Councilor vs. Unions Continues

[RecycleMichael]

According to the city budget...

The police department has 888 total employees.
580 are sworn officers and 200 are sworn higher-ranked officers for a total sworn force of 780. There are also 86 positions in staff support and 22 positions in labs.

The personnel budget for these 888 positions is $75,097,000. That works out to $84,568 per position. That number includes pay and benefits. The city has a benefit package of just over 50% of the salary on average so one could assume that the average pay alone is two thirds of $84,568 for an annual average police department employee (including staff support positions) of $56,379.

The Tulsa World database shows 836 people who have the word "police" in their job title. Of these over 350 of them have a starting pay over $60,000 per year before overtime is added in. 

There are also many other costs to operate the police department. The total budget is $87,434,000 which also includes the purchase this year of 140 new police cars (including 22 unmarked ones), 18 Harleys, 6 pickup trucks, 7 mini-vans, 2 trucks and 3 segways.

[Conan71]

I can see the need for 18 Harleys and 7 pick up trucks.  Harleys and pick ups are life's little essentials. 

[MH2010]

The Harleys are replacements for the motorcylcle unit's vehicles.  The trucks are used for special events (picking up and transporting police barracades ect.). They are also used by the bomb squad, SOT, dive team and SID.

[Wilbur]

According to the city budget...

The police department has 888 total employees.
580 are sworn officers and 200 are sworn higher-ranked officers for a total sworn force of 780. There are also 86 positions in staff support and 22 positions in labs.

The personnel budget for these 888 positions is $75,097,000. That works out to $84,568 per position. That number includes pay and benefits. The city has a benefit package of just over 50% of the salary on average so one could assume that the average pay alone is two thirds of $84,568 for an annual average police department employee (including staff support positions) of $56,379.

The Tulsa World database shows 836 people who have the word "police" in their job title. Of these over 350 of them have a starting pay over $60,000 per year before overtime is added in. 

There are also many other costs to operate the police department. The total budget is $87,434,000 which also includes the purchase this year of 140 new police cars (including 22 unmarked ones), 18 Harleys, 6 pickup trucks, 7 mini-vans, 2 trucks and 3 segways.

Wow!  Severe spin. 

The police department's salary and benefits budget for fiscal year 2010 includes all new hires that are anticipated within the fiscal year, not just for the number of positions as of July 1, 2009.  As such, this budget includes employee salaries who haven't even been hired yet, and may not be hired, depending on revenue.  You obviously can't divide that $$$ number into the current number of employees and come up with an accurate answer.

Look.  I didn't want to get into ANOTHER argument over police pay, which seems to be a re-occurring theme on this board, but felt compelled when several of the posts implied the average police officer is making $84,000+, which is in no way true.

From the city's own websites:

590 police officers earn between $43K-$62K
82 corporals earn between $54K-$69K
83 sergeants earn between $61K-$73K
23 captains earn between $76K-$84K
9 majors earn between $87-$96K
3 deputy chiefs earn between $103K-$133K

Do Tulsa police officers make a comfortable living?  I guess it would depend on who you ask.
Do Tulsa police officers earn a salary comparable to their peers?  NO WAY.  Not even close.
Do Tulsa police officers want to be paid at the top of the 10-city comparable list?  Sure, who wouldn't.  But all they've ever asked for was to be paid the average.  At this point, I think they'd settle for anything other then always being dead last.

[rwarn17588]

Wow!  Severe spin. 

The police department's salary and benefits budget for fiscal year 2010 includes all new hires that are anticipated within the fiscal year, not just for the number of positions as of July 1, 2009.  As such, this budget includes employee salaries who haven't even been hired yet, and may not be hired, depending on revenue.  You obviously can't divide that $$$ number into the current number of employees and come up with an accurate answer.

Look.  I didn't want to get into ANOTHER argument over police pay, which seems to be a re-occurring theme on this board, but felt compelled when several of the posts implied the average police officer is making $84,000+, which is in no way true.

From the city's own websites:

590 police officers earn between $43K-$62K
82 corporals earn between $54K-$69K
83 sergeants earn between $61K-$73K
23 captains earn between $76K-$84K
9 majors earn between $87-$96K
3 deputy chiefs earn between $103K-$133K

Do Tulsa police officers make a comfortable living?  I guess it would depend on who you ask.
Do Tulsa police officers earn a salary comparable to their peers?  NO WAY.  Not even close.
Do Tulsa police officers want to be paid at the top of the 10-city comparable list?  Sure, who wouldn't.  But all they've ever asked for was to be paid the average.  At this point, I think they'd settle for anything other then always being dead last.

I find it deeply ironic that the same above poster who frequently complains about government and city spending suddenly gets defensive about his department's pay when a councilor starts to make proposals to cut said city spending.

Wilbur sounds like yet another case of a self-described fiscal conservative who really isn't, that spending cuts should affect someone else. Typical.

[patric]

I find it deeply ironic that the same above poster who frequently complains about government and city spending suddenly gets defensive about his department's pay when a councilor starts to make proposals to cut said city spending.

Sometimes you really have to wonder how some city departments justify their spending. 
Take for instance, was it really necessary to deploy the helicopter and K9 units when a rental cop was threatened with a penis at the Creekwood Apartments last week?

http://tulsaworld.cc/wordpress/2009/06/21/tpd-doesnt-hold-back-when-hunting-for-weenie-man/

[waterboy]

If you've got the toys...might as well use them.

I'm tired of hearing how upper level degreed people are not supposed to help shoulder the impact of this recession (depression). Cops, firefighters, and government employees are no more immune than the truck driver working overtime and popping pillls to keep his routes served. Take your medicine like the rest of us.

[Wilbur]

I find it deeply ironic that the same above poster who frequently complains about government and city spending suddenly gets defensive about his department's pay when a councilor starts to make proposals to cut said city spending.

Wilbur sounds like yet another case of a self-described fiscal conservative who really isn't, that spending cuts should affect someone else. Typical.

Obviously coming from a person who has absolutely no idea what a fiscal conservative is.

The fiscal conservative says no to crap like a new city hall, a baseball field, redeveloping lofts and an arena.

The sad state of this city is, we spend like crazy because we constantly add new taxes, then claim being poor.