Sally Kern Makes National News Again

[PepePeru]

I was referring to you and your sentiment which seems to dominate these 'threads.'  See, you said that Kern and people who believe in Christian morality - the 'moralists' - 'dominate' Sooner thought. Must be weird driving around, shopping, going to meetings, thinking that the majority of the people you see and interact with are morons, idiots, whatever hateful things you all can call them.  I feel great in this town and this State! Sorry you all are so miserable.

^
good job, you're a cliche.
now, see if you can figure out which one.

i doubt you can.

[Townsend]

So you all think that these idiots, whackos, and/or morons comprise what percentage of Sooners?  The majority?  If my experience with this forum is any indication of the Sooner sentiment, I would not be surprised to find most people I meet to be narrow-minded, bigoted, hateful, petty, back-stabbing, lying pieces of poop.  But I have not.  I have found Okies to be friendly, opinionated, straightforward, decent and nice people.  Must be hellish to live in a state of mind where one thinks that one is surrounded by some kind of cult.

And again, O'bama calls the US 'one of the larger Muslim countries' and ya'll bend over backwards trying to rephrase and reframe the statement.  Here some modern day Abolitionist type offers a feckless resolution about sliding morals and the dear and precious name Jesus is used as a mockery and joke.  I get the sentiment that offering this resolution is a mockery of its own, but I wonder if any of you anti-Christians, anti-religious zealots to defile the name Mohammet (PBUH).

You realize the people you're attacking all agree that your online persona is batcrap crazy. 

Maybe try a more friendly way of communicating and you won't be shut down so hard when you try to bring up a point.

[tim huntzinger]

^
good job, you're a cliche.
now, see if you can figure out which one.

i doubt you can.

Do you think the majority of Okies are idiots, morons, et al for hewing to a fundamentalist Christian sentiment?

[tim huntzinger]

You realize the people you're attacking all agree that your online persona is batcrap crazy. 

Maybe try a more friendly way of communicating and you won't be shut down so hard when you try to bring up a point.

I am not the one name-calling, harassing, or casting broad-brush assertions that the majority of people in my adopted state are religious bigots.  Sorry for defending the honor or my fellow citizens.  How have I attacked anyone here?

You are the individual who thinks that hate-speech against people with disabilities is fair game and funny.  So who is the narrow-minded bigot?

[Townsend]

Do you think the majority of Okies are idiots, morons, et al for hewing to a fundamentalist Christian sentiment?

Just misled

[cannon_fodder]

[Warning: novel.  May as well get it all in one post and walk away.  ]

lol, that's awesome.  We're narrow minded and bigoted because I don't think the State of Oklahoma should promote a single religious agenda.  For the record, I do not think most Christians or most religious people of any order are idiots, morons, unintelligent or whatever attributes you assigned.  I merely disagree with their supernatural beliefs.  And I only speak out on the subject when an attempt is either made to engage in the discussion by others or to force said beliefs upon others (myself included).  Particularly when government is used as the vessel for said attempt.

But yes, I believe people that think the economic crisis is the wraith of God as punishment for our debauchery are misguided.  My guess (and hope) is most people in Oklahoma would think such a view is also a bit outside the norm.  True, in the bronze ages and through the middle ages all bad events were attributed to the wraith of the Gods, but I like to think we've moved past that.

But you do have a point.  There are many people in Oklahoma who do not believe in dinosaurs and would have joined in every religious crusade throughout time:  from trying to kick Ben Franklin out of the Anglican church for arguing that lightening is not punishment from God to imprisoning Galileo for daring to argue against God that the Earth is not the center of the Universe (banning forks as decadent, arguing germs don't exist because it defies Gods wraith, and on and on and on).   I still don't think that's a majority, but the vocal minority is enough to have Oklahoma mocked fairly often.  Which is nice.    But I don't fault them for their beliefs, until they attempt to have their religious beliefs dictate or represent me.  At which point they have made it my concern.

And yes, I am against religious zealots to the extent that I feel religious zealotry can hinder reason, freedom and decency.  Is that all religions?  Nope.  Is that any religion all the time?  Nope.  I'm anti-republican, anti-democrat, anti-environmentalist, anti-logging . . . at some point I'll find something to disagree with on anything.  Fundamentalist religions are the only area where it is considered a virtue to declare that you are right above all else while the rest of the world has it entirely wrong.  Not because of a logical conclusion or factual representation, but because of a belief.  Glorifying willful ignorance and the absents of discussion or logic.  

There is no room for discussion, logic, or waiver.  Well, until the great weight of society is too much and you then change the opinion to stave off the loss of followers and again declare that now you are 100% correct.  Thus, the perception that religion is under attack.  When you have to be right about everything and have a stated goal of convincing other people you are right while shaping laws, policy, history, education and everything else you can in such a way as to reflect the fact that you are right . . . you will necessarily be in conflict with others.  Most things are open to logical discussions and disagreements, where they are not conflict predictably ensues.

A discussion of my beliefs is not a personal attack upon me.  Nor should my questioning of your doctrines be construed as such.  It is rude to question religious doctrines, but it is OK to have the State proclaim religious doctrines.  I really don't get it.  

modern day Abolitionist

You are comparing Ms. Kern's quest to "expose and attack" homosexuals with person who were attempting to end human slavery?  Wow. Really?  You realize all the arguments in favor of slavery were biblical, mostly advocated by Baptists . . . which is the primary flavor of Christianity Ms. Kern is pushing.  Or is her great and noble quest her attempt to convince everyone that her brand of thinking is correct?  Which also doesn't seem on par with stopping slavery.

Also, as a literalist, Ms. Kern is obliged to accept slavery as it was in the bible.  That only changed when society dictated it no longer popular (/lost the war).  The old testament encourages the torching of cities and the taking of slaves and Jesus himself never speaks out against slavery while consistently upholding the institution (Matthew 8:5-13, Luke 12:47 [beating slaves is ok too], Matthew 10:24-25).  In espousing the Gospel to the masses Paul continues the New Testament endorsement of Slavery Ephesians 6:5, 1st Timothy 6:1 and again in Titus 2:9-10.  Peter tells slaves to obey their masters no matter how cruel. 1 Peter 2:18.   The saving grace of the Bible on slavery is a passage that tells slave owners they should be kind to their slaves . . . which is a little bit short of abolitionist.

Ahh yes.  Hopefully Sally can continue the great fundamentalist Christian tradition of abolitionism.  But this time by freeing the gays from themselves.

Feckless resolution

A statement or proclamation that is generally incompetent and ineffectual. With this I agree 100%.  I'm surprised you also view this resolution as incompetent.

Cult:  formal religious veneration, followers of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices,  a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgato, great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work.  

By most definitions of the word, we ARE surrounded by a cult.  Thus, my state of mind could be excused.  Pretending of course that you know my state of mind and accurately reflected it.  Cult took on a negative connotation as established religions belittled new religions, but by definition the term is not inherently negative.

And, yes.  I have and will continue to mock the name Mohamed as appropriate.  When someone blows themselves and a bus load of civilians up "for God" and to get to get 40 virgins.  When someone uses a religions founded by a man who got rich by marrying his former boss, a successful businesswomen, to subjugate women.  When a man hiding in a cave uses the name and puffs out his chest in making threats (while still hiding), I will make fun of it.  But here, it is mostly people evoking the name of Jesus while making statements.  Hence, that name draws my attention when faith healers encourage people to skip chemotherapy, when televangelists try to beg one more Rolls Royce or home renovation from retired widows, when ignorance is pushed as an educational agenda, or Ms. Kern tries to have Oklahoma proclaim that HER religious views are correct and everyone else is wrong.

But I agree wholly, it is remarkably intolerant and insecure of Mulsims to refuse to accept criticism of their religious beliefs.

And finally, the Battle Hymn is posted.  Great song.  But I fail to see the relevance.  It is sung by the Mormons, a group that Ms. Kern presumably has going to hell as heretics on her list.  The song itself was adopted by the Union army because the most popular song of the day, Dixie (Lincolns favorite song), was already adopted by the Confederacy.   So like "In God we Trust" (put on there after the civil war so future generations wouldn't think they were godless) or "One nation under God" (put there so differentiate ourselves from the Godless communists in the 1950's) . . . the reasoning behind the Battle Hymn itself is somewhat dubious.

I hope my frank, opinionated, straightforward and decent discussion wasn't too narrow-minded, bigoted, hateful, petty or backstabbing. I am anti-religious.  But I don't attempt to force my views on other people.  When the inverse is not true I will speak my mind.   A proclamation of the "citizens of Oklahoma" is just such a case.  

Do you suppose Ms. Kern or yourself would sit back and accept a proclamation from the State that their religious views are unimportant and wrong?  I doubt it.  Actually, no way.  If a proclamation was espoused that acclaimed any other deity or other than a Baptist Christian doctrine of religion it would be laughed out of capital.  The religious content of the bill is what is important, which is why I think it is inappropriate.  

I would oppose such a proclamation from Christians, Jews, Atheists, Agnostics (fun statement that would be), Muslims, Zoroastrians, Hindus, Buddhists, Shintoists, Taoist, Wikkans, Sikhs,  Voodoo practitioners, Mormons, Scientologists, Native Americans or Pagans.  It isn't proper to generalize the beliefs of a population in a proclamation of the State.

[Townsend]

You are the individual who thinks that hate-speech against people with disabilities is fair game and funny.  So who is the narrow-minded bigot?

I didn't realize you have disabilities.  I will give you a wide berth.

[FOTD]

Since when has Inhofe been a religious zealot, SXSW???  Be a lot easier to package Sen. Coburn with Ms. Kern.

It's Inhofe's desire to discredit science and several other faux pas that make us a national joke. And the masses keep reelecting them....this makes us look even more ridiculous. Jimmy is our state celebrity like it or not. Sally Kern is trying hard to be our cult of personality example.

H2O, This demon attained peace through the devil. Therefore, FOTD has the right to pass judgement on the "righteous".

[waterboy]

I was referring to you and your sentiment which seems to dominate these 'threads.'  See, you said that Kern and people who believe in Christian morality - the 'moralists' - 'dominate' Sooner thought. Must be weird driving around, shopping, going to meetings, thinking that the majority of the people you see and interact with are morons, idiots, whatever hateful things you all can call them.  I feel great in this town and this State! Sorry you all are so miserable.

I don't dominate any threads unless they are about river development and then yes, I am irritatingly passionate. But I understand that my attitudinal frame of reference is determined by my experiences, which may not be shared by others. That is what separates me and us other miserables from you and the moralists. I know you exist and acknowledge your cult and respect our country's heritage. I would not use my government to issue proclamations designed to humiliate you for seeing river development in a different light. You see anyone outside your cult as needing such proclamations to get us back to your structure of thought.  Perhaps you think your moral values are superior to mine. You're as weird as Kern.

BTW, I didn't say what you allege. You inferred that from what I said. And as far as interacting with morons, idiots etc. in Oklahoma, well....I think the stats plastered in the media along with Kern's proclamations makes that case. Child abuse, poor test scores, addiction rates, obesity, cigarette consumption, domestic abuse, low income, meth production etc. etc. We're always near the top of those lists. Why doesn't she attack those problems? Is this her best effort to do so?

[FOTD]

If churches want to circulate such an initiative to bring morals back to America, I think that's great.  That is where it belongs.  What chaps me on this is a state representative using her elected position to try and cram a moral code down people's throats.

I will agree with Kern on a couple of things: America does have a deep religious heritage, of which the majority practice one form or other of the JUDEO-Christian faith.  I also do agree there's been a gradual erosion of appreciation for that heritage and a general erosion of what is considered morally acceptible in the mind of the average person. 

However, I don't think it appropriate that she try and make her proclamation seem more legitimate by using her job title to pass off her moral code.  I've also got to say she's got some really moonbat notions about homosexuality and locusts or the economy.   

Fixed that for you Cascia boy....

[tim huntzinger]

I didn't realize you have disabilities.  I will give you a wide berth.

When the cyber-bullying act in Congress passes, the words you have attacked with me with make you liable for prosecution.  Fair warning.

[Conan71]

It's Inhofe's desire to discredit science and several other faux pas that make us a national joke. And the masses keep reelecting them....this makes us look even more ridiculous. Jimmy is our state celebrity like it or not. Sally Kern is trying hard to be our cult of personality example.

H2O, This demon attained peace through the devil. Therefore, FOTD has the right to pass judgement on the "righteous".

So you are saying that government-sponsored hysteria over global warming is acceptible, right?

[cannon_fodder]

When the cyber-bullying act in Congress passes, the words you have attacked with me with make you liable for prosecution.  Fair warning.

Did you just threaten to sue someone for being mean to you on the internet?

[Conan71]

Fixed that for you Cascia boy....

Definitely didn't mean to leave out my Hebrew friends

[PepePeru]

Do you think the majority of Okies are idiots, morons, et al for hewing to a fundamentalist Christian sentiment?

I'm going to ripoff Carlin here...
Think how dumb an average Okie is; then realize that half of them are dumber than that.

So, to answer your question...
If you're a fundie Okie, chances are, yes you're an idiot.