Now That SQ 744 Has Tanked, What To Do About Common Education

[shadows]

Aren't you the same shadows who has repeatedly said he dropped out of elementary school?

Yet you call us the "noble political elite" for trying to improve schools for our children...

You also say that your nephews/nieces have diplomas but cannot read...

Color me surprised...

You got the wrong shadows.  The one you are looking for is out trying to make it mandatory to collect all paper for recycling it in $20,00 bills since the only product needed is paper and a little ink.  We already go the machines to do it.  Ever person that is paid by government will support it.  Course China is alarmed but they are buying our industries, property and utilities and the political elite is calling that equalizing the balance of trade.   Send the autos to the crusher for China cause they have jobs and our steel mills closed several years ago.  We have become the paper hanger of the world while the president dances through other countries.

A sectary of education made the made the statement that we issue some 600,000 diplomas to people each year, "That cannot read the damn diploma".

Jefferson started 7 year classes, we added it to eight and a diploma, then 12 years, now we are trying to add another 4 years of college that in the end will be the same as the eighth grade learning but look at the cost for extra teachers needed since 1920.

[RecycleMichael]

Shadows, you is one messed up dude.

[waterboy]

Really, Shadows. Really? We should carry gold pieces, ignore the rest of the world and homeschool everyone. Would that do it?

[shadows]

On the evening new last night they were comparing private salaries to government salaries.   Their conclusion was the cost of salaries from 2009 to the present has doubled.  One cannot name a superpower in the last 2500 years who has not failed as more and higher salaries are to be paid by the working poor.   SQ 744 was shot down because an addition to a debt, that cannot be paid, with bogus money.  Remember the paper currency of the south nation become worthless after their defeat.  In the once superpowers in central and south America, they used color strings with knots in them to show individual balance of payment.  Gold was so available that it was used for ornaments.

The "tea party" is gaining strength each day in order to bring some sanity to another spend superpower.  It is not the building nor the ability of the teachers that has created the dilemma as we no longer are a world producer but instead the world debtor.   I have a $ 50 dollar gold piece issued by an off shore island when gold was pegged a $20 dollars an ounce.  Figure up how many of the promise me notes this 2.5 ounces of gold is worth today.

But we will find the money for our patriotic children who fall victim to the "pill" or the abortion clinic's that could have made up the fighting forces to protect our right of choice.       

[Hoss]

On the evening new last night they were comparing private salaries to government salaries.   Their conclusion was the cost of salaries from 2009 to the present has doubled.  One cannot name a superpower in the last 2500 years who has not failed as more and higher salaries are to be paid by the working poor.   SQ 744 was shot down because an addition to a debt, that cannot be paid, with bogus money.  Remember the paper currency of the south nation become worthless after their defeat.  In the once superpowers in central and south America, they used color strings with knots in them to show individual balance of payment.  Gold was so available that it was used for ornaments.

The "tea party" is gaining strength each day in order to bring some sanity to another spend superpower.  It is not the building nor the ability of the teachers that has created the dilemma as we no longer are a world producer but instead the world debtor.   I have a $ 50 dollar gold piece issued by an off shore island when gold was pegged a $20 dollars an ounce.  Figure up how many of the promise me notes this 2.5 ounces of gold is worth today.

But we will find the money for our patriotic children who fall victim to the "pill" or the abortion clinic's that could have made up the fighting forces to protect our right of choice.        

Yeah, the 'conclusion' was made by Scott Brown and his fellow tea-partiers.  Rand Paul parroted this point.  Guess what?

Incorrect.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2010/feb/03/scott-brown/politifact-debut-brown-says-federal-jobs-pay-twice/

Step away from the teabags.

[Conan71]

Correct, the homogenious statement that gov't employees earn twice as much as counterparts in the private sector is not true in all cases nor as an average. However, in many cases they do out-ern their peers plus they get a pension AND social security retirement benefits, something most non-union civilians don't have.

[nathanm]

Correct, the homogenious statement that gov't employees earn twice as much as counterparts in the private sector is not true in all cases nor as an average. However, in many cases they do out-ern their peers plus they get a pension AND social security retirement benefits, something most non-union civilians don't have.

In some cases they might out-earn their peers. Folks in IT certainly don't, and auditors don't, but I'm not going to generalize that experience to everyone. They do get a much better pension than I get (zip), and about the same as my SO, AIUI. Yes, her company has a pension plan in addition to their 401(k) matching. You go get a graduate degree, work crappy hours, and get a difficult-to-obtain license from the government and you can get a pension, too!

The main difference is that in government, even non-professional positions get the benefits, whereas in private industry, that's becoming less and less common. But they still have to contend with usually being paid less than their private sector counterparts, although there tends to be less overtime involved in government jobs.

[Conan71]

Interesting dichotomy Nathan. Along with manufacturing jobs going overseas, so has the great benefit of pensions. We are trading up to more technical jobs yet our workers are trading off more secure retirements for more $ today and the risk of their retirement evaporating entirely if their 401k tanks and Social Security dries up.

[nathanm]

Interesting dichotomy Nathan. Along with manufacturing jobs going overseas, so has the great benefit of pensions. We are trading up to more technical jobs yet our workers are trading off more secure retirements for more $ today and the risk of their retirement evaporating entirely if their 401k tanks and Social Security dries up.

Yeah, people think of government jobs as necessarily cushy, but they're not in many ways. If you have a brain, they can be maddening. Perhaps the benefits seem better today than they were in the past, but that's due to deterioration of working conditions for people in the private sector, not because government workers have been getting a bunch more money or anything. They've just been better at keeping what they had.

That's not to say that we don't waste plenty of money on the government payroll, after all, we still have Thousands Standing Around, but that's just as much a problem in the private sector. How many of us can say with a straight face there's no dead weight in our workplaces unless we own the business? 

You've actually hit upon one of the most striking changes caused by the financial crisis. There are (reportedly, I haven't seen the data myself) a lot more contractors and self employed folks than there were a few years ago. The meager benefits they were getting before are now completely gone for a lot of folks.

[Conan71]

Honestly, I think companies jettisoned most of their dead wood and floaters (and I don't mean balsa wood).  The days of "stroking a check" are pretty much over in private industry.  Private companies cannot afford to keep unproductive people on the payroll, especially right now in a period of stagnant to slow economic growth.  The government operates under a different set of rules: profitability is not and has never been a concern.  Government agencies can justify their existence simply because they say they are essential, or if they have enough protection in the legislative or executive branch.

BTW- love how you sneaked in the euphemism for TSA, clever!

[nathanm]

Unfortunately, that has not been my experience. I work almost exclusively for very small businesses, and even they have folks who don't really pull their weight. The reason they stick around? They're better than nothing. In the larger businesses I deal with, incompetence and flat out refusal to do anything is depressingly common. You'd think that they'd have laid off the low performers, but instead they laid off the more expensive, better performing, employees. Why lay off three people when you can lay off two instead and still get the same savings? 

The industries my clients operate in are apparently full of morons.

[Conan71]

The industries my clients operate in are apparently full of morons.

Should we use that statement to draw a conclusion about yourself? 

[nathanm]

Should we use that statement to draw a conclusion about yourself? 

If I was dumb enough to leave myself wide open like that, you probably should.

[Conan71]

If I was dumb enough to leave myself wide open like that, you probably should.

Are you coming to lunch on Monday with us?

[Hoss]

Are you coming to lunch on Monday with us?

I know I'm not Nate, but I forgot about that.  I think I'll try and make it, even though it is downtown...