CALL CITY COUNCILORS NOW!!!!!!!

[Double A]

It passed. I guess Maria, Jack and Roscoe decided not to run for re-election. I hope the Mayor is stupid enough to veto this so her political career will end as a one term Mayor.

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

Ok, I am still a bit confused on all of this. I would have thought that if anyone was stopped or arrested by police that the police would check for an ID. Especially if it was any of the examples given, driving drunk, hit and run, etc.  One has to be driving a car to do those so shouldnt one also have a drivers license?

I accidently left for work the other day without my wallet and license and was afraid of what would happen if I got caught driving without it.  Wouldn't I get in trouble for that? So wouldn't someone who didn't have a license at all be in even more trouble?  I am guessing that illegal aliens aren't able to get licences?

Even if you arent driving and you get arrested by the police don't you have to have some sort of ID? If you don't wouldnt they have to do some sort of search to find out if you were who you said you were?

Basically how could they NOT know your an illegal alien?  How is that possible?

How could the police even issue a ticket without getting some form of ID? They would have to in order for the ticket or fine or arrest to make any sense?  They have to know who you are, don't they?

Someone please explain this to me.

Driving without a license is a city misd.  The officer can either issue a ticket or take the person to jail.  If you have a license but don't have it with you at the time of being stopped.  You can give the officer your information (name, DOB, Social security number, D.L. number)and it can be verified. The officer may also put your fingerprint on the hard copy of the ticket just to verify later in court.  

There is another charge for driving a vehicle and not having your license.

If you are arrested and do not have identification, an officer will take your information and check to see if you are already in the Tulsa Police data base.  If someone has been arrested before, then officers will just check their photo. Officers can also check a person's criminal history which will have their tattoos and fingerprints recorded so officers can compare that way.

Illegal immigrants are very difficult because they may not have any record of their information anywhere.  It is common for an illegal immigrant to have several names and to move to a different city if they are arrested. Once at the new city, they just make up another name and personal information. Sometimes, we never know their real names.

The only break we have is if they have been sent to jail somewhere and their fingerprints are on file.

Since I have never been arrested before. If the police stop me all I have to do is not show any ID, and lie about who I am, then they won't be able to get me to pay a fine or show up for any court date, etc. because they never knew who it was they stopped?

I can't imagine that the police could let someone go if that person had no proof of who they were and the police had no idea who that person was.

How would they record the crime? Whats your name sir?... Umm Joe Blow... Where do you live?... Under the 21st bridge... Any family members, contact information?.... Nope.  Ok, here is your ticket be sure to pay it, or, Your court date is on such and such a day, be sure to be there....   Riiiiiiiiight, like thats gonna happen. The police couldn't enforce anything if they didn't know who the person was. And they shouldn't let them go until they find out. Especially if they were stopped because of a crime.

We call it the "name game".  We play it all the time. It goes like this...

"I don't have any ID".....Okay, what is your name? (There are many indicators that officers look for to see if a person is lying.  I'm not going to tell you what they are but this is where it starts.)

"John Brown".......Okay, what is your Date of Birth

"03/15/1968".......Okay, what is your Social Security number?

447940987........Okay, have you ever been a victim of a crime in Tulsa? If they answer yes, then they are in the Tulsa Police database. If their info is not, they are lying. If you think they may be lying, you can always re-ask their Date of Birth and Social Security number. (Unless they have memorized someone else's info, they usually won't remember what they have told you and then tell you something different.)

Okay, have you ever been arrested in Tulsa?If they answer yes then they should be in the Tulsa Police data base.  If their info is not, they are lying.

If they answer no then you ask, Have ever had an Driver's license in Oklahoma? If they say yes, then there should be a record. If they answer no, then you ask, Have ever had a D.L. or a state issued identification card anywhere? If they have then there should be a record. If their isn't they are lying.  

You then keep going and going until you put them in a box with their answers until they finally tell you who they are or get enough info to determine who they are.

If someone is here legally or is a citizen here, it is very difficult for them to keep us in the dark about who they are.  If they are illegally here than it is alot easier.  What are we going to check on them?  We aren't going to take them down to jail to fingerprint them and run an FBI criminal history check over a misd. offense.  We will simply issue the citation, take a fingerprint of index finger and maybe a digital photo of them.

[Wilbur]

quote: I accidently left for work the other day without my wallet and license and was afraid of what would happen if I got caught driving without it.

As I have asked before, you are out-and-about and don't have any identification.  You encounter the police.  How do you prove your citizenship?  Should you be booked into the jail as an illegal immigrant?  That is ultimately what people are asking for (although, that may not be their intentions).

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote: I accidently left for work the other day without my wallet and license and was afraid of what would happen if I got caught driving without it.

As I have asked before, you are out-and-about and don't have any identification.  You encounter the police.  How do you prove your citizenship?  Should you be booked into the jail as an illegal immigrant?  That is ultimately what people are asking for (although, that may not be their intentions).

My concern wasn't so much about the illegal immigrant issue as it was about having people walking around without any ID and the police unable to enforce anything. The person could be someone from another state who has committed a crime, burglary, child molester, someone who hasn't paid federal taxes, a terrorist, etc.  And even if they hadn't committed a known crime but were stopped for doing something illegal then how would the police be able to enforce the fine or whatever?

Thanks for the reply MH2010 Sounds like all one would have to do is memorize another persons info, preferably someone who doesn't live in the state and who looks like you.  If you were a criminal that would seem the obvious thing to do before you went out and did anything anyway. As for the, able to catch someone lying thing... I am sure there is stuff on the net to tell anyone that.  A first year psych student knows stuff like... Short descriptions or stories are more likely truthful than longer ones. A person who is lying about something will tend to embellish that part of a story, "creating more believable info" thinking they are making it sound more truthful.  A truthful person has nothing to worry or think about so their responses are consistently shorter and similar in "detail". (course that only works in certain circumstances and is only one indicator). Plus a good poker player knows the visual cues lol.

And yes, IMO if someone doesn't have any way to prove who they are and they have committed any crime then you should lock them up until they prove who they are. You can't just have unidentified people wandering around committing crimes. At the very least they should be finger printed and that put in a database in case there is a "next time".  What is startling to me is that I had always assumed you would be in serious doo doo if you couldn't prove who you were.

[iplaw]

They approved the measure.

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote: I accidently left for work the other day without my wallet and license and was afraid of what would happen if I got caught driving without it.

As I have asked before, you are out-and-about and don't have any identification.  You encounter the police.  How do you prove your citizenship?  Should you be booked into the jail as an illegal immigrant?  That is ultimately what people are asking for (although, that may not be their intentions).

My concern wasn't so much about the illegal immigrant issue as it was about having people walking around without any ID and the police unable to enforce anything. The person could be someone from another state who has committed a crime, burglary, child molester, someone who hasn't paid federal taxes, a terrorist, etc.  And even if they hadn't committed a known crime but were stopped for doing something illegal then how would the police be able to enforce the fine or whatever?

Thanks for the reply MH2010 Sounds like all one would have to do is memorize another persons info, preferably someone who doesn't live in the state and who looks like you.  If you were a criminal that would seem the obvious thing to do before you went out and did anything anyway. As for the, able to catch someone lying thing... I am sure there is stuff on the net to tell anyone that.  A first year psych student knows stuff like... Short descriptions or stories are more likely truthful than longer ones. A person who is lying about something will tend to embellish that part of a story, "creating more believable info" thinking they are making it sound more truthful.  A truthful person has nothing to worry or think about so their responses are consistently shorter and similar in "detail". (course that only works in certain circumstances and is only one indicator). Plus a good poker player knows the visual cues lol.

And yes, IMO if someone doesn't have any way to prove who they are and they have committed any crime then you should lock them up until they prove who they are. You can't just have unidentified people wandering around committing crimes. At the very least they should be finger printed and that put in a database in case there is a "next time".  What is startling to me is that I had always assumed you would be in serious doo doo if you couldn't prove who you were.

Someone using someone else's information is alot more common than most people think.  Identity theft used to get alot of play on the news but it was covered more in terms of financial stuff.  People also will steal someone's birth certificate and then get an offical state ID card of D.L. with that person's information on it.  They will then assume their identity if they get arrested.  Officers won't know any different until they go to court and the person they arrested is not the person in the court room.  

Here is one example off the top of my head...

http://www.oscn.net/applications/ocisweb/GetCaseInformation.asp?submitted=true&viewtype=caseGeneral&casemasterID=1723479&db=Tulsa

[Hometown]

Believe it or not something hasn't been discussed on TulsaNow about this topic.  Many native born Americans do not have birth certificates and are unable to prove their citizenship.

Anyway, you can bet that today in Tulsa there are already crimes going unreported because the word in the Latin community is avoid the police or you will be deported.

[jamesrage]

quote:Originally posted by Hometown

Believe it or not something hasn't been discussed on TulsaNow about this topic.  Many native born Americans do not have birth certificates and are unable to prove their citizenship.

Anyway, you can bet that today in Tulsa there are already crimes going unreported because the word in the Latin community is avoid the police or you will be deported.

Of course it is easy for those in the Hispanic  community to believe that with all the lying scum on the pro-illegal immigrations side.The resolution could have only been for  requiring police officers to check the legal status of those only arrested for capital murder and the pro-illegal scum would still try to spin it as a they hate Hispanics resolution. I watched the city council meeting last night and saw the pro-illegals lying their donkey off and calling it s a hateful resolution and that Hispanics are not going to report crime.

[Hometown]

Mr. Rage, Would you be terribly offended if I called you a parking lot attendant at a downtown parking lot?

[iplaw]

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Puedo hablar Ingles, pero, no me gusta la idioma....

Usted decidia cambiar al espanol porque usted consiguio malos grados en ingles?

No, no me gusta que hay palabras en Espanol que no puedes traducir a Ingles...

Pero, gracias por su commentos...

Este que es lo verdad.... no va a cambiar.. en un idioma... es lo mismo que otro...

Pero que vas a hacer cuando la idioma es Quechua...?

Usted realmente se preocupa de asumir el control de los Incas?


Las palabras importantes son fáciles de traducir.

Hamburguesa de McDonalds por favor....

Donde es mi cheque del bienestar...

Donde es el Home Depot mas cercano...

Esa muchacha tiene un asno agradable...

[mr.jaynes]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Puedo hablar Ingles, pero, no me gusta la idioma....

Usted decidia cambiar al espanol porque usted consiguio malos grados en ingles?

No, no me gusta que hay palabras en Espanol que no puedes traducir a Ingles...

Pero, gracias por su commentos...

Este que es lo verdad.... no va a cambiar.. en un idioma... es lo mismo que otro...

Pero que vas a hacer cuando la idioma es Quechua...?

Usted realmente se preocupa de asumir el control de los Incas?


Las palabras importantes son fáciles de traducir.

Hamburguesa de McDonalds por favor....

Donde es mi cheque del bienestar...

Donde es el Home Depot mas cercano...

Esa muchacha tiene un asno agradable...

And now, in english....?

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Puedo hablar Ingles, pero, no me gusta la idioma....

Usted decidia cambiar al espanol porque usted consiguio malos grados en ingles?

No, no me gusta que hay palabras en Espanol que no puedes traducir a Ingles...

Pero, gracias por su commentos...

Este que es lo verdad.... no va a cambiar.. en un idioma... es lo mismo que otro...

Pero que vas a hacer cuando la idioma es Quechua...?

Usted realmente se preocupa de asumir el control de los Incas?


Las palabras importantes son f�ciles de traducir.

Hamburguesa de McDonalds por favor....

Donde es mi cheque del bienestar...

Donde es el Home Depot mas cercano...

Esa muchacha tiene un asno agradable...

Your English is very good... But I am afraid your Spanish comprehension is stuck somewhere inside translation Software.......

An example: I read where their is a Mexican Style Restaurant opening soon... it may have even been in Tulsa.

It was to be called "Guapos"... Try that one on the waiter and you may get a strange smile.... Regardless of what the software or spanish book say...

Another...?

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by jamesrage

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

I laugh that our congressman is trying to shirk a federal problem off on our local officials.

Who doesn't believe that illegal immigration issues are mostly caused and can be best solved by the federal government?

Who here knows the federal government refuses to do it's job and refuses to fix the problem?So logically the problem can be best solved and fixed at the local and state level.Illegals do not cost the federal government anything they cost the tax payers who live in the states and cities.

quote: I think our councilors should tell our congressman to do his job before he tells them how to do theirs.

Our congressman did not vote for that new amnesty bill that the rat traitors in DC are trying to pass,so he is doing his job.

^
Hey James do ya figure any of the people depicted in this poll would take offense to being called "rat traitors"....?

Or is it you just have to say that every so often to feel good?


New York Times...CBS Poll on Immigration Bill

[mr.jaynes]

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by iplaw

quote:Puedo hablar Ingles, pero, no me gusta la idioma....

Usted decidia cambiar al espanol porque usted consiguio malos grados en ingles?

No, no me gusta que hay palabras en Espanol que no puedes traducir a Ingles...

Pero, gracias por su commentos...

Este que es lo verdad.... no va a cambiar.. en un idioma... es lo mismo que otro...

Pero que vas a hacer cuando la idioma es Quechua...?

Usted realmente se preocupa de asumir el control de los Incas?


Las palabras importantes son f�ciles de traducir.

Hamburguesa de McDonalds por favor....

Donde es mi cheque del bienestar...

Donde es el Home Depot mas cercano...

Esa muchacha tiene un asno agradable...

Your English is very good... But I am afraid your Spanish comprehension is stuck somewhere inside translation Software.......

An example: I read where their is a Mexican Style Restaurant opening soon... it may have even been in Tulsa.

It was to be called "Guapos"... Try that one on the waiter and you may get a strange smile.... Regardless of what the software or spanish book say...

Another...?

A Latina I once knew called me guapo- I was quite flattered once I learned what it meant.

[rwarn17588]

I'm half-convinced that mr. rage's schtick is parody. I mean, who would be that comically hateful?

It sounds like something that would be on Colbert's show. [}:)]

Ditto for Cubs' comments.