Mitts Pick

[erfalf]

But not a measure?

And so there can be a Unitarian trait?

You're taking my words literally(all fair) but I think you know what I mean. IQ and religion/faith are not something that is measured like weight or height. Those are quantitative measures. The others are qualitative.

[nathanm]

There is a risk. But the risk isn't on the government, it's not their money.

It would be if the taxes were paid on time like it is for us working stiffs. There is risk to the government by letting the taxpayer defer their payment into the future. The gain may be erased by then. Yes, the taxpayer also bears risk on the part that would have been left over after tax was paid, but they have still successfully shifted some (exactly how much depends on the tax rate that would apply to the income, of course) of the risk to the government.

That's the whole point of tax deferred investments.

[erfalf]

It would be if the taxes were paid on time like it is for us working stiffs. There is risk to the government by letting the taxpayer defer their payment into the future. The gain may be erased by then. Yes, the taxpayer also bears risk on the part that would have been left over after tax was paid, but they have still successfully shifted some (exactly how much depends on the tax rate that would apply to the income, of course) of the risk to the government.

That's the whole point of tax deferred investments.

You can defer taxes as well. Heck, I am able to, through my company's retirement account. There are limits, and I am in the unfortunate position of not owning a PE firm, but hey, I'm not complaining. If you don't like the way the tax code works, that fine, complain about it. But don't go around saying things aren't fair or certain people are cheating the government when they aren't doing anything of the kind.

I know it can be parsed differently, but I tend to believe that income is mine, and I pay a portion of it in taxes. It seems like you think the government has first right to your money, and it allows you and I to keep some of it.

[Hoss]

You're taking my words literally(all fair) but I think you know what I mean. IQ and religion/faith are not something that is measured like weight or height. Those are quantitative measures. The others are qualitative.

OK, so here's a question.  If I were to come up to you and profess that I was baptized a Christian, would you require proof of it before you would believe it?  Or would that be only if my name wasn't "Christian sounding"...

[nathanm]

You can defer taxes as well. Heck, I am able to, through my company's retirement account. There are limits, and I am in the unfortunate position of not owning a PE firm, but hey, I'm not complaining. If you don't like the way the tax code works, that fine, complain about it. But don't go around saying things aren't fair or certain people are cheating the government when they aren't doing anything of the kind.

Romney's IRA may not be illegal, but it's still cheating the government. The limits exist for a reason. Good for him that he found a loophole, but it's illustrative of the problem with the tax code. The rules are different if you're clever or if you've got enough money to hire a clever accountant. Sort of like how laws in Tennessee sometimes apply only to "the largest city in a county whose population was at least 500,000 as of the 2000 Census", only less obviously stated.

I know it can be parsed differently, but I tend to believe that income is mine, and I pay a portion of it in taxes. It seems like you think the government has first right to your money, and it allows you and I to keep some of it.

Yes, your income is yours, aside from the part of it that is taxed. That part is not.

[erfalf]

OK, so here's a question.  If I were to come up to you and profess that I was baptized a Christian, would you require proof of it before you would believe it?  Or would that be only if my name wasn't "Christian sounding"...

Initially, or after I have have observed you for the better part of five years?

[erfalf]

Romney's IRA may not be illegal, but it's still cheating the government. The limits exist for a reason. Good for him that he found a loophole, but it's illustrative of the problem with the tax code. The rules are different if you're clever or if you've got enough money to hire a clever accountant. Sort of like how laws in Tennessee sometimes apply only to "the largest city in a county whose population was at least 500,000 as of the 2000 Census", only less obviously stated.

But why do you have to use the word cheating the government (I know why ) when it couldn't be further from the truth. If he is operating within the boundaries of the law, he is not cheating anyone, especially the government, you know the one that made those rules. It is one thing to call out rules for being unfair but it is something else entirely to accuse someone who acts within the law a cheat or thief.

Yes, your income is yours, aside from the part of it that is taxed. That part is not.

Good enough for me. Just the way you worded some things made it sound otherwise. The government does not have claim on money just because it feels like it though. They have to set up the rules, and we operate within them, and we get punished if we don't. That's the way the game is played.

[Hoss]

Initially, or after I have have observed you for the better part of five years?

Seriously?  So if I were to come up to you and tell you that I was baptized, then you watched me for five years and decided that I wasn't Christian based on your assessment of my actions, would that make me any more or less a Christian?

You typify many Christians.

Judge not lest ye be judged.  That was something my grandparents instilled in me at a young age.  Just because I don't go to church or Sunday School every week doesn't mean I'm not a Christian...or better yet a man of faith.  I don't need to attend church to have a relationship with my higher power.

What shows you that our current President isn't a Christian?  His name?  After watching him for five years?  Does a sitting president need to have an omnipresent relationship with a church in order to be a religious or faithful President?

Wow.

[AquaMan]

That's quite a fancy noose you've constructed for yourself mr. erfalf.

[heironymouspasparagus]

That's quite a fancy noose you've constructed for yourself mr. erfalf.

Youth, no sense of history, and a lack of worldly experience.  Probably a product of private religious school. 

[Townsend]

That's quite a fancy noose you've constructed for yourself mr. erfalf.

I gave him an out.

[heironymouspasparagus]

No one here telling atheist jokes. 

What makes this nation beautiful is it's spectrum of people, their diversity in beliefs and philosophies, and everything that can add to the feast.

Shalom, Namaste, Salam Aleikum, Wai, God Bless, Dude!

Live for something, or live for nothing, it's your individual choice and it should be honored.

Atheism is a non-prophet organization.


Why did the Rationalist cross the road?
To be sure to see both sides...


How does a girl Rationalist have her hair done?
In Big Bangs....


Catholics are against abortions.
Catholics are against homosexuals.
But, I can't think of anyone who has less abortions than homosexuals!   (George Carlin)

Ok, that last one wasn't an atheist joke, but I just had to throw it in...

[erfalf]

Seriously?  So if I were to come up to you and tell you that I was baptized, then you watched me for five years and decided that I wasn't Christian based on your assessment of my actions, would that make me any more or less a Christian?

You typify many Christians.

Judge not lest ye be judged.  That was something my grandparents instilled in me at a young age.  Just because I don't go to church or Sunday School every week doesn't mean I'm not a Christian...or better yet a man of faith.  I don't need to attend church to have a relationship with my higher power.

What shows you that our current President isn't a Christian?  His name?  After watching him for five years?  Does a sitting president need to have an omnipresent relationship with a church in order to be a religious or faithful President?

Wow.

This is always what happens when Christians are critical of anything, or when someone is loosing an argument to Christians. That exact quote is pulled up because you know that the opposition will cower in fear out of fear of being a hypocrite. But, it's BS. For you to come on here and say not to judge is the pinnacle of hypocrisy. Or is it that only I am not to judge.

[erfalf]

Youth, no sense of history, and a lack of worldly experience.  Probably a product of private religious school. 

Again, am only I not to judge?

What if I say I am a history major that has toured the world and went to public schools?

[Hoss]

This is always what happens when Christians are critical of anything, or when someone is loosing an argument to Christians. That exact quote is pulled up because you know that the opposition will cower in fear out of fear of being a hypocrite. But, it's BS. For you to come on here and say not to judge is the pinnacle of hypocrisy. Or is it that only I am not to judge.

You must be incredibly dizzy after typing that out.  Especially since you didn't answer my question.