Political perceptions Re: North Tulsa Grocery Store

[custosnox]

I've often said that I am unhealthy because I can't afford to be healthy.  I've been trying to get back into shape lately and all that good jazz (started last year when I quit smoking).  Started buying fresh fruit and other goodly stuff, though I still bought wherever I could find it cheapest, like wally world.  It didn't last long because I ended up running out of money.  Now as I get ready to make some chili dogs, I sit here and wish I had some greens for a salad and maybe some fresh pineapple, then look at my wallet and get my head out of the clouds.

[Townsend]

I've often said that I am unhealthy because I can't afford to be healthy.  I've been trying to get back into shape lately and all that good jazz (started last year when I quit smoking).  Started buying fresh fruit and other goodly stuff, though I still bought wherever I could find it cheapest, like wally world.  It didn't last long because I ended up running out of money.  Now as I get ready to make some chili dogs, I sit here and wish I had some greens for a salad and maybe some fresh pineapple, then look at my wallet and get my head out of the clouds.

I can believe it.

The wife had a come-apart when her big clothes got too little so we ended up on weight watchers.

I'm eating much healthier and it's a huge increase in our grocery budget.

It's been worth it though.  She's much happier and my cholesterol/triglycerides took a huge dive.

[custosnox]

I can believe it.

The wife had a come-apart when her big clothes got too little so we ended up on weight watchers.

I'm eating much healthier and it's a huge increase in our grocery budget.

It's been worth it though.  She's much happier and my cholesterol/triglycerides took a huge dive.

I would concider it worth it as well if I could.  But if you only have $20 for food for the week, then you can eat unhealthy or starve healthy.  I don't like being hungry...

[JeffM]

I'm waiting for Reasor's to start stocking High Fiber Lays & Twinkies.

[Townsend]

I'm waiting for Reasor's to start stocking High Fiber Lays & Twinkies.

Even if they existed I don't think the commercials would ever tell the truth of what high fiber really does to a man...I mean what it really does.

[JeffM]

Well, I'm stuck on the high fiber diet and am missing a few inches of colon, so yeah.... anyhoo...

somebody wanna get this thread back on topic?....

[Conan71]

I would concider it worth it as well if I could.  But if you only have $20 for food for the week, then you can eat unhealthy or starve healthy.  I don't like being hungry...

I've been there and understand.  I've had to get by on Ramen noodles and considered it a treat to be able to afford a couple of Bueno bean burritos.

[TheArtist]

As an artist, my wages fluctuate considerably so I have had many episodes of "barely having enough to eat".  Each time I learn a little more and get better at fixing super cheap but healthy and tasty foods. 

Noodles, whole grain, mixed with some herbs and olive oil and some pan roasted veggies is great. 

Rice with an egg or two is great and you can add all kinds of things into that.

Get meat on sale, doesnt have to be the best cuts and freeze it so that you can use small portions in your concoctions.

Dried beans of different sorts and large stews can be portioned out into containers and frozen.

Frozen veggies and fruits are great sides and can again be added to the above concoctions lol.

Just last night I took some frozen strawberries, put them in a cup, zapped them in the microwave till they are hot, sprinkle on a little bit of sugar if you want.... deeeelicious.  And for a splurge, add a little vanilla ice cream,,,, heaven.

Spaghetti,,, look for the most inexpensive sauce that doesnt have any, or much, high fructose corn syrum. Packed with good stuff.   

Peanut butter and jelly. All natural peanut butter and low sugar jelly (or do the warmed fruit), yes costs a bit more but goes a long way.

Absolutely NO SODAS EVER!  We were too poor to have them as kids, and I have never got in the habit of drinking them.  Total waste of money. Drink unswetened tea, is very good for you.

Buy in bulk, look out for sales, Shop "around the edge", go very basic and have fun creating what are really old time, old world, staple recipes.  Even with just the few ideas I have listed above, you can create dozens and dozens of different tasty combinations.

I am sure others can add plenty more ideas on how to each healthy, tasty, inexpensive foods.

[waterboy]

That was good information Artist. And I think your summary is helpful. However, I think there is a disconnect between researchers who start with a premise that isn't well enough examined and then work towards analyzing every component to that particular premise. Their conclusions are then suspect. I can think of several problems with current research that are the result of intellectual and cultural biases. For instance, in your links I saw nothing relating to stress, employment, substance abuse, mental abuse, age and culture.

Show me a high stress employee who works long hours, and I'll show you a likely smoker, fast food consumer who's overweight, overcaffeinated, has no exercise program and is a heart attack waiting to happen. He's also likely to have a pretty good income.

Show me a Southern farmboy raised on grits, hogback, fried chicken, cigars, beer and long hours driving a tractor and I'll show you an unhealthy middle aged man outside of the norms for weight and lifespan but quite comfortable and unfamiliar with much fast food. Even the ones who went to Agricultural colleges.

Show me a child physically, sexually or mentally abused and I'll show you an adult likely to be unhealthy regardless of weight. The same with traumatized children. They all will exhibit extremes in food behavior.

There are no controls for heritage as well. For example, Samoans are overweight by many standards yet seem to be pretty healthy and happy and dang good football linemen. As people age their metabolism slows and they start to put on weight. Doesn't mean they aren't healthy either. People who swim the English Channel successfully tend to have higher concentrations of body fat, yet they are not unhealthy.

The disconnect comes when they fail to note that overweight people and unhealthy people are not defined or limited by income or employment status. Go looking for a red barn with a red flashlight and that's likely all you'll find. The more important factors in health are stress, culture and age. These are things we often have no control over and no amount of education in "correct" diets or easily found "healthy" foods are going to have much impact.

[waterboy]

Gas, and others. Perhaps your intentions were not to be classist or negative in regards to minorities, low income people or particular regions of the city. Perhaps your intentions were not to denigrate areas and demographics struggling to secure the basic amenities of shopping available to the rest of us. Perhaps you respect their leaders. Perhaps your remarks were not intended to gloat over the difficulties of marketing amongst high crime areas. That wasn't what it looked or felt like to me and I responded. You should be aware that as well educated, well heeled citizens posting on the only literate forum in town that your remarks carry some weight.

You chose the research and the statistics to reinforce what seemed to be logical or self apparent facts. I didn't ignore them. I believe they are not accurate. Fast food, fat people, and unhealthy people are all over the city in fact, all over the country. In the late 19th century that would have signaled a healthy economy and considered a positive physical feature along with pale skin. We're supposedly more intelligent now, but we still make false associations of health based on physical features and wealth. Its silly.

I understand why you guys are so smugly convinced of your views. It makes sense from where you operate. You have an employer who understands that lots of personal stuff is done on company time. Things like posting on TN, Dr.s apptmnts, car repair, hour or more lunches, some personal shopping and picking up a prescription or dry cleaning. He does it too. You work long hours though and you produce income. That balances out.  I know because I did that life. Self employed is even better cause you never have to even hide it!

It is humorous because you seem segregated from the very folks you seem intent on analyzing. How did you miss that a non professional couple each working, 40 + hours a week at an hourly paid job, with kids in school and an employer that will fire you if you call in sick, who doesn't allow personal time for health appointments or anything else like car repair and shopping might be stressed and resort to snacking, fast food and convenience stores instead of food plans and grocery shopping? They are stressed. It doesn't matter to their employer how well they produce. They are merely elements of production. Go to WHM on Union and observe their behavior. That's tons better than reading research. Someone breaks your windshield and steals your car and laptop you're pissed but you recover. Someone breaks their windshield and steals their car it could me a fast collapse into oblivion.

Yet they love their kids just like you. They go to church just like you and they try to live just like what they see on TV. They respect you, and I think you ought to return the favor.

[Breadburner]

You have lost it....

[Red Arrow]

Get meat on sale, doesnt have to be the best cuts and freeze it so that you can use small portions in your concoctions.

Ironically, the "best" cuts of meat are well marbled with fat.  Could be the "lesser" cuts of meat may be more healthy. I base this on seeing a Navy training manual listing cuts of beef as Prime, Choice, and maybe Good based on the fat marbling.   It's been a long time and I was an avionics electronic tech, one of my roomies wanted to be a cook.

[waterboy]

You have lost it....

I'll post quickly for you and simply, cause I know your boss is nearby and you can't finish your thoughts.

If I've lost it so has Dr. Christine Northrup. She was on PBS this morning and validated the posts I made on this subject in the last couple of days. She uses research on nutrition and consumer behavior in a more reasonable manner. May be politically hard for you to do but log on to pbs.org.

[rwarn17588]

You have lost it....

If you think waterboy's long post above is the sign of "losing it," then your critical thinking skills are suspect.

If you want an example of losing it, check FOTD's posts a few weeks ago just before he was either kicked off the forum or voluntarily left it. His musings were getting increasingly erratic.

[buckeye]

No, I agree with Breadburner, those recent posts are off track.

You basically ranted against the evil capitalist overlords, told us the working poor are too stressed to make good food choices and illegitimately assigned a wide range of hateful, prejudiced, and wildly inaccurate verbiage to ... well, everybody else in the thread.  There very well may be some good content in there somewhere, but it's all but invisible and invalidated by the rest.

Then there's always:

Go to WHM on Union and observe their behavior. That's tons better than reading research.

This goes pretty well with Shadows' Luddite ramblings, although probably 40 or 50 years' worth of cannabis less advanced.  Your posts are almost always well-reasoned and interesting if not a little too populist for my palate, but here you're filling the recently-created wacky-fringeland vacuum.

By the way, if anecdotal evidence really is the best way to go, there's always this:

http://users.rcn.com/cabbidge/Index.html
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On topic, it's no wonder the store's not doing very well with a combination of high prices and a dearth of well-known brands.  Perhaps the owner's strength is bringing a product to a fresh market that has no other options...and not so strong understanding the needs he's trying to fill with the new place.