Public Safety/Parks Sales Tax

[SXSW]

What do you think of Councilor Henderson's proposal to raise the city sales tax by 1 cent to fund police/fire and parks?  I would pay it but think other revenue sources should be looked at first.  Two that I've seen discussed:

- Raise property taxes

- Raise the county sales tax and divide the revenue based on population

I personally like the county sales tax idea because that way both Tulsan's and suburbanites in the county are all paying for services used by everyone.  Tulsa, with by far the largest population in the county, would see the most revenue but other cities like Owasso and Bixby would receive additional funds as well.  As suburbs continue to grow more people will shop there and Tulsa's budget situation won't improve.  Taxing the county means everyone is paying into Tulsa staying the safe, livable, vibrant city it once was which directly benefits the suburban communities.  They won't grow if Tulsa declines...

[waterboy]

I'm becoming more cynical as I see the condition the state put itself in with funding for education. I think the city will do the same. If a budget that was deemed adequate for police/fire/parks was established first, then sources were outlined to fund it and earmarked for nothing else, well, ok. But the problem is that once the proposed money starts to roll in, the leaders decide to "re-allocate" the amount of previous funding to other underfunded programs, you know, since all that new money is going to be coming in. Before you know it we're laying people off again.

[Rico]

I think if something is not done, this will go down as a year that we look back at as Dewey's "Blood Bath".

It will be difficult to turn it around even if you started today.

So, by all means, take six months and do an adequate analysis.   

[Red Arrow]

I personally like the county sales tax idea because that way both Tulsan's and suburbanites in the county are all paying for services used by everyone.  Tulsa, with by far the largest population in the county, would see the most revenue but other cities like Owasso and Bixby would receive additional funds as well.

You will probably have a difficult time getting that passed unless you distribute the income without a skew toward the COT.

[sgrizzle]

Might as well throw this out there...

Convert all public safety services to county services and fund via property tax levied on all residents in Tulsa and unincorporated areas.

[Conan71]

Where does it end, then?  There's going to be a need at some point in the next 5-10 years for another 1/2 to full cent by the city. Then the county will need more and the state will need more. Let's force all departments to take a long hard look at all their inefficiencies before we give them rights to more money.  I'm certain the middle class will be faced with 70% taxation in my lifetime. (Total taxes-consumption, property, income, and embedded)

Bartlet (sic) won't stay within his own means and shifted salaries to other areas to keep his cronies executive staff on the dole, er payroll.  Henderson has basically thrown up his hands in defeat thinking priorities can't be shifted and there's not a ton of waste which can't be dealt with.  

This is a city request SX, it would do far worse than the Riverfleece did with voters outside Tulsa.

[Red Arrow]

Might as well throw this out there...

Convert all public safety services to county services and fund via property tax levied on all residents in Tulsa and unincorporated areas.

Same basic problem as with tax income.  How would the services be divided?  Would Bixby get one policeperson and one firefighter?  That wouldn't fly very far.

COT may wind up on the short end of the stick for something done county-wide.

[MH2010]

What about the areas of the city of Tulsa that are in other counties besides Tulsa county?

[SXSW]

What about the areas of the city of Tulsa that are in other counties besides Tulsa county?

Osage County?  I believe that's the only one.  The city limits on the west side end right at the Tulsa-Creek County border on 33rd W. Ave.  Do some of the far flung eastern sections of the city, formerly New Tulsa, extend into Wagoner County?

I don't think any new tax is favorable right now, even though it's evident the city needs money due to sales tax collections being down.  I think they will wait until the KPMG audit is finished and then examine what needs to be done.  Sales tax will slowly climb back up but how can the city wait with reduced police/fire and city services?  I don't like seeing weeds and high grass in the medians or the rec centers closed and I can sense that many are equally frustrated.  It does not look good for our city attracting new business and residents that's for sure.  If not a sales tax than more fees, like the proposed meter rate hikes?  What about a city tax on tobacco?  Higher hotel/motel room tax?  I don't agree with Bartlett on most things but he has put forth ideas to generate revenue without increasing taxes through higher fees, that may be the direction we need to go...

[sgrizzle]

Same basic problem as with tax income.  How would the services be divided?  Would Bixby get one policeperson and one firefighter?  That wouldn't fly very far.

COT may wind up on the short end of the stick for something done county-wide.

Based on the statement I made, they would get none of either.

Dividing is not an issue so long as the service area and the area where the tax is levied are the same map. I know this is confusing to the county, who is used to taxing the whole county but mainly providing services like law enforcement in spotty areas.

[buckeye]

Pshaw.  It's incredulous in the extreme to believe the city has trimmed all the fat from the budget - and did so before cutting back on police and fire.  Sales tax near 10% for those knuckleheads to misappropriate and fritter away?  I think not.  Time for the city to save money and reduce spending instead of squeezing more blood from us turnips.

[SXSW]

Pshaw.  It's incredulous in the extreme to believe the city has trimmed all the fat from the budget - and did so before cutting back on police and fire.  Sales tax near 10% for those knuckleheads to misappropriate and fritter away?  I think not.  Time for the city to save money and reduce spending instead of squeezing more blood from us turnips.

Like I said, I will be very interested in seeing the results of the KPMG audit.  What are we now, 4 months away? 

[carltonplace]

Pshaw.  It's incredulous in the extreme to believe the city has trimmed all the fat from the budget - and did so before cutting back on police and fire.  Sales tax near 10% for those knuckleheads to misappropriate and fritter away?  I think not.  Time for the city to save money and reduce spending instead of squeezing more blood from us turnips.

First 4 cents goes to the State Of OK
Next 2 cents to the COT operating budget <---this is the shortfall
Next 1 cent is the "3rd Penny" used for capital improvements (Mayor Inhoffe I believe)
The rest is collected by the county for "4 to fix" and V2025