Government Closed, Sun Still Expected To Rise

[Gaspar]

No, what we're missing is all these folks are stationing themselves for sound bites and news shows.  Taking "get re-elected" pills.

We keep thinking people are doing things for or against us.  They're not.  They're doing things for the money for their next candidacy.

We're too gullible as a general populous.

Don't think Warren Meyer was trying to get a sound byte.  I think he was trying to keep his business open.
Don't think Francis Buchanan, who just celebrated his 87th birthday far from the fox hole in woods of Bastogne that he used to call home 68 years ago, was there for political reasons.

[Townsend]

Don't think Warren Meyer was trying to get a sound byte.  I think he was trying to keep his business open.
Don't think Francis Buchanan, who just celebrated his 87th birthday far from the fox hole in woods of Bastogne that he used to call home 68 years ago, was there for political reasons.

I didn't realize they were running for re-election.

Are they running for re-election?

[Townsend]

[Hoss]

Uncanny how one cartoon sums up the whole argument.

[Conan71]

No, what we're missing is all these folks are stationing themselves for sound bites and news shows.  Taking "get re-elected" pills.

We keep thinking people are doing things for or against us.  They're not.  They're doing things for the money for their next candidacy.

We're too gullible as a general populous.

You've been making it sound like blame falls soley on the shoulders of Tea Party members when in reality Dims in the legislature are doing nothing to help the situation by refusing to even agree on specific funding measures without ties to de-funding Obamacare or getting rid of the medical appliance tax.  Obama and his henchmen are making sure that the shut-down is visible as possible by being malicious with cuts which are simply not necessary.  Again, not something done by Clinton, Reagan, or Carter when it happened in their administrations.

[heironymouspasparagus]

You've been making it sound like blame falls soley on the shoulders of Tea Party members when in reality Dims in the legislature are doing nothing to help the situation by refusing to even agree on specific funding measures without ties to de-funding Obamacare or getting rid of the medical appliance tax.  Obama and his henchmen are making sure that the shut-down is visible as possible by being malicious with cuts which are simply not necessary.  Again, not something done by Clinton, Reagan, or Carter when it happened in their administrations.

You haven't been paying attention again...there have been literally trillions in concessions (over ten years as they are so fond of saying) made by the Democrats during Obama's term.  Really - recover faster!

[Hoss]

You've been making it sound like blame falls soley on the shoulders of Tea Party member....snip

If the shoe fits.  Actually, mainly more on the shoulders of Rafael Cruz-McCarthy, the Calgary Cowboy.

When you get guys like Grover Norquist to say things about Cruz like "He pushed Republicans in to traffic and then wandered away", then that's saying something.

[nathanm]

So. . .If I own oil leases on federal lands, shouldn't the government come shut me down?  If not, are they in violation?

Congress is not appropriating funds for visitors to parks, monuments, and other public spaces.  They are appropriating funds for the maintenance and upkeep of those elements and the concessions in place.  

It would naturally follow that the dispatch of additional personnel and equipment above and beyond normal staff levels for these parks, monuments, and public spaces, would constitute a requirement of the appropriation or diversion of funds in the midst of a federal shutdown.  Instead of closing the information booths, and not emptying the trash cans, the president ADDED personnel and equipment so as to cause public spectacle.  There was no other possible motivation. 

If indeed there exists some kind of constitutional violation, as you imply, to allow any commerce or convention on federal property during a government shutdown, than they are in clear violation of your imaginary constitutional requirement by allowing gas and oil leases to operate or any leased entity for that matter.

Yes, if you take what I said and add a bunch of BS to it, you can create and knock down a straw man. Such talent!

First, let's correct a misunderstanding. Congress has not in fact appropriated money for maintenance and upkeep of the parks (aside possibly from some multi-year capital appropriations), which is why employees deemed essential are working without pay. Sorry you don't like that there are consequences to this failure.

Secondly, the violation is not allowing people onto federal lands, it is allowing employees to perform nonessential duties. The federal government does not operate wells, private companies operating with their own funds do. The federal government does operate parks.

Thirdly, I'm not sure why you think the power of the purse is some obscure Constitutional provision. I seem to recall you being strongly in favor of Congress using it to prevent Obama from closing the prison camp at Guantanamo Bay. The plain words of the document are quite clear (and it is long settled law) that only Congress has the power to authorize spending.

Conan, no concessions, really? The continuing resolution passed by the Senate lopped about $300 billion off the President's budget request, bringing it within a few tens of billions of Paul freakin' Ryan's budget and you're saying the Democrats made no concessions. Get real.

Also, require is different than use. Many things in this country are jointly paid for by federal and state governments. If the federal money goes away the state can't pretend it didn't. It is, of course, up to them whether to assume 100% of the responsibility presuming they actually operate the park or whatever. That assumes that they already have the legal right to operate it, of course. If not, there's no money to negotiate a new agreement.

[Hoss]

Yes, if you take what I said and add a bunch of BS to it, you can create and knock down a straw man. Such talent!

First, let's correct a misunderstanding. Congress has not in fact appropriated money for maintenance and upkeep of the parks (aside possibly from some multi-year capital appropriations), which is why employees deemed essential are working without pay. Sorry you don't like that there are consequences to this failure.

Secondly, the violation is not allowing people onto federal lands, it is allowing employees to perform nonessential duties. The federal government does not operate wells, private companies operating with their own funds do. The federal government does operate parks.

Thirdly, I'm not sure why you think the power of the purse is some obscure Constitutional provision. I seem to recall you being strongly in favor of Congress using it to prevent Obama from closing the prison camp at Guantanamo Bay. The plain words of the document are quite clear (and it is long settled law) that only Congress has the power to authorize spending.

Conan, no concessions, really? The continuing resolution passed by the Senate lopped about $300 billion off the President's budget request, bringing it within a few tens of billions of Paul freakin' Ryan's budget and you're saying the Democrats made no concessions. Get real.

Also, require is different than use. Many things in this country are jointly paid for by federal and state governments. If the federal money goes away the state can't pretend it didn't. It is, of course, up to them whether to assume 100% of the responsibility presuming they actually operate the park or whatever. That assumes that they already have the legal right to operate it, of course. If not, there's no money to negotiate a new agreement.

Here's a real winner from Texas:

Their Congressman Randy Neugebauer

What a d-bag.  All for a photo-op

[Vashta Nerada]

Shots fired outside the DC Capital building.

I'm guessing Cruz has lost his s___.

At the beginning of it all, Oregon residents B.J. and Susan Campbell saw a black sedan driven by a woman heading west on Pennsylvania, into a security checkpoint at 15th Street and Pennsylvania Avenue NW. The driver went about 20 yards, B.J. Campbell said, before rapidly turning the car around at the concrete security barriers.

"The Secret Service guy was just having a cow," B.J. Campbell said. "Yelling at her and banging on the car." The Secret Service officers pulled a black metal gate into her path and she slowed to try to go around it. Then the agent moved the gate in front of her again.

At that point "she just gunned it," B.J. Campbell said. "She ran the barricade down and the guy; knocked him up onto her hood. The whole encounter lasted about 20 seconds, he said.
Another witness said the man was an off-duty officer in plain clothes holding a lunch cooler in his hand.
Two officers recieved minor injuries after striking secirity barriers with their vehicles.

[patric]

Well if this is true, the shutdown may have claimed a victim, if this tourist freaked out thinking she was being carjacked.

A tourist visiting from Portland, Ore., said he saw the black car drive past White House security. Officers began "banging on the car, yelling at her," Campbell told TIME. One tried to use a bicycle rack to box in the vehicle, but the car spun around and rammed into the rack and hit the officer, who was not wearing a uniform.
http://nation.time.com/2013/10/03/gunshots-fired-at-u-s-capitol/

She had her baby in the car.  Damn.

[AquaMan]

People need to calm down. The stupid rhetoric being used to further careers and movements (has) and will cost lives. I am hearing really bs stuff from regular everyday workers about guns, bullets, fuel prices, mortgage rates, medical care, flu vaccines, etc. that have long since been explained or debunked, now resurfacing as anti-govt, anti-Obama conspiracies.

When I explain to them how this is politics being played by professionals at a very high level, they seem unfazed. Sort of how Gas ignores stuff that doesn't fit his schema.

I am most amused by those who point out that previous players didn't respond with such fervor as the "administration" has. Yeah, well, they stepped up this time and are playing at the same intensity as their opposition. And that is worthy of criticism? Gas, your people are like those crowds that gather below a jumper contemplating suicide from a high rise yelling...."JUMP, JUMP, JUMP"

All this over opponents of a health care law they originally devised. Shameful.

[Gaspar]

My friend Piper's very clever take on the situation.

[swake]

My friend Piper's very cleaver take on the situation.

Cleaver?

[Gaspar]

Cleaver?

That's what my phone wanted to say.