President Obama's Job Creation Initiative Framework Speeches

[Teatownclown]

Why does he think he needs to keep framing this as class warfare?  Oh I forget, he's not leading, he's campaigning.

He might get a better buy in if he'd quit saying things like "...folks who are not paying their fair share..."

Why does he deliberately want to piss off the upper crust?  He's already got most of the lower income voters locked in since the stats show they tend to favor Democrat POTUS candidates.

Warren Buffet has his back but nice try....it's use guys who drum up the class warfare by defending the greedy....

[Gaspar]

Why does he think he needs to keep framing this as class warfare?  Oh I forget, he's not leading, he's campaigning.

He might get a better buy in if he'd quit saying things like "...folks who are not paying their fair share..."

Why does he deliberately want to piss off the upper crust?  He's already got most of the lower income voters locked in since the stats show they tend to favor Democrat POTUS candidates.

By prolonging economic recovery through class warfare he has created an opportunity to campaign through 12 states with the same message as 2008, but this time he gets to do it without using any of his campaign cash.  Quite brilliant actually, but ethically disgusting.

I disagree with you.  I think many of his past supporters have become more politically astute and attune to what he is doing.  He is relying on the next couple of weeks to re-ignite the fires of of class warfare and organizing the poor to take up their pitch-forks, but I think what he will find is that the ranks of the poor have grown, and among them are many who are not interested in the politics of dependency.

I also think that he will discover that through his actions, many of his previous constituency has striven to understand why the policies he promised did not render the results he promised, and through those efforts they have increased their political intelligence beyond pander and paw.

His speech last week was supposed to have impact among the uninformed with it's 17 instances of "pass this bill now" to frame his effort as the architecture for saving the economy, but quickly, even the liberal media deconstructed it into shiny platitudes covering a core of spend more tax more, build more dependency strategy.  Giddy Republicans and business owners anticipated an acquiescence to the adoption of pro-growth policies only to have their hopes dashed yet again by the same message, and what will now be reflected upon as a campaign kick-off speech.  

[nathanm]

Is that you, shadows?

[RecycleMichael]

Is that you, shadows?

+1

[Townsend]

Is that you, shadows?

I think, but can't be sure, he may me spooging out something he heard on a talk show.  Someone on there told him how the "liberals" were thinking and he went with it.

[nathanm]

I think, but can't be sure, he may me spooging out something he heard on a talk show.  Someone on there told him how the "liberals" were thinking and he went with it.

Oh, one of those people who thinks they miraculously know other people's inner thoughts and motivations. It amazes me that someone can accuse a President who has basically done what both sides asked on the economy of attempting to keep the economy in the toilet. Not only that, but it's completely nonsensical if you believe Obama wants to be re-elected.

[Conan71]

Oh, one of those people who thinks they miraculously know other people's inner thoughts and motivations. It amazes me that someone can accuse a President who has basically done what both sides asked on the economy of attempting to keep the economy in the toilet. Not only that, but it's completely nonsensical if you believe Obama wants to be re-elected.

Let's look at the back-end of this pile proposed bill.  More risk for small business by making unemployed people a protected class.  What does that do?  You can look at it one of two ways: blackmailing business to hire sub-par candidates out of fear they could be sued by an unqualified candidate who incorrectly claims they were discriminated against because they were unemployed.  Or, it provides a huge disincentive to even think about hiring new employees out of fear of litigation costs if they are not hiring enough people off u/e rolls.

The high end tax increases are back.  Even Democrat strategists have been saying that any economist worth their salt knows that tax increases in a recession are a bad idea.

Louie Gohmert weighs in:

"Gohmert pointed to little-noticed aspects of the bill that Obama presented to Congress on Monday. One, he said, turns the unemployed into a protected class similar to ethnic minorities.

"If you apply for a job and you think that the reason you didn't get hired is because you were unemployed at the time, you¹re now a protected class," said Gohmert, whose largely rural district borders Louisiana. "You've now got a cause of action, go get a lawyer.

"How do you prove, if you're an employer, that being unemployed was not the reason that you did not hire somebody. It is going to create all kinds of claims for this mass of people and there'll be more and more unemployed because of this bill.

"This is a job killer except for famous lawyers who do labor work, they¹re going to have a field day," Gohmert said. "Anybody that¹s unemployed who doesn't get hired is going to have a claim, a cause of action. But everybody else is going to be in big trouble."

Gohmert said he got the text of the bill on Monday evening and spent much of the night studying it. His analysis is that the real losers would be small businesses.

Taking the oil and gas industry, he said it would help huge corporations such as British Petroleum and Exxon Mobil while hurting the small independent companies that provide much of the energy produced in the United States.

What Obama calls subsidies for the oil industry that he wants to eliminate are really the same tax deductions that all companies get, Gohmert said.

"They're deductions of the cost of doing business. Every manufacturer, every employer gets to deduct the cost of doing business, but this president wants to make sure oil companies don¹t, and who¹s going to be helped? The biggest oil companies will be helped. The price of oil, if this becomes law, will go up."

Read more on Newsmax.com: Rep. Gohmert: Obama's Jobs Bill Has Devilish Details
Important: Do You Support Pres. Obama's Re-Election? Vote Here Now!

We need job creation but the president seems to be playing politics instead.  It's a no-win situation for Republicans in the house.   Although, one positive seems to be that Boehner is at least looking at it carefully, waiting for a CBO score, and considering what parts of the bill will fly with the GOP base.

Regardless, looking at poll numbers, fewer and fewer Americans approve of the president's handling of the economy.

[Gaspar]

Everyone is distancing themselves from this now that they understand it's purpose.  I think it has now been made perfectly clear that any job creation will be directly linked to the outcome of the 2012 elections.

I'm glad Boehner is being optimistic, but I'm relatively sure (after Axelrod's remarks last night) that if he tries to strip the damaging parts out of this bill, the President will not sign it.

Yesterday, the President said he was willing to compromise and accept and sign parts of this bill, but then Axelrod hit the networks with a resounding NO, THE PRESIDENT WILL NOT ACCEPT THIS BILL UNLESS IT IS INTACT. 

It will be interesting though to see if many people's suspicions are correct about Axelrod's power over President Obama.

[nathanm]

Let's look at the back-end of this pile proposed bill.  More risk for small business by making unemployed people a protected class.  What does that do?  You can look at it one of two ways: blackmailing business to hire sub-par candidates out of fear they could be sued by an unqualified candidate who incorrectly claims they were discriminated against because they were unemployed.  Or, it provides a huge disincentive to even think about hiring new employees out of fear of litigation costs if they are not hiring enough people off u/e rolls.

Wasn't it just a few months back that you agreed that companies are refusing to hire the long-term unemployed merely because they're unemployed and not because of a lack of qualifications or anything of that sort? We tried the carrot; maybe it's time for a stick. (I don't know anything about the bill, as I've not been paying much attention to the news in the last week or so)

[Conan71]

Wasn't it just a few months back that you agreed that companies are refusing to hire the long-term unemployed merely because they're unemployed and not because of a lack of qualifications or anything of that sort? We tried the carrot; maybe it's time for a stick. (I don't know anything about the bill, as I've not been paying much attention to the news in the last week or so)

Yes I did and do agree, but I did not advocate making them a protected class then or now.  Supposedly the administration wants to lower the bar on job-choking regulations, then they unwittingly or wittingly throw a new hurdle in which could potentially offset any gains which may be realized by lowering or removing other regs.  Unfortunately, the stick approach may make some business owners decide to take their operations across the border or overseas. Or just cease operations, liquidate, and go kick it in the Caribbean. 

This administration reminds me more and more of when John Blake was running the OU football program.

[Gaspar]

Yes I did and do agree, but I did not advocate making them a protected class then or now.  Supposedly the administration wants to lower the bar on job-choking regulations, then they unwittingly or wittingly throw a new hurdle in which could potentially offset any gains which may be realized by lowering or removing other regs.  Unfortunately, the stick approach may make some business owners decide to take their operations across the border or overseas. Or just cease operations, liquidate, and go kick it in the Caribbean. 

This administration reminds me more and more of when John Blake was running the OU football program.

There is a very obvious path that they can take, but they insist on tromping through the woods in the dark, because to take the path would mean admitting they were wrong.  Pride is President Obama's enemy now.

[nathanm]

There is a very obvious path that they can take, but they insist on tromping through the woods in the dark, because to take the path would mean admitting they were wrong.  Pride is President Obama's enemy now.

I see you still fancy yourself a psychic. Perhaps Miss Cleo has a job for you?

Conan, in my (limited) experience, there's a rather high bar to be met for a employment discrimination suit to succeed, so attorneys don't generally bring them without merit. As I opaquely indicated earlier, I don't even know for sure that this right wing meme is actually in the bill since I haven't been keeping up with the news. It may be yet another baseless smear like "death panels".

[Gaspar]

Holy Pancakes!

I thought the Republicans would be the obstacle to the president's misguided jobs bill, but the Democrats are actually making the rounds today!

"Terrible," Sen. Jim Webb (D-Va.) told POLITICO when asked about the president's ideas for how to pay for the $450 billion price tag. "We shouldn't increase taxes on ordinary income. ... There are other ways to get there."

"That offset is not going to fly, and he should know that," said Democratic Sen. Mary Landrieu from the energy-producing Louisiana, referring to Obama's elimination of oil and gas subsidies. "Maybe it's just for his election, which I hope isn't the case."

"I think the best jobs bill that can be passed is a comprehensive long-term deficit-reduction plan," said Sen. Tom Carper (D-Del.), discussing proposals to slash the debt by $4 trillion by overhauling entitlement programs and raising revenue through tax reforms. "That's better than everything else the president is talking about — combined."

I think perhaps congress will send him back to the golf course and come up with their own bill.

[Gaspar]

The American Jobs Act of 2011 has now been introduced in congress.  Unfortunately the administration forgot to reserve this name before the president's speech last week.  The bill that was just introduced simply eliminates the corporate income tax.  It is 2 pages long and would reduce all corporate income tax to 0%.

If passed the effect on the economy would be swift and immediate.

[Conan71]

I see you still fancy yourself a psychic. Perhaps Miss Cleo has a job for you?

Conan, in my (limited) experience, there's a rather high bar to be met for a employment discrimination suit to succeed, so attorneys don't generally bring them without merit. As I opaquely indicated earlier, I don't even know for sure that this right wing meme is actually in the bill since I haven't been keeping up with the news. It may be yet another baseless smear like "death panels".

Gohmert has no reason to lie about the contents of the bill especially when one can look up the text.

Having gone through many hours of personnel management training when I worked for a Fortune 500 company, I can tell you that regardless of how remote the chances of being sued are, it's a very real threat at any time and for any perceived reason.  The company I worked for benefitted from in-house counsel.  Smaller businesses must lawyer up just to respond to claims.  Many times it's hoped a company will simply offer a token amount to avoid the costs of going to court.

This is a list of notable lawsuits just from the EEOC since 2009.  There have been seventeen actions alone filed by the EEOC in just the last week.  One of the more ironic ones is "The Scooter Store" being sued for disability discrimination on Sept. 2nd.  

http://www.eeoc.gov/eeoc/newsroom/release/index.cfm

Adding this on would most definitely be a disincentive to job creation.  I agree there's a problem, this solution is simply too big a lever.  I'm much more in favor of unemployment benefits being tied to doing some sort of useful work on behalf of the federal, state, or local government, school systems or even as a job re-training program or temporary job placement within private companies with an opportunity to eventually transition onto permanent payroll.  Of course, that could be abused by employers to get free labor by churning temps every 60 to 90 days.

Nothing says someone can't immediately find a situation of under-employment instead of riding the unemployment float for a year.