Absolved: The alcohol made me do it...

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

Funnier that Packwood?[]

You said "Pack Wood" uh huh uh huh[}:)]

Now there was a real slimeball.

[iplaw]

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

...Anyone that knew about this and kept quiet should resign immediately and hang their heads in shame for the rest of their lives...

 And that would be Congressman Dennis Hastert (R), Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Other than political hopefulness, what do you have to back this up?  No one has any proof that Hastert knew of the IMs that ABC published, if that were the case he would already be gone.

[okiebybirth]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

...Anyone that knew about this and kept quiet should resign immediately and hang their heads in shame for the rest of their lives...

 And that would be Congressman Dennis Hastert (R), Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Other than political hopefulness, what do you have to back this up?  No one has any proof that Hastert knew of the IMs that ABC published, if that were the case he would already be gone.

Good thing he didn't investigate further with the IMs he DID see... otherwise he might have found out what took so little time for ABC to find.  Seems like a game of "if I don't look, I will not find anything"  [B)]

[snopes]

I am quite sure that ALOT more people knew of this than are letting on. People knew this guy is what he is and just turned their heads for convenience, out of shame for the party, or let it go on until they found the right time to expose him. It's shameful behavior, in any case.

How 'bout that beer? I say we all go over to Brunoflipper's house. I hear he mixes a mean brew. But he won't give me directions!

[iplaw]

quote:
Good thing he didn't investigate further with the IMs he DID see...

The IMs available that he DID see were not illegal in any shape form or fashion according to what we know today.  No one had seen the emails ABC had until they came out.  No one knew to look for them because no one knew they existed.  

Someone paid for them to be released which means they were under lock and key by the page who was keeping them secret.  No one knew of the existence of what ABC published until they did so.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

No one knew of the existence of what ABC published until they did so.

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

Other than political hopefulness, what do you have to back this up?

[iplaw]

Existence is a separate animal from knowledge of existence.

There were TWO sets of emails:

1.  Contained NO illegal or improper material.  Both Dems and Reps knew about these long ago; and

2.  Secret emails purchased by someone from the page which NO ONE knew about other than the page and Foley.

You cannot infer knowledge of 2 from knowledge of 1.

[iplaw]

BTW, If N. Korea tests a nuclear weapon in the next few days you can kiss this story goodbye, as with any hopes of a Dem victory in November...so you'd better make the best of it now.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

Existence is a separate animal from knowledge of existence.

There were TWO sets of emails:

1.  Contained NO illegal or improper material.  Both Dems and Reps knew about these long ago; and

2.  Secret emails purchased by someone from the page which NO ONE knew about other than the page and Foley.

You cannot infer knowledge of 2 from knowledge of 1.

Scratch that, IP- no one other than the page, Foley, and Mahoney, Foley's opponent in the election since it appears the leak to Brian Ross came from his camp.

It's still an abuse of power on Foley's part, no doubt, but more than anything, I smell political trickery since Mahoney was fairing poorly in the campaign.

Here's a time line from the Palm Beach Post which says the FBI reviewed the first set of emails in July and found he had not broken any laws.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/politics/content/local_news/epaper/2006/10/04/a8a_foleytime_1004.html

He definitely broke the trust between legislators and pages, but it remains to be seen if there were actual violations of any laws since the pages were of the age of majority in D.C.  50 year old guys persuing 16 year old boys?  Yuck!

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

Existence is a separate animal from knowledge of existence.

There were TWO sets of emails:

1.  Contained NO illegal or improper material.  Both Dems and Reps knew about these long ago; and

2.  Secret emails purchased by someone from the page which NO ONE knew about other than the page and Foley.

You state with certainty that no one knew about them. You can't prove that no one else knew about them. You can't even KNOW that anyone esle knew about them. It's just your political hope.

Same shoe--other foot. [}:)]

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

BTW, If N. Korea tests a nuclear weapon in the next few days you can kiss this story goodbye, as with any hopes of a Dem victory in November...so you'd better make the best of it now.

Oh, I expect something pretty dramatic and terrifying will be announced by the White House between now and the election. That's Bush's mantra. "When the going gets tough, scare the hell out of 'em."

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

quote:Originally posted by iplaw


Scratch that, IP- no one other than the page, Foley, and Mahoney, Foley's opponent in the election since it appears the leak to Brian Ross came from his camp.

It's still an abuse of power on Foley's part, no doubt, but more than anything, I smell political trickery since Mahoney was fairing poorly in the campaign.

IF his political opponent turns out to have a major role in blowing the whistle on this creep for political gain, then that would be unacceptable, IMO. But for the Republicans to cry foul over freak show politics would take unabashed hypocrisy to a whole new level.

He definitely broke the trust between legislators and pages, but it remains to be seen if there were actual violations of any laws since the pages were of the age of majority in D.C.  50 year old guys persuing 16 year old boys?  Yuck!

Laws or no laws, any 50 year old that goes after a 16 year old is a SUB creep in my book. And I don't give a rat's donkey the genders, orientations or political affiliations of the predator or the victim.

[Chicken Little]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Chicken Little

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

...Anyone that knew about this and kept quiet should resign immediately and hang their heads in shame for the rest of their lives...

 And that would be Congressman Dennis Hastert (R), Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Other than political hopefulness, what do you have to back this up?  No one has any proof that Hastert knew of the IMs that ABC published, if that were the case he would already be gone.

Didn't say that he did have knowledge of the IMs.  He had knowledge of the emails, which were disturbing.  Staffers are now saying they pleaded with him to intervene in '03.  He should have acted. And he probably will be gone, if not before the election, then before the end of the year.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

He definitely broke the trust between legislators and pages, but it remains to be seen if there were actual violations of any laws since the pages were of the age of majority in D.C.

That remains to be seen, too. The fact that they may NOW be of the age of consent doesn't mean what they were when this crap started. It also remains to be seen if there were kids involved that we don't even know about.

[aoxamaxoa]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

BTW, If N. Korea tests a nuclear weapon in the next few days you can kiss this story goodbye, as with any hopes of a Dem victory in November...so you'd better make the best of it now.

That's bs. We have no leverage left. Shrub has made us second rate. Rant all you want. When the Senate and Congress become democratic, you know run by the democrats, we will have 2 years of nothingness unless we get lucky and they start to impeach the jerk.