Absolved: The alcohol made me do it...

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw
[brWe've been over and over this one.  If he was lying, so was every other intelligence agency on the planet.

Nice try, but no cigar. The CIA actually warned the White House about making claims that Saddam tried to buy uranium from Africa. And remember the International Atomic Energy Commission report that said that Iraq was six months away from having nuclear weapons? You know...the one that Bush cited but the IEAC said doesn't even exist? That didn't come from any intelligence agency.

And then there's the Downing Street Memo...

quote:
Lowest unemployment in recent history, record DOW levels, extremely low interest rates, relatively little inflation and the highest ever recorded tax renvenues, and a deficit which is shrinking rapidly as we saw in the news this morning.

The deficit is shrinking rapidly. Nice. What about all the debt that was rung up in the meantime? And we're still a far cry from a surplus. As for "lowest unemployment in recent history" you should get some kind of AWARD for THAT bit of spin. What do you call "recent history"? Would you say about since...oh...let's say....BUSH took office?

quote:
We've been over these ad infinitem as well.

Yep. And you've yet to score a single point on it.

quote:
How about some that aren't regurgitated air-america talking points.

Nice try but, again...no cigar. I've never listened to Air America in my life.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

The GOP had been seeing surging gains in opinion polls about national security, the economy (it takes a lot of spin to say the economy is suffering), moral issues, etc. prior to the Foley scandal.

One of the lib propagandists was gloating the other night about how the Democrats have surged so nicely since Foleygate broke.

Surges don't mean much for Republicans OR Democrats. Talk about spin...I'd say it's spin to say that the Republicans were even experiencing a surge at all.

I didn't selectively cut and paste on any of these polls, this was all the data available:

CBS News/New York Times Poll. Sept. 15-19, 2006. N=1,131 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3 (for all adults).
                  .
"Do you approve or disapprove of the way George W. Bush is handling the campaign against terrorism?"
                  .
      Approve   Disapprove   Unsure       
      %   %   %       
   ALL adults   54   40   6       
     Republicans   82   14   4       
     Democrats   28   64   8       
     Independents   55   40   5       
                  .
   Trend:
   8/17-21/06   55   38   7       
   8/11-13/06   51   43   6       
   7/21-25/06   51   42   7       
   6/10-11/06   47   46   7       
   5/16-17/06   46   47   7       
   5/4-8/06   46   48   6       
   4/28-30/06   45   45   10       
   4/6-9/06   47   46   7       
   3/9-12/06   45   47   8       
   2/22-26/06   43   50   7      


TIPP INDICATORS
Investor's Business Daily/Christian Science Monitor/TIPP poll conducted by TechnoMetrica Market Intelligence. N=approx. 1,000 adults nationwide.
      .            
Based on a scale of 0 to 100,
with scores above 50 indicating
a positive near-term outlook. (methodology)
ECONOMIC
OPTIMISM
INDEX   PRESIDENTIAL
LEADERSHIP
INDEX   NATIONAL
OUTLOOK
INDEX      
      .            
   9/5-9/06   50.5   41.9   44.9      
   8/1-5/06   45.6   40.0   42.3      
   7/5-9/06   47.3   42.7   43.0      
   6/5-9/06   46.2   40.8   42.7      
   5/1-6/06   46.1   38.9   42.8      
   4/1-7/06   48.6   40.6   44.0      
   3/6-11/06   49.1   38.4   43.5      
   2/6-10/06   50.5   42.9   45.1      
   1/2-5/06   50.5   42.4   45.7      
   12/05   51.1   44.3   45.8      
   11/05   48.6   41.1   44.1      
   10/3-8/05   42.0   41.2   41.9      
   9/6-11/05   41.2   42.8   41.9      
   8/1-5/05   50.9   50.7   48.1      
USA Today/Gallup- "If the congressional elections were held today would you vote for:

Date            Rep.          Dem
7/28            40             51
8/7             41             50
8/18            45             47
9/15            48             48
10/6            37             58

Those are surges in public opinion for the GOP about issues and the powers that be, that are from reputable sources.  There were plenty of indicators other than these that Republicans were starting to fare well in the polls again.  

I'm AM somewhat suspect as to how data is gathered and disseminated in the various polls.  There are some polls that are only good to wipe your a$$ with.

However, I'll respectfully disagree on your point of surges being irrelevant.  In the psyche of the average voter they are important.  They can serve either party well or decimate their hopes for power.  If the news or poll numbers are good for one side, the monkey-see, monkey-do voter goes with the masses without much thought.  If the numbers are bad, it can create voter apathy, because they think it's already such a lost cause for their party or candidate, that they don't even bother to vote.

[iplaw]

quote:
650,000 Iraqis dead,

Okay I finally read it.

This may actually be good news. With this five fold increase from Lancet's analysis from a one ago (the 100,000 figure that was much discussed and disputed) next year we can expect them to report (5x) 3 million dead, and 15,000,000 dead by 2008, when GWB's successor is elected. Add to that the 500,000+ per year who have been reported as fleeing the country, per other news reports, and Iraq will be nearly depopulated by November 2008.  Only Kurdistan will be left.

[xx(]

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:
650,000 Iraqis dead,

Okay I finally read it.

This may actually be good news. With this five fold increase from Lancet's analysis from a one ago (the 100,000 figure that was much discussed and disputed) next year we can expect them to report (5x) 3 million dead, and 15,000,000 dead by 2008, when GWB's successor is elected. Add to that the 500,000+ per year who have been reported as fleeing the country, per other news reports, and Iraq will be nearly depopulated by November 2008.  Only Kurdistan will be left.

[xx(]

I think that was the original plan us Neo-Cons secretly met, discussed, and planned wasn't it IP?  Sounds like it's going swimmingly well.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71
[br

We also disagree on what the definition of the word "surge" is. These changes are pretty small. I also stand by my assertion that real surges mean little unless they happen on election day.

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:
650,000 Iraqis dead,

Okay I finally read it.

This may actually be good news. With this five fold increase from Lancet's analysis from a one ago (the 100,000 figure that was much discussed and disputed) next year we can expect them to report (5x) 3 million dead, and 15,000,000 dead by 2008, when GWB's successor is elected. Add to that the 500,000+ per year who have been reported as fleeing the country, per other news reports, and Iraq will be nearly depopulated by November 2008.  Only Kurdistan will be left.

[xx(]

Well, you can always deny the credibility of any information that you don't want to hear. The fact is that this was a credible study that used the same clustering technique that has been used and accepted for years for estimating deaths after natural disasters. I don't know what it's margin of error is but even if it was 25% (which I'm sure it's much lower than that) that's still a lot more people killed than would have been killed if we hadn't come to their "rescue".

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

quote:Originally posted by Conan71
[br

We also disagree on what the definition of the word "surge" is. These changes are pretty small. I also stand by my assertion that real surges mean little unless they happen on election day.

"Surge", "gain", "upward trend" whatever.  I suppose using the term "surge" could imply large gains which wasn't my intention.  

At any rate, the GOP was starting to see some upward trends in public opinion as clearly shown in the polls I posted.  

It might not be important to you, but politicos and party propagandists follow the shifting sands of polls and trends.  When the other party is starting to gain, it's time to get more vitriolic, slander the opponent, and start with the dirty tricks.

[Chicken Little]

Interesting gossip from The New Republic:

quote:
HOW ROVE TWISTED FOLEY'S ARM:

"..According to the source, Foley said he was being pressured by "the White House and Rove gang," who insisted that Foley run. If he didn't, Foley was told, it might impact his lobbying career..."

DOH!

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

quote:Originally posted by Conan71
[br

We also disagree on what the definition of the word "surge" is. These changes are pretty small. I also stand by my assertion that real surges mean little unless they happen on election day.

"Surge", "gain", "upward trend" whatever.  I suppose using the term "surge" could imply large gains which wasn't my intention.  

At any rate, the GOP was starting to see some upward trends in public opinion as clearly shown in the polls I posted.  

It might not be important to you, but politicos and party propagandists follow the shifting sands of polls and trends.  When the other party is starting to gain, it's time to get more vitriolic, slander the opponent, and start with the dirty tricks.

Oh, from THAT standpoint, I agree. But as far as likelihood of winning the election, what's on the evening news the day before the election is a better predictor.

When you said "surge", I thought you meant something like "spike".

[Conan71]

*YAWN*

Another Libtard article with quotes from mysterious and un-named sources.

*ZZZZZZZZZZZ*

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

quote:Originally posted by papaspot

quote:Originally posted by Conan71
[br

We also disagree on what the definition of the word "surge" is. These changes are pretty small. I also stand by my assertion that real surges mean little unless they happen on election day.

"Surge", "gain", "upward trend" whatever.  I suppose using the term "surge" could imply large gains which wasn't my intention.  

At any rate, the GOP was starting to see some upward trends in public opinion as clearly shown in the polls I posted.  

It might not be important to you, but politicos and party propagandists follow the shifting sands of polls and trends.  When the other party is starting to gain, it's time to get more vitriolic, slander the opponent, and start with the dirty tricks.

Oh, from THAT standpoint, I agree. But as far as likelihood of winning the election, what's on the evening news the day before the election is a better predictor.

When you said "surge", I thought you meant something like "spike".

Hey Papa, I don't believe anything until the morning AFTER the election. []

[papaspot]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71


Hey Papa, I don't believe anything until the morning AFTER the election. []

Smart practice. I understand that Dewey actually LOST.

[aoxamaxoa]

list of GOP Pedophiles

Republican County Board Candidate Brent Schepp was charged with molesting a 14-year old girl.
Republican Congressman Mark Foley abruptly resigned from Congress after "sexually explicit" emails surfaced showing him flirting with a 16-year old boy.
Republican executive Randall Casseday of the conservative Washington Times newspaper was arrested for soliciting sex from a 13-year old girl on the internet.
Republican chairman of the Oregon Christian Coalition Lou Beres confessed to molesting a 13-year old girl.
Republican County Constable Larry Dale Floyd was arrested on suspicion of soliciting sex with an 8-year old girl. Floyd has repeatedly won elections for Denton County, Texas, constable.
Republican judge Mark Pazuhanich pleaded no contest to fondling a 10-year old girl and was sentenced to 10 years probation.
Republican Party leader Bobby Stumbo was arrested for having sex with a 5-year old boy.
Republican petition drive manager Tom Randall pleaded guilty to molesting two girls under the age of 14, one of them the daughter of an associate in the petition business.
Republican County Chairman Armando Tebano was arrested for sexually molesting a 14-year-old girl.
Republican teacher and former city councilman John Collins pleaded guilty to sexually molesting 13 and 14 year old girls.
Republican campaign worker Mark Seidensticker is a convicted child molester.
Republican Mayor Philip Giordano is serving a 37-year sentence in federal prison for sexually abusing 8- and 10-year old girls.
Republican Mayor Tom Adams was arrested for distributing child pornography over the internet.
Republican Mayor John Gosek was arrested on charges of soliciting sex from two 15-year old girls.
Republican County Commissioner David Swartz pleaded guilty to molesting two girls under the age of 11 and was sentenced to 8 years in prison.
Republican legislator Edison Misla Aldarondo was sentenced to 10 years in prison for raping his daughter between the ages of 9 and 17.
Republican Committeeman John R. Curtain was charged with molesting a teenage boy and unlawful sexual contact with a minor.
Republican anti-abortion activist Howard Scott Heldreth is a convicted child rapist in Florida.
Republican zoning supervisor, Boy Scout leader and Lutheran church president Dennis L. Rader pleaded guilty to performing a sexual act on an 11-year old girl he murdered.
Republican anti-abortion activist Nicholas Morency pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography on his computer and offering a bounty to anybody who murders an abortion doctor.
Republican campaign consultant Tom Shortridge was sentenced to three years probation for taking nude photographs of a 15-year old girl.
Republican racist pedophile and United States Senator Strom Thurmond had sex with a 15-year old black girl which produced a child.
Republican pastor Mike Hintz, whom George W. Bush commended during the 2004 presidential campaign, surrendered to police after admitting to a sexual affair with a female juvenile.
Republican legislator Peter Dibble pleaded no contest to having an inappropriate relationship with a 13-year-old girl.
Republican advertising consultant Carey Lee Cramer was sentenced to six years in prison for molesting two 8-year old girls, one of whom appeared in an anti-Gore television commercial.
Republican activist Lawrence E. King, Jr. organized child sex parties at the White House during the 1980s.
Republican lobbyist Craig J. Spence organized child sex parties at the White House during the 1980s.
Republican Congressman Donald "Buz" Lukens was found guilty of having sex with a female minor and sentenced to one month in jail.
Republican fundraiser Richard A. Delgaudio was found guilty of child porn charges and paying two teenage girls to pose for sexual photos.
Republican activist Mark A. Grethen convicted on six counts of sex crimes involving children.
Republican campaign chairman Randal David Ankeney pleaded guilty to attempted sexual assault on a child and was arrested again five years later on the same charge.
Republican Congressman Dan Crane had sex with a female minor working as a congressional page.
Republican activist and Christian Coalition leader Beverly Russell admitted to an incestuous relationship with his step daughter.
Republican Judge Ronald C. Kline was placed under house arrest for child molestation and possession of child pornography.
Republican congressman and anti-gay activist Robert Bauman was charged with having sex with a 16-year-old boy he picked up at a gay bar.
Republican Committee Chairman Jeffrey Patti was arrested for distributing a video clip of a 5-year-old girl being raped.
Republican activist Marty Glickman (a.k.a. "Republican Marty"), was taken into custody by Florida police on four counts of unlawful sexual activity with an underage girl and one count of delivering the drug LSD.
Republican legislative aide Howard L. Brooks was charged with molesting a 12-year old boy and possession of child pornography.
Republican Senate candidate John Hathaway was accused of having sex with his 12-year old baby sitter and withdrew his candidacy after the allegations were reported in the media.

Republican preacher Stephen White, who demanded a return to traditional values, was sentenced to jail after offering $20 to a 14-year-old boy for permission to perform oral sex on him.

Republican talk show host Jon Matthews pleaded guilty to exposing his genitals to an 11 year old girl.

Republican anti-gay activist Earl "Butch" Kimmerling was sentenced to 40 years in prison for molesting an 8-year old girl after he attempted to stop a gay couple from adopting her.
Republican Party leader Paul Ingram pleaded guilty to six counts of raping his daughters and served 14 years in federal prison.
Republican election board official Kevin Coan was sentenced to two years probation for soliciting sex over the internet from a 14-year old girl.
Republican politician Andrew Buhr was charged with two counts of first degree sodomy with a 13-year old boy.

Republican legislator Keith Westmoreland was arrested on seven felony counts of lewd and lascivious exhibition to girls under the age of 16 (i.e. exposing himself to children).

Republican anti-abortion activist John Allen Burt was found guilty of molesting a 15-year old girl.
Republican County Councilman Keola Childs pleaded guilty to molesting a male child.
Republican activist John Butler was charged with criminal sexual assault on a teenage girl.
Republican candidate Richard Gardner admitted to molesting his two daughters.
Republican Councilman and former Marine Jack W. Gardner was convicted of molesting a 13-year old girl.
Republican County Commissioner Merrill Robert Barter pleaded guilty to unlawful sexual contact and assault on a teenage boy.
Republican City Councilman Fred C. Smeltzer, Jr. pleaded no contest to raping a 15 year-old girl and served 6-months in prison.
Republican activist Parker J. Bena pleaded guilty to possession of child pornography on his home computer and was sentenced to 30 months in federal prison and fined $18,000.
Republican parole board officer and former Colorado state representative, Larry Jack Schwarz, was fired after child pornography was found in his possession.
Republican strategist and Citadel Military College graduate Robin Vanderwall was convicted in Virginia on five counts of soliciting sex from boys and girls over the internet.
Republican city councilman Mark Harris, who is described as a "good military man" and "church goer," was convicted of repeatedly having sex with an 11-year-old girl and sentenced to 12 years in prison.
Republican businessman Jon Grunseth withdrew his candidacy for Minnesota governor after allegations surfaced that he went swimming in the nude with four underage girls, including his daughter.
Republican campaign worker, police officer and self-proclaimed reverend Steve Aiken was convicted of having sex with two underage girls.
Republican director of the "Young Republican Federation" Nicholas Elizondo molested his 6-year old daughter and was sentenced to six years in prison.
Republican president of the New York City Housing Development Corp. Russell Harding pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography on his computer.
Republican benefactor of conservative Christian groups, Richard A. Dasen Sr., was found guilty of raping a 15-year old girl. Dasen, 62, who is married with grown children and several grandchildren, has allegedly told police that over the past decade he paid more than $1 million to have sex with a large number of young women.
Republican Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld authorized the rape of children in Iraqi prisons in order to humiliate their parents into providing information about the anti-American insurgency. See excerpt of one prisoner's report here and his full report here.

http://www.armchairsubversive.com/

Point is that they are all wrong!

Point is that the current GOP leadership has covered up Foley since 2000.

It is more important for those in the GOP to remain in power than to protect our under aged (children) pages.

It doesn't bother you that these people put their jobs over the safety of children?

Thought the GOP was suppose to be the party of accountability, ethics, faith, and morals.

What happened?

[NellieBly]

Apparently Foley was seen and photographed in Austin partying this weekend.

[aoxamaxoa]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

Apparently Foley was seen and photographed in Austin partying this weekend.

I thought that was Mel Gibson.....