TMAPC Commissioner, Elizabeth Wright: Public Hearing

[Conan71]

You're the one who chose non-sequiturs instead of addressing the fact you moved in behind an empty lot then got pissed off and figure you are owed something because a big box store was built behind your neighborhood.  Sheesh, get over it or move.

[inteller]

that has nothing to fu cking do with the topic of this thread.

...keep proving my point....or add something of value to the thread....if you are capable.

[FOTD]

W T F happen to Groove Crusher aka Spartacuss aka Cannon Fodder?

He'd set this thread straight.

[inteller]

doubtful, but probably a better chance than what the groupthink section has offered so far.

[RecycleMichael]

I haven't completely followed the ruckus over this appointment, so forgive me if I miss some of the points. In the spirit of declaring a conflict...I gave Liz Wright a small campaign contribution.

Did she fail to recuse herself on a vote regarding a property in the area where she was also President of the homeowner's association? This is what I heard.

If this is true, it doesn't matter who appointed her or how good a commissioner she is in my book. I would be disappointed to lose such a good commissioner, but this seems to be a fatal flaw.

Can someone shed some more light on this matter?

[inteller]

read the minutes linked at the outset of this thread and come to your own conclusion.

I read them all and came to the conclusion that it doesn't matter if she was the POTUS, she was asking very legitimate questions (regarding handicap spaces) that the developer refused to answer and instead raised accusations of her conflict of interest.  If it is a conflict of interest to look out for the handicapped then I'd say we are doomed as a city.  Bottom line is she stood no financial benefit ....and there is no perception of conflict simply because of her title at the HOA.  You could go draw some loose association with any of the commissioners and something they voted on....that doesn't mean there is a conflict of interest (percieved or otherwise).  Plus perception is a moving target and often times one of individual opinion.  Also, none of her actions affected the outcome of the vote (since she is in the minority vote most of the time anyways)

Then the next question that naturally arises is, if this was such a big deal then why didn't the county commissioners address it sometime LAST YEAR?  Or even so, why didn't Karen Ketih address it DAY ONE of taking office, instead of waiting months after being in office?  The groupthink captiulators will offer up the lame excuse that the commissioners can't be aware of all happenings at TMAPC, to which I say THAT'S THEIR JOB!  

Liz Wright should finish her term.  Developers should feel uncomfortable answering the hard questions until she is gone.  TMAPC is going away anyways so Keith would do better to save face and just let this one die.

[MichaelBates]

I haven't completely followed the ruckus over this appointment, so forgive me if I miss some of the points. In the spirit of declaring a conflict...I gave Liz Wright a small campaign contribution.

Did she fail to recuse herself on a vote regarding a property in the area where she was also President of the homeowner's association? This is what I heard.

If this is true, it doesn't matter who appointed her or how good a commissioner she is in my book. I would be disappointed to lose such a good commissioner, but this seems to be a fatal flaw.

Can someone shed some more light on this matter?

For a supporter, you seem awfully quick to throw her under the bus.

Liz Wright gave a very clear answer on the very first page of this thread. According to Wright, the Florence Park Neighborhood (not homeowners') Association did not take a position for or against the QuikTrip rezoning, so there was no conflict of interest.

Call it a hunch, but your question seems disingenuous to me, especially since you asserted that the answer was yes two days ago on my Facebook page:

Did you forget to mention the meeting where she spoke as neighborhood president against the Quiktrip expansion at 21st and Harvard? She should have recused herself from that issue, but instead went ahead and voted.

That alone should have gotten her off the commission.

I like her and like what she says and fights for at those meetings, but you can't blatantly break rules.

My response:

I can always count on you to stand up for the overdog, Michael.

What rule did she break? The neighborhood association took no stand on the QuikTrip expansion. She had no personal financial or organizational interest either way.

If that alone should have gotten her off the commission, why did they wait an entire 18 months to try?

If you will read the minutes of that meeting, they do not back up your statement that "she spoke as neighborhood president."

http://www.tmapc.org/Approved%20Minutes/2008/05-21-08.pdf

[Tony C]

I attended the so called hearing and I can assure you that Ms Keith had no proof of any of her charges. All she had to do was claim it to make it true. It appears that because the vote on QT's PUD was not unanimous is cause enough to remove Ms Wright. This forum was quoted as the smoking gun, although none of this was around until after Ms Wrights' integrity was publicly attacked by our celebrity politician, Karen Keith. Political assasination is what this is about. Ms Wright opposed Maria Barnes and showed an interest in holding public office. The Tulsa World, Maria Barnes and Karen Keith won't stand for that. After all Ms Wright isn't one of the chosen.

[RecycleMichael]

I am clearly outnumbered here.

I don't attend these meetings nor normally have an inclination to. I am not trying to throw Ms. Wright under the bus nor protect QT or any developer. I honestly gave her the contribution because she came on this forum to discuss issues. Her starting this thread and writing as much as she has makes me like her as well.

You guys are the hardliners here. Anybody who attacks a developer is a hero to you and you don't care how or why their motivation. Denigrating public officials must be a sport to you as well. I also remember both inteller and Michael Bates railing against mid-towners and their influence. I guess their outrage was conveniently just against all the other mid-towners, not the ones they like.

I don't think a neighborhood president should vote as a commissioner on a zoning matter in her neighborhood. I think that I would resign from my post as a neighborhood leader if I was being appointed to a commission that decided development versus neighborhood interests.

I have never spoke before the planning commission on any issue nor do I see a need to in my future. I like Ms. Wright and like having a balance of different interests on such authorities. I think that should be our goal.

I do, however, see a conflict in her voting on this matter. Maybe I am naive and don't see the same conflict in other commissioners on other issues, but this one is being discussed on a forum where I get lots of my opinions from. I even agree with DowntownNow on this matter and he and I disagree on everything. She should have recused herself on this item. Her failure to do so has led us to this point.

[moonovrmia]

The bottom line.. can you say Witch Hunt? The FPNA had valid questions to QT and the city concerning the enlargement of their store at 21st and Harvard. Doubling the number of fuel pumps, yet no traffic study done at this busy intersection addressing a better flow of inbound/outbound traffic. The fact a duplex and a home were purchased, encroaching into the neighborhood, set a precedent. The duplex changed to light-office thru the backdoor. Lighting design, etc, etc. FPNA asked many valid questions, forcing QT to answer and when they got tired of answering our questions.. they brought Charles Norman in.. case closed. ( god rest his soul). The final meeting of the FPNA in the summer of 2008 when QT was discussed, Liz Wright turned the meeting over the the VP and left the room. If you look at the votes thruout her term on the TMAPC, she's the lone wolf on many issues. Yet she asks hard questions, valid questions and is the only member on this board representing the people versus big business, developers and the good-old-boy network. She can be tenacious like a dog with a bone.. but she is not stupid! She has ruffled a lot of feathers, but those feathers needed ruffled.  This city needs a change to balance neighborhoods and developers working together in concert, yet with the current leaders, it's not going to happen. Maybe with the City Council change, the lines of communication can open again and we can work as a unified, progressive city. The few who have "crammed down our throats" anything they wished has got to stop. And if they oust Liz Wright, I say every county commissioner should be placed on notice.

[patric]

She should have recused herself on this item. Her failure to do so has led us to this point.

Or, more to the point, created a political opportunity for an opponent to call in a favor.
Isnt that the real issue here?   

[waterboy]

I think you have something there Patrick. She created an opportunity to challenge her credibility by not stepping aside. She may be righteous but she was not careful and powerful interests seized upon that mistake. I can't blame them, that is what powerful interests do.

Her campaign materials and posts here have convinced me she is a well educated, serious person but I saw little real world experience. I think she  may have underestimated her opponents. They apparently are better street fighters.

From my perspective, it is tiresome to see this neverending battle between the protectors of neighborhoods and their perceived enemies who sired them.

[inteller]

( god rest his soul). The final meeting of the FPNA in the summer of 2008 when QT was discussed, Liz Wright turned the meeting over the the VP and left the room. If you look at the votes thruout her term on the TMAPC, she's the lone wolf on many issues. Yet she asks hard questions, valid questions and is the only member on this board representing the people versus big business, developers and the good-old-boy network. She can be tenacious like a dog with a bone.. but she is not stupid! She has ruffled a lot of feathers, but those feathers needed ruffled.  This city needs a change to balance neighborhoods and developers working together in concert, yet with the current leaders, it's not going to happen. Maybe with the City Council change, the lines of communication can open again and we can work as a unified, progressive city. The few who have "crammed down our throats" anything they wished has got to stop. And if they oust Liz Wright, I say every county commissioner should be placed on notice.

I agree with everything you said except the god rest his soul part...

[moonovrmia]

In response to Inteller.. It is the start of the Holiday Season and I was being nice.

[Rico]

"From my perspective, it is tiresome to see this neverending battle between the protectors of neighborhoods and their perceived enemies who sired them."

posted by h20 boy

This point is precisely what will stand in the way of "PlanItTulsa" making a substantive change.

The "us" vs. "them" mentality is not how you bring people together that have a common goal.