now the CC is mocked, ridiculed, blamed, and scorned by the tax-and-spending 'moderates'. Even secular conservatives like Rush Limbaugh are now being asked to basically leave the GOP.  Who is left? Last one out turn out the lights!

[mr.jaynes]

I think the CC wing of the GOP is in disarray.  More moderate and socially-liberal Republicans don't welcome nor care for their influence on the party and I think the CC's are starting to feel disenfranchised from the GOP.  It's been a powerful bloc, but I think we are all realizing there's Hell to pay for allowing too much influence from one group or another within any political party, and you are right, they did wield a huge amount of influence for about 20 years.
If it weren't so important to me to be able to vote in primaries, I would have changed my registration from Republican to "unaffiliated" already.

The problem, I think, is that when one seeks the endorsement of the CC bloc, it's apparently an all-or-nothing-at-all proposition. It's a theory, but it looks as if one has to agree to the entire CC agenda in its entirety, or none of it. If one agrees to their agenda, it's their way, all the way, no moderation, no variance. If one chooses to reject it, they do so at the peril of losing an election.

[FOTD]

"The terrorists hate our freedoms"... Hey, Dubya was RIGHT for once!

The Terrorists Are Winning...

Wednesday, 10 June 2009, 11:12 am
Column: Bradblog.Com
The Terrorists Are Winning...
...white, American, rightwing terrorists that is.

Brad Friedman,
BRAD BLOG

"George Tiller's clinic will close in the wake of the Wichita abortion provider's shooting death, lawyers for the Tiller family said today," the Wichita Eagle is reporting. "Lee Thompson and Dan Monnat, the family's lawyers, said in a statement that the clinic, Women's Health Care Services, will be permanently closed, effective immediately."
Waytago anti-choice terrorists! You're winning!

Even Tiller's accused murderer, Scott Roeder is celebrating, telling CNN them that closure is "a victory"!

On Sunday, the assassin of the man Bill O'Reilly repeatedly described as "Tiller the Baby Killer", told AP "there are many other similar events planned around the country," prompting Keith Olbermann to wonder, appropriately: "Why is the far right not calling for him to be waterboarded to tell us against whom the next gun or bomb will be directed?"

Good question, though Dick Cheney could not be reached for comment.


Roeder should definitely be tried as a terrorist.

[cannon_fodder]

Roman Catholicisim is a religion, not a denomination. Just sayin. And they do not allow women clergy either.
. . .
Someone does not know the difference between a denomination and a religion!

I agree, someone doesn't know the difference.  

Catholic:: of, relating to, or forming the ancient undivided Christian church or a church claiming historical continuity from it

Denomination:  a religious organization whose congregations are united in their adherence to its beliefs and practices

Christian:  one who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ

Religion:  (1): the service and worship of God or the supernatural  (2): commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance


Within Christianity there are subsets of beliefs.  Generally there are three subsets of Christianity:  Catholic, Orthodox, and Protestant.   Catholics are still generally a united group.  Orthodox has two primary subsets:  Eastern and Greek (also Orental and Asyryn, but in general).  Protestants have many subsets: Lutheran, Baptist, Presbyterian and many others.  Some groups have splintered to a point that they are sometimes considered new religions including Mormons and Unitarians.  

In case you were unaware, Catholics believe in Jesus, choose the books of the Bible, and established most of the basic tenants of the faith.  Catholics profess belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ.  They were THE Church for the first 1600 years or so.  Hence, they are Christian.  Which would be the same religion as all other sects or denominations of Christianity (being defined as followers of Christ).

Catholics do have different beliefs and practices than other groups of Christians. Just as Eastern Orthodox members have different beliefs and practices.  Or Members of Guts Church have different beliefs and practices than those at Boston Avenue Methodist.  However, they are all defined by a professed belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ.  Ergo, Christian.

And what do we call a group with the same core tenants that has different practices and beliefs?  By definition: a denomination.  

If definitions aren't your thing, go look at any census or any other web site that counts religious affiliation.  Catholic is always a subset of Christian.  The World Book of Religions and Wikipedia agrees.  How does Catholicism garner itself into an entire new religion?

[guido911]

Roeder should definitely be tried as a terrorist.

You should be tried for being a dumba$$.

[mr.jaynes]

You should be tried for being a dumba$$.

If what Roeder is accused of having done, falls under the definition of terrorism, then yes he should be tried as such.

[guido911]

If what Roeder is accused of having done, falls under the definition of terrorism, then yes he should be tried as such.

Why? Try him on capital murder, it's easier. From what I've read he's already confessed.

[FOTD]

Then the true test will be if he is waterboarded!

[mr.jaynes]

Why? Try him on capital murder, it's easier. From what I've read he's already confessed.

Capital Murder, yes, but, if it was due to some sociopolitical or religiopolitical agenda, would that not fall under the definition of Terrorism?

Then the true test will be if he is waterboarded!

Kinda like that ninny Mancow Mueller?

[FOTD]

RELATED THREAD!
http://www.tulsanow.org/forum/index.php?topic=13634.msg133857;topicseen#msg133857