old city hall... sell sell sell!

[DTowner]

The timing and lack of details of this new plan is frustrating.  I wonder if this building is really large enough to viably contain office, retail, residential and hospitality?  I also question whether touting the development of the old Albertson's location is a ringing endorsement of this group's vision and foresight into development that's the right fit at the right location in Tulsa.

The city needs to quickly set up a process for bids with a firm deadline so that everyone's cards are put on the table and deal for the best project can get made.

[richardnixon68]

No it is not the same guy that runs Los Americas, he just bought the grocery store from Omega Alpha.

[Conan71]

The timing and lack of details of this new plan is frustrating.  I wonder if this building is really large enough to viably contain office, retail, residential and hospitality?  I also question whether touting the development of the old Albertson's location is a ringing endorsement of this group's vision and foresight into development that's the right fit at the right location in Tulsa.

The city needs to quickly set up a process for bids with a firm deadline so that everyone's cards are put on the table and deal for the best project can get made.

Since it appears the city has stalled long enough to get at least one competitive bidder to step forward, I agree with Bunney that they should put out an RFP which would clearly outline the ultimate property use, sources of financing, and completion date.  This would help shake out any bidder who cannot complete the project in a timely manner or who might not have all financing in place prior to starting the project.

[RecycleMichael]

So the property sits for months with no offers...a private company with a completed project a couple of hundred yards away makes an offer...nothing happens for eight weeks...then the day of the vote by the council...a new bidder shows up, but won't disclose details of their offer.

The first offer is $1 million on a property worth purportedly six times that. Turns out the second offer is for $1.1 million. Do I hear $1.11 million? How about $1.11 million and 99 cents?

I hate to see the city miss out on $100,000 in revenue, but don't want us to be in the situation of becoming some sort of super slow auctioneer.

The city is losing $50,000 a month on this building and two months later the offer is $100,000 more. Sounds to me that at best we are back to even. If the second offer ends up taking more months, we will be behind again. Just think, if we take another 20 months to do the sale, we will have lost all value. Anybody want to book that bet?

I say...make the sale to the guy who first offered and has experience renovating a building into a hotel two hundred yards away. This new offer isn't that much higher to make us keep waiting.

[Townsend]

So the property sits for months with no offers...a private company with a completed project a couple of hundred yards away makes an offer...nothing happens for eight weeks...then the day of the vote by the council...a new bidder shows up, but won't disclose details of their offer.

The first offer is $1 million on a property worth purportedly six times that. Turns out the second offer is for $1.1 million. Do I hear $1.11 million? How about $1.11 million and 99 cents?

I hate to see the city miss out on $100,000 in revenue, but don't want us to be in the situation of becoming some sort of super slow auctioneer.

The city is losing $50,000 a month on this building and two months later the offer is $100,000 more. Sounds to me that at best we are back to even. If the second offer ends up taking more months, we will be behind again. Just think, if we take another 20 months to do the sale, we will have lost all value. Anybody want to book that bet?

I say...make the sale to the guy who first offered and has experience renovating a building into a hotel two hundred yards away. This new offer isn't that much higher to make us keep waiting.

I give you the TDA.  Sound  the trumpets.

[jtcrissup]

"Tony Lombardi, managing broker for Stan Frisbie Real Estate representing the Omega Alpha confirmed the offer Friday, but would not release the amount.

From www.stanfrisbie.com:

"Stan Frisbie Real Estate, LLC has played a major role in every power center, big box retail land transaction in Metro Tulsa over the past ten years."

"Stan Frisbie Real Estate, LLC controls over 4,800 acres of retail, residential and investment property valued at over $300,000,000."

Anyone else noticed Stan Frisbie signs up around town before?  What seems to be the common thread that you notice?  What I have noticed (and nothing other than casual observation to back this up) is the properties are sitting a LONG time before any development ever happens (I have been in Tulsa for 4 years now, and many of the sites still sit empty with his sign up).  This screams speculator to me, and would hope the TDA/City Council proceed with caution. I think his client (Omega Alpha) sees an oppurtunity to pay "just above" what someone else has already made KNOWN as their price that goes along with them spending a LOT of money to develop the existing building NOW and add VALUE to our downtown assets ASAP.  

What I fear they would do is pay 10% more up front, TDA and City Councilors are seen as "heroes" for holding out for a hundred thousand more while our city is in dire straights to find $$, and then the site sits empty, or is torn down immediately and then 5-15 years later the area blossoms a little more and the low hanging fruit has been developed THEN they sell to someone for a real nice return on their original "investment" of $1.1 Million plus holding costs (which would not be cheap if building remains in place, but if demo'd probably would not be much since the DT property is "taxed" based on improved SF plus raw land, and they could make enough on surface parking fees to cover annual holding costs, I would think).

Maybe I am reading too much into this?  I hope so.

Note:  Edited to reflect the counter-offer price of $1.1M which was just announced.  Time for an RFP and vetting of potential developer's plans.

[Conan71]

After seeing what the Snyders did with the Mayo and considering how far into disrepair that had slipped, I've got to say they are my sentimental favorite for the City Hall site.

[Townsend]

After seeing what the Snyders did with the Mayo and considering how far into disrepair that had slipped, I've got to say they are my sentimental favorite for the City Hall site.

Same here. 

They have a reason to fix it up and get it looking nice since it's a very noticable neighbor of the Mayo Hotel.

I say donate the Tulsa Club building to them...if the city can ever get an answer from the judge.

[custosnox]

I am also rooting for the snyders in this one. I've been suspicious of this other deal since it got introduced.  Of course I could just be biased since I have seen what has happened with the Mayo.

Not that I wouldn't love to see the Tulsa Club taken care of, but I would like to see it as something that would give omage to its original intent rather then as a hotel.

[cannon_fodder]

3 years, $600,000 per year = $1.8mil in costs.

$1mil offer.

LOSS OF $800k.  Should have given it away the day we moved out to the most ambitious developer willing to make concrete assurances.  All this is noise... just make sure the developer is required to move.  No 1st street lofts allowed.

[we vs us]

That whole last-minute-bid thing stinks.  Something's fishy.

[spartanokc]

This happened in OKC with the Hill site in Deep Deuce. The morons at OCURA found themselves in the despicable position of nearly having to award a deal to the locally well-liked developers until the worst possible proposal jumped in with a last-minute deal, by getting rid of the TIF request (and OCURA failed to legally notify the other 3 developers with proposals). 4 years later: 20 out of 170 (downsized to 157) condos have been built, 3 have been sold, site is in foreclosure, and all the investors backed out while they still could.

That's just what development authorities do. They always squander a site.

[Rico]

This happened in OKC with the Hill site in Deep Deuce. The morons at OCURA found themselves in the despicable position of nearly having to award a deal to the locally well-liked developers until the worst possible proposal jumped in with a last-minute deal, by getting rid of the TIF request (and OCURA failed to legally notify the other 3 developers with proposals). 4 years later: 20 out of 170 (downsized to 157) condos have been built, 3 have been sold, site is in foreclosure, and all the investors backed out while they still could.

That's just what development authorities do. They always squander a site.

At present our Development Authority....a.k.a. TDA has assumed a very familiar posture.

"Hand extended, palm wide open, waiting to be greased.!"


If we get an "RFP" posted that can be translated for the "Good of the City"
It may pull this one out.

We can hope.

[SXSW]

When does the council vote on this or has the entire process been delayed?  It would be really nice to see some movement on this property.  Tulsa will continue to lose out on conventions without another hotel nearby.  The views from this building are great.  I went up there once and to the east is one of the better skyline views in the city, to the south and west you see the river valley, and to the north the Osage Hills. 

[RecycleMichael]

There is an agenda item on the Special meeting called for Monday night to declare "the real property owned by the city of Tulsa is no longer necessary for City's business and to authorize conveyance of said property to the Tulsa Development Authority".

The meeting is at 6pm at City Hall.