Thoughts on the Comprehensive Plan

[PonderInc]

Here's a quote from a 2004 INCOG document entitled "The Citizen's Guide to Planning & Zoning."

The purpose of zoning, and the Zoning Code, is to "promote the health, safety and public welfare; conserve the value of buildings and encourage the most appropriate use of land; and promote the development of the community in accordance with a comprehensive plan." The primary objective of zoning, in its simplest form, is to separate commercial and industrial uses from residential uses.

As we move forward with updating the comprehensive plan, I hope we can reach a more sophisticated understanding of the purpose of zoning.  

I like Alan Hart's concept that zoning is just a recipe you use to create the city you desire.  The city I desire is not defined by strict segregation of uses.  In my favorite cities, people live on top of pizza places, or next door to coffee shops, or a few feet from the hardware store.  All of which is much more conducive to "promoting the health, safety, and public welfare" than our current methodology.  

When you no longer isolate people from what they need by miles of uninhabited roadway, you make it easy to live, work, dine, and be entertained...all within walking distance of home.  It also means that some spaces aren't deserted during the day (ie: residential areas vacated during the day), while others are deserted at night (ie: commercial areas that shut down after 5:00).  

Commercial uses aren't the problem.  Commercial zoning that requires excessive parking and auto-access is the problem.  I hope that our next stab at the comprehensive plan will allow us to break away from archaic ideas of auto-isolationism and move towards a healthier, more integrated sense of neighborhood.

Let the conversation begin.

[AMP]

I like his idea of playing, eating and having entertainment and services where you live. What a concept....

Reminds me of Tulsa evicting Tulsa Fairgrounds Speedway off the Expo.  It relocated at 66th Street North and plowed ground.  Lost the spectators as they could not find it lost in a dark forest up on North Highway 75.  One film clip on the Tulsa Fantastic Films had a shot of the race cars on the Speedway, the commentator said, there was also auto racing at the Fairgounds at one time.    

The noise and dust bothered less people, so many less that it no longer exists.

Wonder how Driller Stadium would of faired located at 66th Street North and plowed ground?

Better to have special event centers located where some people actually live.  

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by PonderInc

Here's a quote from a 2004 INCOG document entitled "The Citizen's Guide to Planning & Zoning."

The purpose of zoning, and the Zoning Code, is to �promote the health, safety and public welfare; conserve the value of buildings and encourage the most appropriate use of land; and promote the development of the community in accordance with a comprehensive plan.� The primary objective of zoning, in its simplest form, is to separate commercial and industrial uses from residential uses.

As we move forward with updating the comprehensive plan, I hope we can reach a more sophisticated understanding of the purpose of zoning.  

I like Alan Hart's concept that zoning is just a recipe you use to create the city you desire.  The city I desire is not defined by strict segregation of uses.  In my favorite cities, people live on top of pizza places, or next door to coffee shops, or a few feet from the hardware store.  All of which is much more conducive to "promoting the health, safety, and public welfare" than our current methodology.  

When you no longer isolate people from what they need by miles of uninhabited roadway, you make it easy to live, work, dine, and be entertained...all within walking distance of home.  It also means that some spaces aren't deserted during the day (ie: residential areas vacated during the day), while others are deserted at night (ie: commercial areas that shut down after 5:00).  

Commercial uses aren't the problem.  Commercial zoning that requires excessive parking and auto-access is the problem.  I hope that our next stab at the comprehensive plan will allow us to break away from archaic ideas of auto-isolationism and move towards a healthier, more integrated sense of neighborhood.

Let the conversation begin.

Here is a novel idea... Why not have Tulsa Now hold a series of meetings on the subject..
They did so for the Elections... They have done so for many other events such as the "Land Use Forum"...

IMHO TulsaNow has the clout to bring more people into the circle than a public meeting held by the City..

It would make sense to me that the former as well as the existing President of TulsaNow would be all over this...

In another thread someone boasted about the number of members that are on this Forum... I would think that many would want to have a hand in this process..

[aoxamaxoa]

"Commercial zoning that requires excessive parking and auto-access is the problem."

Not according to the retailer that wants to dominate a development and wants plenty of customers with plenty of cars.....

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by AMP

I like his idea of playing, eating and having entertainment and services where you live. What a concept....

Reminds me of Tulsa evicting Tulsa Fairgrounds Speedway off the Expo.  It relocated at 66th Street North and plowed ground.  Lost the spectators as they could not find it lost in a dark forest up on North Highway 75.  One film clip on the Tulsa Fantastic Films had a shot of the race cars on the Speedway, the commentator said, there was also auto racing at the Fairgounds at one time.    

The noise and dust bothered less people, so many less that it no longer exists.

Wonder how Driller Stadium would of faired located at 66th Street North and plowed ground?

Better to have special event centers located where some people actually live.  

Remember though, Utica Square was considered way out in the country at one time.  The fairgrounds were waaaaaay out in the country.

Here is a pic I found of Utica Square around 1930, taken from a hospital some crazy nuns built way out south in the boonies.

[perspicuity85]

quote:Originally posted by aoxamaxoa

"Commercial zoning that requires excessive parking and auto-access is the problem."

Not according to the retailer that wants to dominate a development and wants plenty of customers with plenty of cars.....

You're right.  The issue should be what type of commercial development in what area.  There's an obvious difference between Wal-Mart Supercenter and Dwelling Spaces in the Blue Dome district.  Shopping malls and big box retail are great to have in suburban areas, where there's plenty of space and little history to preserve.  There needs to be a greater distinction made within the commercial zones.  Surely INCOG can see the difference??  If not , Tulsa needs to hire an private firm to make its comprehensive plan.

[OurTulsa]

INCOG is NOT handling the Comp. Plan update.  Pat Treadway from the City's Urban Development department is leading the effort as a direct appointment by MaKaTay.  INCOG will certainly play a role in the Plan's processing and public review (Planning Commission) but Madam Mayor decided that this is the City's plan and needed to be created by City folks.  It's pretty likely that Pat will be looking for an inspiring and visionary consultant to come to the City and lead the charge in reshaping our outlook on our future.  

There will be many many many opportunities to provide public input and there will be roles for civic groups/forums like TulsaNow, at the very least deceminating information and announcements.  

And yes, Urban is the word along with pedestrian, mixed use, connectivity, transit, diversity, education, density!  I don't have any doubts that we will get the Plan right, at least for some of Tulsa.  My biggest concern, as with all planning efforts is: implementation!  We'll see.

[JoesWife]

Start on the Transit system 1st.
I like this idea too..  My wish is to see Tulsa transform into a busy, bustling metropolitan city. hmmmmmmm...

[AMP]

Tulsa Transit is designed by rider impact.  Majority of the AM passengers is the domestic help that ride from North Tulsa to South Tulsa and back home in the early afternoon.  

Been that way for decades.  Hop on the bus up North some early morning and take the trip.

Transit Bus line here does not go to the Airport or to American Airlines or any of the six major Industrial Parks.  It is not designed to handle that type of business.  They service the largest use group, just as any business does.  

I have flown into dozens of cities and Tulsa is one of the only cities where I have not see multiple city busses ready to take passengers to most popular parts of the city.  People in charge here should be embarrased for allowing the Cab Companies to have exclusive run over the Airport.  

Tulsa Transit and the Cab Compaines also seem to have a silent agreement that neither will tread on each others turf.

Again, where are the Tulsa World Reporters, or the TV News anchors that should be covering these human interest stories and educating people living in Tulsa about our culture and why things are, and the way they work.  

They are all too busy reporting on and making headlines of the Social Ills and Mental cases that seem to escape their bounds and roam the streets and reek havoc among the community.    

Making them seem more important than a Little League team winning the Worlds Series.  Or spending a moment reporting on an accomplished artist from Oklahoma that hits the big time.

[TheArtist]

^ The buses I see at airports are the ones that are owned by and take people to the large hotels and resorts.

What popular parts of the city would a person who is getting off a plane want to go to, that doesn't already have a hotel shuttle bus to take them to that area?  Like downtown for instance.

How many people would hop off an airplane and want to haul all their luggage onto a city bus and then around Brookside, Cherry Street or Philbrook?

[Rico]

I recently attended a meeting in regards to the update of the "Comprehensive Plan for the City of Tulsa"...

Ed Sharrar and Amanda DeCort were the City representatives present....

I came away with some very troubling realizations about the Comprehensive Plan and the Citizens of Tulsa that are being called upon to provide input and feedback...

I am by no means an expert on planning... zoning codes... or what it is going to take to provide ample information to make a Comprehensive Plan that will truly serve Tulsa..

With that out of the way... I understand the meeting, gathering input, at the Zarrow Library was attended by 25 people.......

There have been two meetings for public input on the "Comp Plan".... Council Districts 2 and 5....
I do not have any numbers on the attendance for the second meeting held at Whitney Middle School...  I'm in hopes that it was at least 10 times that of the one at Zarrow Library..  If not.... this could mean the "New Comp Plan " could be put together with input from approximately 450 Citizens.... That's at 50 per meeting..

If this plan is compiled and there is but a marginal amount of input from the public... You will wind up with a marginal plan.... That does little more than deliver the "Comp Plan" to the  City of Tulsa's Steering  Committee that then turn around and deliver it to an outside planning group.... and presto..... behind door number three you have the "GoodOleBoys Comprehensive plan V1.1"....

If you all can live with this then I guess it's the best one can hope for.

More on a recent development that may fit very well into the "Department of Infill Management and Zoning Code Adherence"... Hadn't heard of this... Well someone said it may be the replacement version of TMAPC and INCOG's appeals being heard by the City Counselors... or Courts....."[}:)]

[Double A]

That is disturbing news, Rico. Great, just what we need another appointed unaccountable department.

[Double A]

PLANitULSA: The City of Tulsa Comprehensive Plan Update

Public Meeting Schedule


Nine public meetings have been scheduled to receive citizens' comments concerning planning Tulsa's future. Meeting locations have been chosen in each City Council district; however all Tulsans are invited to attend whichever meeting is most convenient for them.

All meetings will begin at 6 p.m. Dates and locations are as follows:

May 7 – Zarrow Regional Library, 2224 W. 51st St.: North Meeting Room. (District 2)
May 8 – Whitney Middle School auditorium, 2177 S. 67th East Ave. (District 5)
May 14 – University of Tulsa Allen Chapman Activity Center Great Hall, Fifth Place and Florence Avenue. (District 4)
May 15 – Wright Elementary School auditorium, 1110 E. 45th Place. (District 9)
May 21 – Memorial High School auditorium, 5840 S. Hudson Ave. (District 7)
May 22 – Hardesty Regional Library Redbud Auditorium, 8316 E. 93rd St. (District
May 23 – Tulsa Community College Northeast Campus, 3727 E. Apache St. (District 3)
May 29 – Martin Regional Library auditorium, 2601 S. Garnett Road. (District 6)
June 4 – Rudisill Regional Library Ancestral Hall, 1520 N. Hartford Ave. (District 1)

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by Double A

That is disturbing news, Rico. Great, just what we need another appointed unaccountable department.

Geeez.....! Double A... I made the part about the unaccountable Department up out of thin air...

But, I guess it just goes to show that, if we do not place some time and effort on this "Comp Plan"....
We could be stuck in deeper sh#t as far as building a decent Tulsa Community than we already are..
[}:)]



For anyone out there that would like to add their two cents... but just do not have the time to attend one of these meetings...

Go to http://www.planittulsa.org

There is a nifty form "What do You Think? Survey" you can fill out and register what you would like to see happen.....

[TheArtist]

I think Tulsa Now should think about what is needed, do some research, have informed discussions on the issues at hand, then come up with what we think are the priorities and educate people as to what we have found.

The Comprehensive Plan Survey has these 3  questions.

1.   This survey seeks to determine what do you think is most important for Tulsa to achieve over the next 10 to 20 years (regarding where you live, work, shop, learn, visit and play). Please list three that you think are most important, in order of priority.


2.   What do you think are Tulsa's most valuable or important assets or opportunities? Please list three that you think are most important, in order of priority.


3.   In the same manner as above, what do you think are the most critical issues, problems, or concerns confronting Tulsa? Please list three that you think are most important, in order of priority.

Seems to me you will most likely end up with a few vague generalities.

For instance, the top 3 priorities will obviously be things like, education, streets, crime, economic development, etc.  Hardly a suprise to anyone and hardly something we need to take a survey to determine.  Its the specifics on how to work on those priorities that will be important.

What would be interesting to me to find out is what the top 10 or 15 priorities would be.  THERE is where I think you would find some more specific and useful comments.  Same with the other two questions as well.