Coburn's Brain

[we vs us]

Perhaps I get a bit alarmed when I hear things like the government saying women should not have mamograms until they are 50.  A lot of women have been diagnosed with breast cancer well before they were even 40.  I've got two daugters and it runs in my family, so forgive me for having a bad sense of foreboding with more government intervention in healthcare. Next they will say no colon or prostate screening for me until much later.

Sorry, I don't trust people for sale to the highest bidder to have my best health interests at heart, least of all some lawyer from Illinois.

The gov won't keep you or yours from having a mammogram (or a colonoscopy, or whatever).  Have as many of those, and as early, as you want. They just won't pay for it. Or will pay you back less for it than they would if you were 50.  Or something.  And there would always be the opportunity for you to have a private insurer pay for it, or pay you back for it.  In neither case will the government actively prevent you from having a procedure. 

I still don't understand why you wouldn't distrust the system as it stands, where decisions are made not only by layers and layers of private bureaucracy but with profit margins -- not your health -- as a prime mover. 

Here's a great for-instance:  for 2010, my employer changed our insurance provider, and after doing some fine-grained math, I was able to determine that I will have $40 more taken out of each bi-monthly paycheck for substantially less coverage for my family.  If I'd wanted to upgrade to the only other option my employer offered, I'd essentially have a full 3rd of each bi-monthly paycheck taken out.

Why would they downgrade our coverage so drastically?  Well, times are tight, as they are for everyone, and health coverage is a huge expense, as it is for everyone.  Caught between falling revenues and ever-increasing health costs, they are doing the only thing they can do, which is pass the problem along to their employees. 

In this case, what is the company's option and what are my options?  I can choose to go my own way and purchase individual coverage for MUCH more, or I can be uninsured and essentially spin the wheel, and hope that I and my family stay healthy, paying out of pocket for the occasional dr/dentist/eye dr. visit.  I can leave my employer and search for another job that might or might not offer better coverage or more money.  Of course, we're in a recession and there's no guarantee of finding work at all, much less a job that fits my family's needs. 

The company itself is kind of screwed.  It really doesn't matter how committed my employer is to offering good benefits to its workers; at some point the double digit price increases year on year will make it impossible for the company not to shed its coverage. A couple bad years for my industry are just accelerating the process.

My point in charting this all out is to say that pretty much every adult has gone toe to toe with this system in some way or another, and that rising prices are a lot more macro than simply being based on a collective failure to eat right and exercise.  There're a bunch of moving pieces, and that includes the background noise of the economy at large. 

[guido911]

I am a "HAVE" right now, dumba$$.
And I was just as good of a person and just as hard of a worker when I was a "have-not."

I have friends/family who have done without health insurance.... and they work full time.

God forbid I mention "workers" --- it makes gweed think I'm a hippy-Stalinist.  

No jerkwad, it's not about the "workers". Man you are such an idiot. You, not me, brought up the tired "haves" and "have not" bull crap in a previous post once again--which I should have expected since it is your freakin calling card. That, and of course, "gimme gimme gimme".

[guido911]

I am curious, how many people commenting on the subject of health care reform are actually in the delivery of health care and the industry? I am not trying to diminish the opinions of those here not in the industry (or disgruntled patients), I just would like to hear some opinions of those on the front lines.

[FOTD]

Coburn and Vitter preventing Democrats from co-sponsoring public option amendment.

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/12/04/coburn-vitter-public-plan/


Senator Dr. Coburn is part of the MIC, no, not that MIC, the Medical Insurance Complex. It is in HIS and his OWNERS best interest to scare seniors to pressure their representatives to vote against reform. Senator Dr.Coburn is a disgrace to the medical profession. He should remember his Hippocratic Oath which says inpart....
"In every house where I come I will enter only for the good of my patients,keeping myself far from all intentional ill-doing and all seduction.......
"If I keep this oath faithfully, may I enjoy my life and practice my art, respected by all men and in all times; but if I swerve from it or violate it, may the reverse be my lot."

Senator Dr. Coburn is part of the Medical Insurance Complex........ He should remember his Hippocratic Oath...
Hippocratic Oath? DOH....He thought it was the Hippocritic Oath.

[PonderInc]

I got off a plane in Dallas on Monday, and as I was waiting for my co-worker near the gate, Tom Coburn walked off the plane and stood right next to me.

I found myself at a total loss for (constructive) words.  Everything that came to mind contradicted what I was taught as a child ("If you can't say something nice...").

[TheArtist]

I got off a plane in Dallas on Monday, and as I was waiting for my co-worker near the gate, Tom Coburn walked off the plane and stood right next to me.

I found myself at a total loss for (constructive) words.  Everything that came to mind contradicted what I was taught as a child ("If you can't say something nice...").

I am no child,,, I would have said a few choice things.

[USRufnex]

No jerkwad, it's not about the "workers". Man you are such an idiot. You, not me, brought up the tired "haves" and "have not" bull crap in a previous post once again--which I should have expected since it is your freakin calling card. That, and of course, "gimme gimme gimme".

No, you ignorant weath-spooning slut, all I want is for the heavy handed influence of individual wealth and private profits to be significantly taken off the table when it comes to the public's access to healthcare.

Nonprofit Hospitals Need to Earn Their Exemptions
http://takingnote.tcf.org/2009/09/nonprofit-hospitals-need-to-earn-their-exemptions.html

"If nonprofit hospitals spend far less money on providing charity care for the poor and uninsured than the value of their federal, state and local tax exemptions, do they deserve those exemptions? What about if they turn away indigent patients or hound them with aggressive collection practices?"

Provena Hospital makes spirited defense of charity care, tax status to Illinois Supreme Court
http://archives.chicagotribune.com/2009/sep/23/business/chi-biz-provena-hospital-tax-exemption-sep23

"Siegel cited one court case that came before the high court more than a century ago – in 1907 – that involved a Catholic hospital that provided charity care to 5 percent of its patients."

Employers don't pay for your kids' education, your taxes pay for universal K-12 public education.
But I guess all those kids going to public schools are "moochers."

And using your Neil Boortz and Michelle Maulkin inspired logic against a small-scale public option in heathcare?..... are all those college students going to state schools in Stillwater, Norman and Tahlequah a buncha socialists?  Do they know the "true costs" of their subsidized higher education?  

It is not "tired" to talk of "haves and have-nots" when it comes to the current state of our employer-based healthcare system.
It's TRUE.

Repeat the truth often enough, and even some hard right conservatives will at some point begrudgingly agree with you.

Our stories are not "propaganda."

I am a HAVE.  My employer's insurance paid for my lifesaving laparoscopic surgery a year and a half ago.
So, I understand the value of cutting edge medical technology and am against anything that would compromise the continuing progression of life-saving medical research.  Wealthy people, union members and middle aged men who can't get a woody all contribute to profits in the system that can in-turn be used to finance the next medical miracle..... or the gubmint can subsidize the research, which it currently does through the Natl Institutes of Health and the Natl Science Foundation.......

I paid a few thousand dollars out of pocket, a fraction of the cost of the care I received.
I even got paid a certain fraction of my salary while I was in bed recovering.
I saw the medical bills, I saw what was charged.... and I saw the EXTRA $$$ I had to pay out of pocket when a doctor took advantage of my cancer diagnosis to recommend his own out-of-network physician-owned boutique hospital...... choice, my a$$...

Since my employer has thousands and thousands of employees, the company is able to better absorb the costs than having to rely on small business HSA's and/or a "neighbor's bake sale" and/or my own limited nest egg.... these benefits are able to be used by families of employees, so if I married my sister, she could get a doctor recommended colonoscopy (hmmm, I hear in Arkansas...)  ..... otherwise, I guess she's just another member of the "moocher class".....

IMHO, this is MORALLY WRONG.  And if there's anything I learned from the young college Republicans back in the Reagan Era, it was the battle cry:  "Stand for something, or you'll fall for anything."



If I were a socialist, I'd be calling for single-payer socialized medicine.
I am not.

If I were a communist, my employer and all other employers would be turned over to government controlled entities and their politically-minded bureaucrats.
I have never been one of those people.

If I were a capitalist, my employer and most other private employers would have the freedom to be able to buy and sell their products with a minimal amount of government interference.  
Yes, I am one of those people.  But I believe that self indulgent, laissez-faire, Ayn Rand-style capitalists and dogmatic Grover Nordquist-style anti-taxers are a buncha heartless douchebags.

To me, this means that people who make more money should be able to buy beautiful homes, take overseas vacations and luxury cruises, collect sports cars, and spend their money propping up the local opera company, buying murals from TheArtist, etc, etc, etc.... I even believe that if we're serious about the virtues of capitalism, then we shouldn't be surprised when big employers use their status to leverage local and state governments into giving them a better deal in an effort to bring jobs to those localities.  And we shouldn't be surprised to hear the words "early childhood education" coming out of Obama's and Biden's mouths back in the presidential debates thanks to some wealthy guy from Tulsa who was a "bundler" for that campaign.

I am a firm believer that $$$ talks and BS walks..... so, if I want a high level pro soccer team in Tulsa, then I want wealthy people in Tulsa to have enough money to spend on that endeavor if they agree with me.... usrufnex@tulsaroughnecks.com is waiting for your donations and ideas.... don't let Henry Paulson's kid be the only one who gets to have this kind of fun....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merritt_Paulson

But when it comes to healthcare, please spare me the civic virtues of the capitalist profit motive.
It smells funny when y'all's politicians do that.

[guido911]

No, you ignorant weath-spooning slut, all I want is for the heavy handed influence of individual wealth and private profits to be significantly taken off the table and given to me when it comes to the public's access to healthcare.

FIFY.  Also, in your last post you said something about having cancer. Gee, that's the first time I have heard that. I mean, it's not as if you are like those persons who keep repeating their unfortunate medical conditions over and over again in the hopes of swaying opinion on a controversial issue through personalization. Really, those people are either self-centered/self-aggrandizing egotists or perpetual pity party throwing complainers who sometimes forget that diseases such as cancer may have taken the lives of fathers and uncles of those in this forum.

[USRufnex]

FIFY.  Also, in your last post you said something about having cancer. Gee, that's the first time I have heard that. I mean, it's not as if you are like those persons who keep repeating their unfortunate medical conditions over and over again in the hopes of swaying opinion on a controversial issue through personalization. Really, those people are either self-centered/self-aggrandizing egotists or perpetual pity party throwing complainers who sometimes forget that diseases such as cancer may have taken the lives of fathers and uncles of those in this forum.

Yeah, I got colon cancer so I could use it against a freeper in a healthcare debate.....  

Pity party?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baBogjn6cAA&feature=related

I don't know which is worse.... Coburn or the cheering crowd who would NEVER GO NEXT DOOR TO HELP WITH THEIR NEIGHBOR'S FEEDING TUBE.

Shame on you.  Especially when you have the gall to wear your military service and your politically motivated philanthropy on your sleeve.
You care more about the unborn than the born and living...
Idiot.

I think Gilbert & Sullivan wrote this song about you....

When I was a lad I served a term
As office boy to an attorney's firm
I cleaned the windows and I swept the floor
And I polished up the handle of the big front door
I polished up that handle so carefully
That now I am the Ruler of the Queen's Navy

As office boy I made such a mark
That they gave me the post of a junior clerk
I served the writs with a smile so bland
And I copied all the letters in a big round hand
I copied all the letters in a hand so free
That now I am the Ruler of the Queen's Navy

In serving writs I made such a name
That an articled clerk I soon became
I wore clean collars and a brand-new suit
For the Pass Examination at the Institute
And that Pass Examination did so well for me
That now I am the Ruler of the Queen's Navy

Of legal knowledge I acquired such a grip
That they took me into the partnership
And that junior partnership I ween
Was the only ship that I ever had seen
But that kind of ship so suited me
That now I am the Ruler of the Queen's Navy

I grew so rich that I was sent
By a pocket borough into Parliament
I always voted at my Party's call
And I never thought of thinking for myself at all
I thought so little, they rewarded me
By making me the Ruler of the Queen's Navy

Now, landsmen all, whoever you may be
If you want to rise to the top of the tree
If your soul isn't fettered to an office stool
Be careful to be guided by this golden rule
Stick close to your desks and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of the Queen's Navy

[USRufnex]

Coburn wouldn't know the first thing about this bill's impact on Medicare and Medicare, because he didn't accept them as payment in his medical practice in Muskogee. He only takes premium paying customers. It's all about the money, and how much he can make.

Exactly.

Then he plays the fear card.... liar.

Coburn tells seniors: 'You're going to die soon' if the Senate health care bill passes.
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/12/01/coburn-die-soon-health/

Study links 45,000 U.S. deaths to lack of insurance
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Nearly 45,000 people die in the United States each year -- one every 12 minutes -- in large part because they lack health insurance and can not get good care, Harvard Medical School researchers found in an analysis released on Thursday.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE58G6W520090917

"We're losing more Americans every day because of inaction ... than drunk driving and homicide combined," Dr. David Himmelstein, a co-author of the study and an associate professor of medicine at Harvard, said in an interview with Reuters.

Overall, researchers said American adults age 64 and younger who lack health insurance have a 40 percent higher risk of death than those who have coverage.

-------^^^THIS is the true meaning of "class warfare."  Literally.^^^

[FOTD]

Franken Double-dares Coburn On Public Option
By Michelle Chen
http://airamerica.com/politics/12-05-2009/franken-double-dares-coburn-public-option/
"As we reported earlier this week, Senators Tom Coburn (R-Okla) and David Vitter (R-La) have cleverly upped the ante in the health care standoff by challenging members of Congress to sign onto the proposed public option health care plan. Their assumption being that, since socialized medicine is so plainly evil, no lawmaker would have the audacity to inflict such a horror upon themselves. Though some conservatives might see this as a chance to bemoan the perils of government-sponsored health coverage, Dan Carter noted that "by the time the new health care proposal is in full effect around 2013, Coburn will be 65 and--you guessed it--basking in the warm glow of a government run, publicly funded plan called Medicare." A perfect example of a seamless transition to a public health plan.

On Friday, Sen. Al Franken said he was willing to take Coburn up on his offer. NewsOK reports:

Sen. Al Franken, D-Minn., said in a speech on the Senate floor that he wants to join Coburn's effort to force senators to join any public plan created by Congress.

"I will have no problem at all enrolling in this plan," Franken said. He said he recently told his wife that they should enroll in a public plan if Congress creates one and that she wholeheartedly agreed.

"So, yeah, I'm perfectly serious about this," Franken said.

Will Coburn show he's every bit as serious as his colleagues across the aisle and walk the talk on health reform? By the time the final vote is cast, we'll know who was bluffing. "

Who is going to let the deadhead pimp our dickhead?

[guido911]

Shame on you.  Especially when you have the gall to wear your military service and your politically motivated philanthropy on your sleeve.
You care more about the unborn than the born and living...
Idiot.

I caught hel! for repeating my military service on this board just as you are right now. So you can take your shame and stick it somewhere.

In unrelated news, video of usruf as a toddler has been unearthed:

Never quite grew up.

[FOTD]

I caught hel! for repeating my military service on this board just as you are right now. So you can take your shame and stick it somewhere.

In unrelated news, video of usruf as a toddler has been unearthed:

Never quite grew up.

The Psychological Implosion of Our Soldiers



http://www.truthout.org/1207092


You proving All-American boys who would qualify as A1 Aryans are not allowed to get PTSD? Something happened in those daze of trying to train Guido...

And evidently, Doctor No could care less about our vets your mental health issues....

[guido911]

The Psychological Implosion of Our Soldiers



http://www.truthout.org/1207092


You proving All-American boys who would qualify as A1 Aryans are not allowed to get PTSD? Something happened in those daze of trying to train Guido...

And evidently, Doctor No could care less about our vets your mental health issues....

Please aox. I cannot see how anyone can buy your over the top righteous indignation over the treatment of our soldiers and veterans. You couldn't care less about them you bloviating coward.

[FOTD]

Please aox. I cannot see how anyone can buy your over the top righteous indignation over the treatment of our soldiers and veterans. You couldn't care less about them you bloviating coward.

Guido? or Coburn's connection?