North Tulsa what is going on?

[XEALS for THRILLS]

I realize that it takes a lot of helpers to complete a project.  What are the Church's doing and who are the leaders in North Tulsa that have the ability to CHANGE the pathetic situation that is going on over there?  What Church's are united?

[FOTD]

I realize that it takes a lot of helpers to complete a project.  What are the Church's doing and who are the leaders in North Tulsa that have the ability to CHANGE the pathetic situation that is going on over there?  What Church's are united?

Scapegoating Vilifying their multi denominational congregations after 90 years of intolerance towards blacks by this city will not help.

Physically, the north side was separated by highways. Educationally, the north side was cut off from equal educational resources. Emotionally, the north side was brought down by the worst race riot known to mankind. Socially, the north side was never included.

The pathetic situation has been going on over there at the hands of the city's white master race for nearly a century.

[XEALS for THRILLS]

No answer I guess to the leaders?  Who are the leaders and What Churchs are attempting to change their situation?

[XEALS for THRILLS]

If the people could make it back then than they could make it now!!!  Then it was legal to hold them back!!  What's holding the North Side Back??

[sgrizzle]

Seneca Scott and Jabar Shumate are both more active than every other state rep in the city. They have meetings all the time talking about dozens of projects they have going on. You can't judge what North Tulsa is doing from a Starbucks in South Tulsa. Tulsa EDC has been working with the city EDC, Henderson, etc on a variety of fronts as well.

[XEALS for THRILLS]

Results is the name of the game!!  What results have they produced?

[Wilbur]

No answer I guess to the leaders?  Who are the leaders and What Churchs are attempting to change their situation?

Why do folks constantly blame churches in North Tulsa for failing to act?  How many churches in South Tulsa are responsible for business expansion and growth?

[XEALS for THRILLS]

What is the main reason that businesses are not going to the North Side?  What's the main reason that there is no grocery store on North Peoria?  There are enough people buying groceries.  There are enough people shopping for clothes, toys, music, CARS, etc....  The job of the church is to lift the moral IN THE COMMUNITY to change lives and further the gospel of Jesus Christ OUTSIDE OF THERE BUILDING.  Is the moral high or low on the North Side?  Who COULD BE more EFFECTIVE at stopping Prostitution, Drug Trafficking, Gang Violence, etc church or law enforcement?  Virgin st. is a very popular street for prostitution.  I wonder what would happen if church's where teaching Daily classes in each of the projects?  Classes to educate on literature, family communication, job skills, PARENTING, business planning, etc......  The only church that I hear about doing things at all on a DAILY basis is from the South Side......   Why is that? 

It really bother's me that generation after generation after generation refuses to help train up their community.  It's like the U.S. going into a country under brutal communism, freeing the people and they still choose to live in or look for the government to help them when they have all of the tools that they need.  When will the excuses stop?  Ok, i've probably upset some people but the reality is that there is no significant unity amongst the church's in North Tulsa.  Until they unify and take this thing head on then it will always be this way.  They are not doing their job by not unifying.....

[Wilbur]

What is the main reason that businesses are not going to the North Side?  What's the main reason that there is no grocery store on North Peoria?  There are enough people buying groceries.  There are enough people shopping for clothes, toys, music, CARS, etc....  The job of the church is to lift the moral IN THE COMMUNITY to change lives and further the gospel of Jesus Christ OUTSIDE OF THERE BUILDING.  Is the moral high or low on the North Side?  Who COULD BE more EFFECTIVE at stopping Prostitution, Drug Trafficking, Gang Violence, etc church or law enforcement?  Virgin st. is a very popular street for prostitution.  I wonder what would happen if church's where teaching Daily classes in each of the projects?  Classes to educate on literature, family communication, job skills, PARENTING, business planning, etc......  The only church that I hear about doing things at all on a DAILY basis is from the South Side......   Why is that? 

It really bother's me that generation after generation after generation refuses to help train up their community.  It's like the U.S. going into a country under brutal communism, freeing the people and they still choose to live in or look for the government to help them when they have all of the tools that they need.  When will the excuses stop?  Ok, i've probably upset some people but the reality is that there is no significant unity amongst the church's in North Tulsa.  Until they unify and take this thing head on then it will always be this way.  They are not doing their job by not unifying.....

If you truly believe prostitution, drugs and gangs only happen on the north side, you seriously need to take in inward look.

What specific churches in South Tulsa are dealing with drugs, gangs and prostitution?

[XEALS for THRILLS]

If you truly believe prostitution, drugs and gangs only happen on the north side, you seriously need to take in inward look.

What specific churches in South Tulsa are dealing with drugs, gangs and prostitution?

I never stated only happening on the North Side......  I stated I personally only know of one church doing activities on the North Side on a daily basis.  Activities meaning going into the projects and different neighbor hoods and doing ministry, classes on parenting, etc.....  The businesses and church involvement on the south side are plentiful compared to the North Side. The church in specific is Victory Christian Center's Mobile Kids Club. They also have purchased land and are creating changes in that area.  However there doesn't appear to be much networking with other church's. 
So because they are going into the projects and higher crime/ poverty area.  They are dealing with these things: drugs, prostitution, gangs, etc..

Which goes back to my point that the church's on the North Side are not unified!!

[MDepr2007]

Church On The Move is a north side church and they have plenty of youth activities. Don't forget that the Tulsa north side is more than the area you want to sector off. The church's are not at fault except for providing freebies that continue's the Gov'ts catch 22 system  ie: welfare, HUD (section anything to hinder self pride and pulling up their boot straps. It's more money for each kid you produce and it's more money to stay un-married.
 The Gov't programs are needed but enforcement of it's abuse is needed more along with more requirments to meet if you stay on them. The church's do not deserve a blame when they can be overwhelmed with the picking up of the pieces from a failed system and straining to have the resources to fix the problem.

Something like that IMO

[waterboy]

I don't buy into your premise anyway. I doubt that if all the churches in North Tulsa were unified that they could solve the problems there. Wilbur makes a good point. I remember a house of prostitution that was closed back in the 90's. It was a half block from a Catholic school. Catholics are pretty unified. It would help to have a united effort but if unified religion was the answer it would have made a bigger dent the last 2000 years.

The reason there are no grocery stores or other big retailers is simple. They fear you (cultures they don't understand or embrace). They fear the crime, they fear the theft and they fear low profitability. Problems there are now rooted in several generations. This is not racism per se, it is as you say, reality. Businessmen are pragmatic, seldom moralistic. You must start those businesses and show them how to be profitable.

I don't want to sound cynical. I applaud your energy in enlisting northside churches. It breaks my heart to see decent people being ravaged by drugs and crime each morning on the news. I pray for you all. However, if you seek unity in your area, continue to seek out alliances with those in other areas who know the disturbing treatment that led to problems over there. Be proud of your successes so far in getting the word out that your community is under siege by the basest elements and you are not going to surrender to them.

[XEALS for THRILLS]

Church On The Move is a north side church and they have plenty of youth activities. Don't forget that the Tulsa north side is more than the area you want to sector off. The church's are not at fault except for providing freebies that continue's the Gov'ts catch 22 system  ie: welfare, HUD (section anything to hinder self pride and pulling up their boot straps. It's more money for each kid you produce and it's more money to stay un-married.
 The Gov't programs are needed but enforcement of it's abuse is needed more along with more requirments to meet if you stay on them. The church's do not deserve a blame when they can be overwhelmed with the picking up of the pieces from a failed system and straining to have the resources to fix the problem.

Something like that IMO

You are still missing the point!!  The point is that the church's are not unifying!!  I mentioned one church that is doing their own thing and you are mentioning one church that is doing it's own thing!  Where is the unity in that?  The money idea is an interesting thought!!  As being a product I realize that married or not they give the same dollar amount if you live in the same house the father is still part of the calculated equation!!  The only thing that is provided is food and housing not more housing or food that actually gets one ahead!!

[XEALS for THRILLS]

Church On The Move is a north side church and they have plenty of youth activities. Don't forget that the Tulsa north side is more than the area you want to sector off. The church's are not at fault except for providing freebies that continue's the Gov'ts catch 22 system  ie: welfare, HUD (section anything to hinder self pride and pulling up their boot straps. It's more money for each kid you produce and it's more money to stay un-married.
 The Gov't programs are needed but enforcement of it's abuse is needed more along with more requirments to meet if you stay on them. The church's do not deserve a blame when they can be overwhelmed with the picking up of the pieces from a failed system and straining to have the resources to fix the problem.

Something like that IMO

The failed system is the church!!!!  What is the biblical role of the church?  What is the role of the government?

[XEALS for THRILLS]

I don't buy into your premise anyway. I doubt that if all the churches in North Tulsa were unified that they could solve the problems there. Wilbur makes a good point. I remember a house of prostitution that was closed back in the 90's. It was a half block from a Catholic school. Catholics are pretty unified. It would help to have a united effort but if unified religion was the answer it would have made a bigger dent the last 2000 years.

The reason there are no grocery stores or other big retailers is simple. They fear you (cultures they don't understand or embrace). They fear the crime, they fear the theft and they fear low profitability. Problems there are now rooted in several generations. This is not racism per se, it is as you say, reality. Businessmen are pragmatic, seldom moralistic. You must start those businesses and show them how to be profitable.

I don't want to sound cynical. I applaud your energy in enlisting northside churches. It breaks my heart to see decent people being ravaged by drugs and crime each morning on the news. I pray for you all. However, if you seek unity in your area, continue to seek out alliances with those in other areas who know the disturbing treatment that led to problems over there. Be proud of your successes so far in getting the word out that your community is under siege by the basest elements and you are not going to surrender to them.

You are not processing it either.  I apologize for my bad communication... the fear that you stated proves my "premise"  every huge move through history that church's unified FOR CHANGE happened..  Once again its the churches fulfilling their calling to unify and go after the problem head on!!  If all of the churches with their members where in each project housing on a daily basis teaching "how to fish" i.e. how to parent, budget, interact with society, get a good paying job, START A BUSINESS, etc.. then these conditions would not be as they are.  Those that are selling drugs and prostitutes would not be as prevalent as they are. The projects would produce successful people if these non-profits put the above resources into them.  It would be like living on a  "2nd chance" college campus.  Just think about it before you respond.