BOK Center an Edsel?

[USRufnex]

I don't really think the Tulsa Convention Center arena was a particularly viable option to keep open... OKC's old Myriad arena has had a listed capacity of over 13,000 for hockey... and it just sits there vacant most of the time... Tulsa's convention center is listed as 7,111 capacity that I saw for Ice Oilers' hockey... may be a little bigger for basketball...

But the 8,900 listed capacity included floor seating for concerts, etc...

OKC was the first (and will likely be the only) Big 12 basketball tourney site to have its two venues down the street from each other.

And if you compare the looks of the Ford Center to Tulsa's new arena, well... it's actually the Ford Center that looks more like an Edsel... hope it doesn't cost OKC their shot at a permanent NBA team as tenant.  Tulsa's new arena will not cost nearly as much as Kansas City's Sprint Center; last I checked costs projected to be $276 million...

It's easy to be a critic... my criticism would be based around the fact that just about every city in the country is doing the arena thing... let's call it an oversaturation of the market on a national scale...  but I'd like to wait until that darned iconic thing in Tulsa's open before becoming a critic... otherwise, it just makes me a NAYSAYER!  [:O]

Heck, even Wichita's getting in on the downtown arena business... costs have risen from $184 million listed in 2004 to $201 million the last time I checked... will seat 15,000 for basketball, 17,000 for concerts... and will look something like this...



Iconic enough for ya?

[cannon_fodder]

$45,000,000.00 over budget?  I thought the whole damn thing was supposed to be done BY 2008 and cost $180,000,000. That makes it closer to $245,000,000.00 over budget - considering the $15mil in corporate support are not counted.  Even though we were led to believe that the cost would be defrayed by the corporate donations.

Latest progress report:
http://www.vision2025.info/includes/pages/tulsavisionbuildersmonthlyreport/uploads/023/file.pdf

Now it "is on schedule to be completed by the revised deadline of Sept. 1, 2008."  NO kidding?  I would hope it is on schedule if you just revise the deadline.  Everything is on schedule when you revise deadlines.

More importantly, when did the cost rise additionally?  I knew it went up with the first round of bids, but didnt the mayor make a big frikken deal when other bids came in below estimates?  Did we just raise the estimates and then brag when the bids were below them... that's dumb.  We are facing a nearly 1/3 increase in the cost.  Ouch.

I hope this works out.  I was excited by the plan because I felt Tulsa needed a spark to get its sh!t together... now I'm not so sure a quarter of a billion dollar arena is what we needed.

[TheArtist]

I know we are griping about the arena costing more,,,, Omg who would have thought?! But I still wish we had ponied up and done the original design. That was the iconic design, the one we have now is only "so so".

[TulsaSooner]

Isn't this the original amount the arena was over budget that has been known and resolved for months?

In other words, this is not a new article stating this but rather somebody re-posting this information.....isn't it?

[cannon_fodder]

What was changed with the design? It looks amazingly similar to the original to me... but that might not mean a whole lot I guess.

Seriously, I try to stay informed.  Its amazing how often I find myself in the dark.

[Conan71]

Another $45 mil over.  Now there's a shocker.

This was my favorite design (apologies to whomever posted this on here first, can't remember who it was to give credit):

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by USRufnex

But the 8,900 listed capacity included floor seating for concerts, etc...

Do you think concert seating for the Big 12 women's tourney was a turn-off to the committee? []

[TulsaSooner]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

Another $45 mil over.  Now there's a shocker.

Again....does anyone have a link saying it is ANOTHER $45 million over?  I'd think it would be big news around here.

[cannon_fodder]

Well, at least they stuck with the original feeling.  If someone wants to be my "BFF" they could make an itemized list of what was promised and what was delivered visa vi this arena.

Ie:  $180mi.   - $245mil
As promised it had xxxx - as delivered it will have xxx
Open datex - open date x

[AVERAGE JOE]

quote:Originally posted by TulsaSooner

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

Another $45 mil over.  Now there's a shocker.

Again....does anyone have a link saying it is ANOTHER $45 million over?  I'd think it would be big news around here.

It's not another $45 million over. You are correct, the article references the same $45 million over that we knew about last summer. The total cost is still $180 million.

[TulsaSooner]

Thank you.  []

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by AVERAGE JOE

quote:Originally posted by TulsaSooner

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

Another $45 mil over.  Now there's a shocker.

Again....does anyone have a link saying it is ANOTHER $45 million over?  I'd think it would be big news around here.

It's not another $45 million over. You are correct, the article references the same $45 million over that we knew about last summer. The total cost is still $180 million.

Hey Joe Thank You... That will teach me to believe anything "Rupert" is connected with is News..[B)]

[Conan71]

Must've been a slow news week.  Now they are re-using old news to fill in the gaps and spark outrage.  []

[stymied]

quote:Originally posted by ricecake

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

What was changed with the design? It looks amazingly similar to the original to me... but that might not mean a whole lot I guess.

The exterior design was stripped down and the arena bowl was 'sunk' further into the ground, thereby reducing the exterior height.


Original design




What is being built

The exterior was not stripped down, and they did not drop the bowl. The "original design" you are showing was a schematic model. The design was developed. The costs actually have gone up and the design has been embellished on the exterior and they have added more than they have removed since that schematic model was done. Last year when bids came in over budget, they actually considered reducing the iconic glass wall height, reducing the strength of the glass, the tint, and other exterior changes, but ultimately none were ever made. They managed to save a few $ million by changing some of the electrical, plumbing, and HVAC components inside the building that no patron would ever know about.

And, yes, this news is over a year old. April 21, 2006 to be exact. It is only "new news" now because the money for Oxley was supposed to be coming available right about now with the original Vision 2025 plan. It has only been delayed, not shelved. The revised Arena budget is now $183. That is still a bargain when you look at Witchita's, Kansas City's, etc. The Ford Center will be a dump compared to Tulsa's.

[TURobY]

I'm not going to lie: I think I actually like the schematic model better than the conceptual model. But to each his own.[8D]