Henry's Veto on Abortion Bills Overridden--Now Law

[guido911]

Ultrasounds required and no more "wrongful birth" lawsuits.

http://www.newsok.com/oklahoma-abortion-bills-become-law/article/3457167?custom_click=lead_story_title

[Hoss]

Ultrasounds required and no more "wrongful birth" lawsuits.

http://www.newsok.com/oklahoma-abortion-bills-become-law/article/3457167?custom_click=lead_story_title

Won't be long before this is challenged.

[Conan71]

Already happened, the New Yorkers are all over it:

"Within hours, a New York abortion rights group filed a lawsuit in Oklahoma County District Court to challenge the ultrasound law."

Read more: http://www.newsok.com/oklahoma-abortion-bills-become-law/article/3457167?custom_click=lead_story_title#ixzz0mKRLCJm0

[Townsend]

Well I didn't want my tax dollars going for anything constructive anyway.

[Nik]

After reading the actual text of the lawsuit bill, it doesn't sound as ridiculous as the abortion rights people made it sound. Basically, you can't sue a doctor on the grounds that if he gave you certain information, you would've had an abortion. That doesn't stop a person from suing a doctor because he withheld information that would have allowed steps to be taken to improve the health of the fetus.

[jamesrage]

Nothing wrong with requiring an ultrasound before an abortion.Abortionist act as though someone who is adamant about getting an abortion will be deterred by ultrasound results.

[Townsend]

Nothing wrong with requiring an ultrasound before an abortion.Abortionist act as though someone who is adamant about getting an abortion will be deterred by ultrasound results.

You're a woman, you get raped and impregnated.  You have to make the horrible choice one way or another and then you're forced to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it.

You're a woman and your fetus is going to kill you so you have to abort it to save your life but first you have to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it to you.

You're a woman and the baby is horribly malformed and has a 0% chance of surviving to term.  Then you have to listen to the heartbeat and the description of the fetus.

You're a little girl and you've been impregnated by a family member so the decision has been made to abort the fetus but first, as a 13 year old girl, you have to listen to the heart beat and listen to the doctor describe the fetus.

[Conan71]

You're a woman, you get raped and impregnated.  You have to make the horrible choice one way or another and then you're forced to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it.

You're a woman and your fetus is going to kill you so you have to abort it to save your life but first you have to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it to you.

You're a woman and the baby is horribly malformed and has a 0% chance of surviving to term.  Then you have to listen to the heartbeat and the description of the fetus.

You're a little girl and you've been impregnated by a family member so the decision has been made to abort the fetus but first, as a 13 year old girl, you have to listen to the heart beat and listen to the doctor describe the fetus.

Probably just wasted three minutes of your life on Jamesrage...point well taken though

[Townsend]

Probably just wasted three minutes of your life on Jamesrage...point well taken though

And I'm guessing he's a guy which makes it even more dubious.

[Cats Cats Cats]

Nothing wrong with requiring an ultrasound before an abortion.Abortionist act as though someone who is adamant about getting an abortion will be deterred by ultrasound results.

If an ultrasound serves no purpose for the procedure.  Why should insurance, tax payers, or the person getting the procedure be force dot pay for it.  Republicans should be outraged at the government taking over their healthcare.

[custosnox]

You're a woman, you get raped and impregnated.  You have to make the horrible choice one way or another and then you're forced to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it.

You're a woman and your fetus is going to kill you so you have to abort it to save your life but first you have to listen to the heartbeat and the doctor describe it to you.

You're a woman and the baby is horribly malformed and has a 0% chance of surviving to term.  Then you have to listen to the heartbeat and the description of the fetus.

You're a little girl and you've been impregnated by a family member so the decision has been made to abort the fetus but first, as a 13 year old girl, you have to listen to the heart beat and listen to the doctor describe the fetus.

These are all valid points.  I think it would be a better bill if it would seperate instances like these from those that are using abortion as an extended form of birth control.

[swake]

These are all valid points.  I think it would be a better bill if it would seperate instances like these from those that are using abortion as an extended form of birth control.

How exactly would you regulate/enforce these exceptions? Would a note from the rapist be enough? "My step-daddy molested me, but it's OK, here's a note from him saying it's ok for me to have the abortion. He doesn't want mommy finding out about him and me and our secret." If he won't give little Cindy a note, then she has to go through the ultrasound?

If you make the standard be a formal police rape charge how many guys that went out to the clubs and hooked up on a one night stands are going to end up charged with a false rape? The hookup ends up pregnant and charges the guys with rape in order to secure an easy abortion. Who is to tell, it's all he said, she said and he was probably drunk.

And on the other side, what about real date rapes, many of those cases never result in charges because of embarrassment and a lack of evidence. Are we going to force the victim, often the underage victim,  to go through with this ultrasound whose purpose is to guilt them into having as the child as a permanent reminder of her rape and the fact that the rapist got off because she couldn't prove the rape in court?

Oklahoma Sucks.

[custosnox]

How exactly would you regulate/enforce these exceptions? Would a note from the rapist be enough? “My step-daddy molested me, but it’s OK, here’s a note from him saying it’s ok for me to have the abortion. He doesn’t want mommy finding out about him and me and our secret.” If he won’t give little Cindy a note, then she has to go through the ultrasound?

If you make the standard be a formal police rape charge how many guys that went out to the clubs and hooked up on a one night stands are going to end up charged with a false rape? The hookup ends up pregnant and charges the guys with rape in order to secure an easy abortion. Who is to tell, it’s all he said, she said and he was probably drunk.

And on the other side, what about real date rapes, many of those cases never result in charges because of embarrassment and a lack of evidence. Are we going to force the victim, often the underage victim,  to go through with this ultrasound whose purpose is to guilt them into having as the child as a permanent reminder of her rape and the fact that the rapist got off because she couldn’t prove the rape in court?

Oklahoma Sucks.

I'll be honest, I have problems with rape being a reason to abort, primarily because a new life was created, even if through a horrible act.  I do accept that it is a very extreme thing for the woman to go through, and that carrying a child because of it makes it that much worse, which is why I never argue that point.

That being said, it would not be hard to put a simple line in the bill that reads "abortions of a pregnancy occured from legal, consenting sex".  It would really cut the ability of the bill down because a woman would just have to say that she did not concent to it, and the state would have to prove otherwise to push the issue.  It would make such a claim a bit on the unbelievable side when she says "my boyfriend that I have been with for the last three years and am still with raped me" just to get the benifit of birth control in this method.  Fine lines, but they can make all the difference.

[Townsend]

That being said, it would not be hard to put a simple line in the bill that reads "abortions of a pregnancy occured from legal, consenting sex".  It would really cut the ability of the bill down because a woman would just have to say that she did not concent to it, and the state would have to prove otherwise to push the issue.  It would make such a claim a bit on the unbelievable side when she says "my boyfriend that I have been with for the last three years and am still with raped me" just to get the benifit of birth control in this method.  Fine lines, but they can make all the difference.

Then comes the rape trial, false accusations and not all women want to be known, falsely or otherwise, as a rape victim.

There have been convictions of husband raping wife so I think the "my boyfriend raped me" is conceivable.

There's no way around this, it is a horrible law and they were wrong to pass it.  Now we all have to pay for it.

[custosnox]

Then comes the rape trial, false accusations and not all women want to be known, falsely or otherwise, as a rape victim.

There have been convictions of husband raping wife so I think the "my boyfriend raped me" is conceivable.

There's no way around this, it is a horrible law and they were wrong to pass it.  Now we all have to pay for it.

You could look at it from the other end of the spectrum, perhaps more rape victims will finally speak up and have something done.  I do think that a rape victim has a duty to come forward, if for no other reason then because if the person raped them, then they will most likely rape another.  If they are not willing to step forward, then they have no one to blame for the fall-out (in this case, having to listen to the heartbeat) then themselves.

I'm not saying this is the greatest law, or that it is really an answer, but it might be a step in the right direction for stopping so many women from using it as a form of birth control.  Yes, that is my biggest issue with abortion, women who think it's okay to go out and get pregenant because they can always just have it aborted.