Solar and Wind Power Fees for Oklahomans

[Hoss]

Cheer up- The Obama EPA just won it's case against Oklahoma power companies- expect out electric bills to go up 25%. I guess the EPA believes that C02 is a toxic polluting  gas. The power companies have to install scrubbers that cost half a billion dollars. Obama's policies really help the poor working class folks. C02 a toxic gas- indeed!

Wow...you just might ask the crew of Apollo 13 and NASA whether or not CO2 is toxic.  I'm betting you also think the world is flat and was created 6000 years ago, right?

[Red Arrow]

Just for you, rotting cabbage: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1083623/Two-French-wine-makers-suffocated-carbon-dioxide-fumes-grapes-treading.html

The gas is odourless and colourless, meaning that ventilation and carbon dioxide testing during the wine-making process can become life-saving. A concentration of just eight per cent is enough to kill a human being.

What is the TLV for "toxic"?  I usually think of things like Chlorine gas as "toxic".   A room full of Nitrogen gas, without enough Oxygen, can suffocate a person.  Our earth's atmosphere is about 78% Nitrogen.  It can kill you.  Should we label Nitrogen as "toxic"?

[RecycleMichael]

Cheer up- The Obama EPA just won it's case against Oklahoma power companies- expect out electric bills to go up 25%. I guess the EPA believes that C02 is a toxic polluting  gas. The power companies have to install scrubbers that cost half a billion dollars. Obama's policies really help the poor working class folks. C02 a toxic gas- indeed!

You have no clue to what you are talking about. You really should stop posting here. As your friend, shut up.

Co2 is a pollutant. Old power plants (especially the coal ones) need updating. The industry recognizes this and is doing it. All the E.P.A. did was set a national standard, then allow each state to set up their own rules.

If you want to read an objective analysis of the facts and their potential effects on the price of electricity...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2014/05/23/a-bogus-claim-that-electricity-prices-will-nearly-double-because-of-clean-coal-technology/

[sgrizzle]

I'm glad I come across as completely reasonable now. Thanks Sauerkraut!

[Red Arrow]

Toxic - not a definition but the chart at the link gives some TLVs that include our favorite chemicals.

TWA - Time Weighted Average
STEL - Short Term Exposure Limit
IDLH - Immediately Dangerous to Life or Health (30 minute escape time)

https://www.mathesongas.com/pdfs/products/threshold-limit-values-(tlv).pdf

[heironymouspasparagus]

We can also put turbines on the toilets pipes of high rise buildings so when you flush it produces a little bit of energy.  

Put them under Congress - power problems solved!!

[patric]

So if PSO's new Smart Meters *might* be configured to charge customers for sending excess power back into the grid, what if customers just decided to store it on-site instead?

There's an App for that (maybe):
http://qz.com/346242/elon-musk-is-designing-a-tesla-battery-to-power-your-home

But before you go thinking you can just go live "off the grid," be aware that sort of anarchy threatens the very fiber of American industry:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/15/texas-swat-team-conducts-_n_3764951.html

Exciting times are ahead of us.

[patric]

PSO is asking the Corporation Commission if it can add a new fee to customers who dont want to be switched to "Smart Meters"

This registers big on my BS meter:             my comments in green





Public Service Company of Oklahoma is installing 300,000 smart meters, but not everyone wants one.
There are people who believe the smart meters are unhealthy and transmit too much personal information - like how much energy you use and when.
PSO is asking the Oklahoma Corporation Commission if it can allow customers to opt-out of getting the smart meters, but that could cost hundreds of dollars.

PSO is seeking an opt-out option for those customers to keep their current meter, but it would come at a cost, according to PSO spokesperson, Stan Whiteford.
"They don't even manufacture the old style meters in the United States anymore. They're all the new digital type of meter," he said.
...misleading; not every digital meter is a smart meter...

The new digital meters transmit information - like how much electricity you use - so there's no need for someone to physically read the meter.
But, those who wish to keep their current meter would still need it read manually. For that, there's a price tag.
"It would cost us more to maintain two systems and maintain the employees to go out and do the meter reading and stuff (like they do now and have been doing for about the past century), so that's why we would file for the cost recovery with that," Whiteford said.

In Texas, there are opt-out options. Customers who don't want a smart meter must write to their utility company and pay a one-time fee and a monthly fee.
The Public Utility Commission of Texas said the one-time fee costs averages $150 to $175 and the monthly fee is about $20 to $40.

The Oklahoma Corporation Commission will decide whether PSO can offer that option, and how much the company could charge for an opt-out.
Right now, all PSO customers are paying a temporary $3 charge to install the smart meters, whether you want one or not.

[sgrizzle]

PSO is asking the Corporation Commission if it can add a new fee to customers who dont want to be switched to "Smart Meters"

This registers big on my BS meter:             my comments in green





Public Service Company of Oklahoma is installing 300,000 smart meters, but not everyone wants one.
There are people who believe the smart meters are unhealthy and transmit too much personal information - like how much energy you use and when.
PSO is asking the Oklahoma Corporation Commission if it can allow customers to opt-out of getting the smart meters, but that could cost hundreds of dollars.

PSO is seeking an opt-out option for those customers to keep their current meter, but it would come at a cost, according to PSO spokesperson, Stan Whiteford.
"They don't even manufacture the old style meters in the United States anymore. They're all the new digital type of meter," he said.
...misleading; not every digital meter is a smart meter...

The new digital meters transmit information - like how much electricity you use - so there's no need for someone to physically read the meter.
But, those who wish to keep their current meter would still need it read manually. For that, there's a price tag.
"It would cost us more to maintain two systems and maintain the employees to go out and do the meter reading and stuff (like they do now and have been doing for about the past century), so that's why we would file for the cost recovery with that," Whiteford said.

In Texas, there are opt-out options. Customers who don't want a smart meter must write to their utility company and pay a one-time fee and a monthly fee.
The Public Utility Commission of Texas said the one-time fee costs averages $150 to $175 and the monthly fee is about $20 to $40.

The Oklahoma Corporation Commission will decide whether PSO can offer that option, and how much the company could charge for an opt-out.
Right now, all PSO customers are paying a temporary $3 charge to install the smart meters, whether you want one or not.

He didn't say that all digital meters are smart meters, he said that they don't make old style "non smart" meters in the US. You can check GE's site, all the meters are smart meters: http://www.gedigitalenergy.com/SmartMetering/ansi_meters.htm

Once the smart meters are deployed, there will not be a meter reading staff. Those individuals have been looking for new jobs for about a year. If people refuse smart meters, then the utility will have to pay meter readers.

PSO isn't making this stuff up. This is all industry-standard at this point, just like having carts for our trash service which was also going to bring about the apocalypse.

OG&E which servers most the rest of the state started rolling these out years ago. PSO rolled them out in limited areas several years ago as well without demonic possession.

[Townsend]

This is all industry-standard at this point, just like having carts for our trash service which was also going to bring about the apocalypse.

PSO rolled them out in limited areas several years ago as well without demonic possession.

My front bushes exploded.

[Conan71]

My mother called the other day worried if they put a smart meter on her house they could throttle her electricity.  I had to explain to her whey they would not cut the air conditioning off on senior citizens. 

[DolfanBob]

I think it's a waste of time to put a smart meter on a dumb house. 

But seriously. If it keeps some knucklehead from ruining the same section of fence by jumping over it. Then I'm all for it. Plus my dog will be happy.

[heironymouspasparagus]

The new digital meters transmit information - like how much electricity you use - so there's no need for someone to physically read the meter.
But, those who wish to keep their current meter would still need it read manually. For that, there's a price tag.
"It would cost us more to maintain two systems and maintain the employees to go out and do the meter reading and stuff (like they do now and have been doing for about the past century), so that's why we would file for the cost recovery with that," Whiteford said.

They know how much electricity you use now.  And when you use it... Jan, Feb, Mar, etc.  The smart meters will only increase the granularity or resolution of the measurement.   I wonder what the perceived difference would be??


Sometime in the future...  30 days?  15 years??  They may use the finer increments of information to make load adjustments, like have been done in other places for many years.  Example would be in August, late afternoon - 2 pm to 7 pm - you might be notified that if you stagger the use of your A/C and electric dryer, you can save some money.  Instead of just cruising through at peak demand rates, one might let the thermostat creep up a few degrees during that time window to save a few bucks a month.  Or wait to dry your clothes until 7:01 pm to save a few more.  Or better yet, install a clothesline in the backyard and dry the clothes with no electricity.

It's all about peak demand.  And keeping it down.

[Red Arrow]

My mother called the other day worried if they put a smart meter on her house they could throttle her electricity.  I had to explain to her whey they would not cut the air conditioning off on senior citizens. 

Will they cut off air conditioning for younger folks so us older citizens can keep cool?

[Red Arrow]

The Oklahoma Corporation Commission will decide whether PSO can offer that option, and how much the company could charge for an opt-out.
Right now, all PSO customers are paying a temporary $3 charge to install the smart meters, whether you want one or not.

Pay an additional fee to not opt out and save PSO money.  Doesn't sound like it's going to save me anything.