Mid-town WalMart Market in old Homelands : 31st & Harvard

[patric]

The Whirled says they are demolishing up to the point it attaches to the rest of the strip mall, and rebuilding ground-up.

I wonder what it would have been like if they had chosen the old Sipes grocery store down the street at 26th (instead of making it a Dollar General)?

[Conan71]

The Whirled says they are demolishing up to the point it attaches to the rest of the strip mall, and rebuilding ground-up.

I wonder what it would have been like if they had chosen the old Sipes grocery store down the street at 26th (instead of making it a Dollar General)?

That's a key crossing for MC and I when we are riding our bikes to points west and there's already far too much distracted driving and red light runners without a Wal-Marts there.  Don't do that, patric, gives me nightmares worse than you having a crematorium within a block or two of your house! 

[PonderInc]

Here's the BOA application for the Walmart from July. 

http://www.cityoftulsa-boa.org/Documents/Agendas/07-09-2013/BOA-21587.pdf

Basically looks like they're tearing it down and rebuilding in the same footprint.  Hard to tell b/c these are only rudimentary drawings necessary to obtain BOA approval; they don't really show many specifics.

They got a parking variance to reduce parking by 65 spaces, but it doesn't appear that they are bringing the store any closer to the street. From the drawings, it looks like they're going to eliminate a row of parking closest to 32nd Street (along the landscaping border) and the 10 or so along the front of the store (the "granny spaces").  This eliminates about 50 spaces. Then, it looks like the addition of a couple trees and a couple "bump outs" will eliminate the rest... leaving the building waaaaay back yonder where the trucks can access the loading dock from Jamestown Ave.

As an aside, ever since Homeland closed, we have seen a lot of people jaywalking across Harvard to buy groceries at Walgreens.  I didn't realize how many people were without transportation in that area who were relying on Homeland for their groceries.  They will be very happy to have an affordable store on the east side of Harvard.

[Conan71]

I think there's one or more apartment complexes just east of Jamestown, aren't there?

[Rookie Okie]

Not familiar with Central Market, United Grocers has a Market Street concept in Wichita Falls which is outstanding, great liquor, wine, and beer selection as well as hot prepared foods ready to eat on site or take home.  Sounds like a similar concept.

Then I think you would like Wegmans supermarkets, a large regional chain from my neck of the woods in upstate NY with stores also located in the mid-Atlantic.  I've shopped extensively at Krogers and Meijers when I lived in KY before moving here.  Believe me, neither can come close to Wegmans in anything that they do similarly.  I would drive past 5 or more of both of these stores to get to a Wegmans.   

Wegmans is considered upscale by industry analysts and is the top rated large supermarket chain as per Consumer Reports.  Noted for high quality customer service and for providing a unique shopping experience in impeccably clean stores, their prices are also reasonable and very competitive in the markets they serve.  They kick a$$ in most if not all of the key grocery store industry metrics.  Comparatively, Reasors prices are higher on average than Wegmans (Reasors stores are about half the size in sq footage).  In terms of offerings,  Wegmans is to Reasors as Reasors is to a Warehouse Mkt.  Wegmans is an innovator in the prepared (basic and specialty) food concepts and many of their stores have world market cafes.  It is mind blowing what you can take out for dinner or eat in the café.  The quality, freshness, and consistency of their produce and meats cannot be matched.  Their in-store bakeries and delis are also the best.  International foods, they carry from almost any and everywhere.  Fresh Market, Whole Foods, and other specialty/ healthy food outlets have negligible if any impact on them.  They also have an outstanding high quality store brand of a much larger array of products than most competitors carry (you can see examples of some of these in the background on some episodes of "The Office"). 

There is nothing here to compare Wegmans to, but I know without a doubt Tulsans would absolutely love this store. www.wegmans.com

[Conan71]

The web site isn't terribly descriptive, but based on what you had to say about the place, sounds like my wife and I would feel right at home there.

[Rookie Okie]

The web site isn't terribly descriptive, but based on what you had to say about the place, sounds like my wife and I would feel right at home there.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=7apYk4erhiY‎

Here is a link to the much anticipated grand opening of a new replacement Wegmans store in Rochester last spring.  It took over 15 years of planning, zoning battles, and design changes to finally happen (for those of you who think it is difficult to get things done in Tulsa, just try doing said in Rochester and see how tough it can really get!)

It shows some views inside the store and you can also see one of their new restaurant concepts - Amore.  This store represents a more urban model at 87K sq. ft., and is probably the smallest one in the entire chain.  It is located in an area similar to Utica Square in demographics and density.  Most of the other Wegmans stores are 100K to 130K sq ft., and there are more than 20 of them alone scattered throughout the greater Rochester area.

BTW, wine and liquor is not sold in NY grocery stores, and that leaves more room for a great selection and stock of good beers in Wegmans.  They also stopped selling tobacco products in 2008.

[dbacksfan 2.0]

I tried shopping at a WM Neighborhood Market back in '06 or '07 and really did not care for it, they were pushing too much Sam's Choice items, and the prices on the normal national brand items were in line with the local stores in Phoenix, Basha's (Arizona version of Reasor's) and the Kroger owned Fry's, Fred Meyer, Smith's, and Smitty's, and if you went to California Ralph's. Safeway and Von's were just too expensive, and if you really wanted upscale you went to AJ's Fine Foods (think Petty's).

The best small market was when Tesco brought Fresh & Easy. They had good prices but you had to check out your groceries and bag them, that's how they saved you money, and they had some good in house items including meals to go that you have to heat up, but were made fresh daily.

As for the Kroger owned stores, they are averaged priced, and have good selections, I just wish that I could get my dad out of the mind set of shopping at the lone WM, while the prices of some things are higher at Fred Meyer at least they do a better job of keeping things stocked on the shelves. I prefer Diet Coke, and shopping at WM when it is on sale for $1.00/2 liter, they only carry 40 bottles to a shelf, and if you get there in the afternoon, and there is three bottles on the shelf, if you ask the associate if they have more the answer is "Well the truck is supposed to be here sometime today, so come back and we might have more."

As a side note, I lived in Joplin back in '90 and the two stores that I shopped at were a Smitty's on Rangeline in north Joplin, then found Dillon's IGA (leveled by the tornado) closer to my apartment that had better prices. Dillon's is now owned by Kroger.

[Rookie Okie]

Aside from good quality, low prices, and service that we as consumers should expect, there are some other nuances to grocery shopping that I miss since moving to OKlahoma.  At the time I lived in upstate NY I thought going to the grocery store was just that, but realized later that it is really more of an "experience," one that is shaped in large measure by the retailer and community.

At Wegmans stores, the experience can be quite social and more vibrant.  You never know who you will run into (whether you want to see them or not) because people shop in droves there day and night.  You see in Rochester they garner better than 60% market share even though there is adequate competition.  They are just that much better than the closest competitor which is actually is not a bad chain itself.  If getting in and getting out is your thing, then you can do that too as they will check you out in a fraction of the time that Walmart or Kroger's does.  So you don't dread going because you don't need to spend too much time waiting if you are pressed, or if not, you can catch up on the latest with friends (while enjoying good food and a beverage of choice should you choose).

Food shopping has been one of the biggest negatives for me in Oklahoma.  Perhaps foretelling of what to expect should have been my observation of the many Walmart Neighborhood Markets in addition to the Walmart Superstores serving the area.  Other than price, they severely lack in anything else that matters to a consumer such as service, selection, product availability (poorly stocked stores), store cleanliness, and oh yes those maddening wobbly a$$ed shopping carts!  But to their credit it's better to have a WMNM than no store at all in the areas they service. 

I can get by with poorer customer service, but the limited offerings and fewer brands in our supermarkets pose more of an issue.  Unless one is aware of these gaps from shopping elsewhere, then it perhaps is not an issue as it has been said that you don't miss what you didn't have. 

It is worth mentioning that the success of non-traditional and/or specialty supermarkets in Tulsa such as Walmart and one end of the spectrum and Fresh Market, Whole Foods, Sprouts etc. on the other end is likely attributed to what traditional grocers such as Homeland, Albertsons, Food Pyramid and Reasors others did/do not provide to the market. 

As such, I will conclude that for a city of its size and appealing demographics, Tulsa is somewhat underserved in terms of full line modern supermarkets.  Hopefully, one of the closer regional chains that several posters have mentioned will come in and seize the opportunity.

[MyDogHunts]

As such, I will conclude that for a city of its size and appealing demographics, Tulsa is somewhat underserved in terms of full line modern supermarkets.  Hopefully, one of the closer regional chains that several posters have mentioned will come in and seize the opportunity.

Not in this neighborhood of 31st and Harvard; not now... but as you are new you may not know about our lack of any facility in North Tulsa worth mentioning.  That is a nightmare.

Sprouts opens at 7AM on Wednesday.  I've heard they already have land to expand into Broken Arrow.  There is a new store opening in Kansas City.  Tulsa is served by the Dallas distribution center as I suppose Kansas City is and they seem eager to expand their 170-such stores.  I expect Tulsa will get several more and at some point Kansas, Arkansas, Missouri will be served by a regional distribution center local to this market.

[joiei]

Wegmans, as nice as they are (I have been in some in Philly) will probably never relocate to middle America.  Heck, I would love to see Publix move here but realize that will never happen. The best possible choice is HEB and their Central Market division out of Texas.  Krogers has no appeal to me, Dillons neither.  Tom Thumb is like a fancy Albertsons. I don't see Price Chopper or Hyvee moving this far south either.  The new Whole Foods will create some changes in the local markets but nothing significant. For the price conscious Walmart will continue to rule. For the selection driven shopper Reasors still rules.  For upscale, Petty's still has that market. I like Fresh Market for their meat market and some variety in selections no one else carries.  I still miss shopping at Cala Foods on Market in San Francisco and at United Stupor in Welches, OR.

[Rookie Okie]

Not in this neighborhood of 31st and Harvard; not now... but as you are new you may not know about our lack of any facility in North Tulsa worth mentioning.  That is a nightmare.

Sprouts opens at 7AM on Wednesday.  I've heard they already have land to expand into Broken Arrow.  There is a new store opening in Kansas City.  Tulsa is served by the Dallas distribution center as I suppose Kansas City is and they seem eager to expand their 170-such stores.  I expect Tulsa will get several more and at some point Kansas, Arkansas, Missouri will be served by a regional distribution center local to this market.

Yes I am aware of the lack of food options in North Tulsa.  It's a food desert just as you find in most if not all mid to large U.S. cities. 

Owasso officials were trying to let it slip recently by announcing that people looking for healthier food options would be excited about an upcoming announcement.  I deduced that it might be that Sprouts would be opening a store in town.  If so, that would be a much welcome addition.

[Rookie Okie]

Wegmans, as nice as they are (I have been in some in Philly) will probably never relocate to middle America.  Heck, I would love to see Publix move here but realize that will never happen. The best possible choice is HEB and their Central Market division out of Texas.  Krogers has no appeal to me, Dillons neither.  Tom Thumb is like a fancy Albertsons. I don't see Price Chopper or Hyvee moving this far south either.  The new Whole Foods will create some changes in the local markets but nothing significant. For the price conscious Walmart will continue to rule. For the selection driven shopper Reasors still rules.  For upscale, Petty's still has that market. I like Fresh Market for their meat market and some variety in selections no one else carries.  I still miss shopping at Cala Foods on Market in San Francisco and at United Stupor in Welches, OR.

Yes Joiei, hopefully one of the better closer regional chains such as the ones you cited might find this an attractive and underserved market.  BTW, I guess by local comparison Reasors would have the best selection, but I find them severely lacking.  They would be no match for an HEB Central Market or Publix in terms of selection.

[AngieB]

Not in this neighborhood of 31st and Harvard; not now... but as you are new you may not know about our lack of any facility in North Tulsa worth mentioning.  That is a nightmare.

And let's not even get started on the lack of a decent grocery store for the Westside. Warehouse Market is trying to up their game...produce looks better there than it has in years, but it's still Warehouse Market — where I can get my groceries and "pay my light bill".

[dbacksfan 2.0]

And let's not even get started on the lack of a decent grocery store for the Westside. Warehouse Market is trying to up their game...produce looks better there than it has in years, but it's still Warehouse Market — where I can get my groceries and "pay my light bill".

You know, that whole area from Redfork, along 75S to I-44 to the turnpike gate and along SW Blvd has been under served for decades it seems. I think that WH Market has been at 51st & Union (I know it was in the strip mall just NW of it before they built the current one) since the 60's. IIRC wasn't there a Safeway then Homeland at W41st and Hwy 97 years ago?