Are Campus Police Accountable?

[MH2010]

Tami Marler, spokeswoman for Tulsa Public Schools, said the disturbance began between classes, with four or five girls in a verbal exchange near the school's main entrance. "It's an ongoing neighborhood dispute between two groups of girls. It started out with a verbal altercation and then escalated into a physical altercation," she said.

This could be translated to, "It was a gang fight between two rival sets.  The fight escalated to where TPS security was outnumbered and had to call TPD. During the fight, TPS security peppersprayed the one that decided to fight TPS security."

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

This could be translated to, "It was a gang fight between two rival sets.  The fight escalated to where TPS security was outnumbered and had to call TPD. During the fight, TPS security peppersprayed the one that decided to fight TPS security."

I guess you could come up with any scenario you want if the facts dont get in the way, but since the girl that was injured wasnt the same girl that was arrested your particular scenario wont work.

The sore spot in all this is that the only weapons or injuries in all this stem directly from the actions of the school security, and the TPS mouthpiece failing to take ownership of that fact.

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

This could be translated to, "It was a gang fight between two rival sets.  The fight escalated to where TPS security was outnumbered and had to call TPD. During the fight, TPS security peppersprayed the one that decided to fight TPS security."

I guess you could come up with any scenario you want if the facts dont get in the way, but since the girl that was injured wasnt the same girl that was arrested your particular scenario wont work.

The sore spot in all this is that the only weapons or injuries in all this stem directly from the actions of the school security, and the TPS mouthpiece failing to take ownership of that fact.

I know it was a fight between the 4-duece and the hoover crips.  The female was arrested for assault and battery on a police officer and enciting a riot.

[RecycleMichael]

I have joined a gang of environmentalists. We are called gang green.

[patric]

Rather than have regular police over schools, TPS needs people who will do a better job of keeping things hush-hush.

Even the Tulsa Whirled has commented:  

Tulsa Public Schools has its own police chief now. Why? Superintendent Michael Zolkoski has publicly said he needs his own cops to maintain school order without public scrutiny.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/article.aspx?subjectID=265&articleID=20080419_7_G6_spanc26268

''We have too many fights in school. I would never tell the media this, but we have a lot, a lot of fights. We've got to stop this,'' he said in 2007. Then in an apparent reference to the media, he added that he wants the district to have its own police radio frequency, ''so everybody in town doesn't race over to Edison (Preparatory School) every time a trash can is on fire.''

[patric]

University Of Missouri Police Officer Admits To Child Molestation And Child Pornography While Applying To Rolla Police Department

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by patric

Rather than have regular police over schools, TPS needs people who will do a better job of keeping things hush-hush.

Even the Tulsa Whirled has commented:  

Tulsa Public Schools has its own police chief now. Why? Superintendent Michael Zolkoski has publicly said he needs his own cops to maintain school order without public scrutiny.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/article.aspx?subjectID=265&articleID=20080419_7_G6_spanc26268

''We have too many fights in school. I would never tell the media this, but we have a lot, a lot of fights. We've got to stop this,'' he said in 2007. Then in an apparent reference to the media, he added that he wants the district to have its own police radio frequency, ''so everybody in town doesn't race over to Edison (Preparatory School) every time a trash can is on fire.''

Campus police are not independent investigators of crimes.

They are under the control of the school administration, and as such, can be ordered to sweep crimes under the rug to avoid bad publicity.

Or, if ordered to do so because a parent with clout pressures the school administration.

Public schools may need security guards.  Security guards should not be unilaterally turned into police.

[patric]

My, how the teen makeout scene has changed over the years...



TULSA, Okla. –A Tulsa Public Schools police officer is on paid leave for firing his gun at a car in which teens were messing around.

It happened over the weekend on the campus of Eliot Elementary School near 36th Street and South Peoria.
"Two young people probably doing something that they shouldn't have been doing in the parking lot," TPS official Chris Payne said.

Payne said their officer went to the car and started asking questions, but the driver didn't want to answer.
"[He] tried to get away in the car, and apparently [the officer] shot at the vehicle," Payne told FOX23.

TPS has turned the investigation over to the Tulsa Police Department.
Detectives said there is evidence to show the officer did indeed shoot and hit the car one time in the back left tire.

The 17-year-old boy told investigators he just wanted to leave, and that was the reason he drove off.
The officer said he felt threatened by that move and fired the shot.

Payne emphasized his officer's right to the gun.
http://www.fox23.com/mostpopular/story/Police-investigate-shot-fired-by-Tulsa-Public/qxHtUrUnik2D2lSeYHJSGA.cspx

[Conan71]

My, how the teen makeout scene has changed over the years...



TULSA, Okla. –A Tulsa Public Schools police officer is on paid leave for firing his gun at a car in which teens were messing around.

It happened over the weekend on the campus of Eliot Elementary School near 36th Street and South Peoria.
"Two young people probably doing something that they shouldn't have been doing in the parking lot," TPS official Chris Payne said.

Payne said their officer went to the car and started asking questions, but the driver didn't want to answer.
"[He] tried to get away in the car, and apparently [the officer] shot at the vehicle," Payne told FOX23.

TPS has turned the investigation over to the Tulsa Police Department.
Detectives said there is evidence to show the officer did indeed shoot and hit the car one time in the back left tire.

The 17-year-old boy told investigators he just wanted to leave, and that was the reason he drove off.
The officer said he felt threatened by that move and fired the shot.

Payne emphasized his officer's right to the gun.
http://www.fox23.com/mostpopular/story/Police-investigate-shot-fired-by-Tulsa-Public/qxHtUrUnik2D2lSeYHJSGA.cspx

Sounds like a serious lack of training.

[patric]

Sounds like a serious lack of training.

Training was all the TPS spokesman talked about.  Maybe it's today's attitudes towards force.

[Conan71]

Training was all the TPS spokesman talked about.  Maybe it's today's attitudes towards force.

I don't think so.  I called the cops out on my crazy new neighbor a few weeks ago when I was awakened to hammering either on or near my privacy fence.  A verbal confrontation ensued then she started waving a hammer at me and going off in a spittle (literally spitting at me) tirade.  I backed off, called 911 and they dispatched two cops.  Not long after the first officer arrived, against his orders, she picked up a saw and started waving it at him.  It looked like he was starting to reach for something on his belt as he backed away from her.  He eventually got her calmed down.  Later, we asked about the incident with the saw and he said he was reaching for his taser if needed to subdue her.

We asked what the problem seemed to be, aside from her drinking at 5am, and he said "She's bat crap crazy".  

So, I don't think they are spring-loaded to react with their service pistol.  At least TPD seems to have had good training on how to diffuse angry confrontations without wounding a subject.

As far as the crazy neighbor, she's been keeping to herself ever since.  She was nailing a cross to the tree that straddles our property.  She's a strange one indeed.

As far as the TPS "officer" involved shooting:  A suspect driving away from an officer does not constitute an immediate threat to the officer.  Sounds like he panicked.  If the car were speeding toward him, absolutely within logic to fire and try to stop the driver.  The whole TPD police farce er force is still a little puzzling to me.  They don't actually have officers stationed at every school do they?  I could see that as a deterrent to school massacres, but a roving band of police wannabes is a bit disturbing if they are not well trained as appears in the Eliot situation.

[patric]

As far as the TPD "officer" involved shooting:  A suspect driving away from an officer does not constitute an immediate threat to the officer.  Sounds like he panicked.  If the car were speeding toward him, absolutely within logic to fire and try to stop the driver.  The whole TPD police farce er force is still a little puzzling to me.  They don't actually have officers stationed at every school do they?  I could see that as a deterrent to school massacres, but a roving band of police wannabes is a bit disturbing if they are not well trained as appears in the Eliot situation.

The PIO handouts say TPS secuirity has the same training and authority as "real" cops; the right to have guns and defend themselves etc.  so perhaps a different mindset (they exist for a much different reason).  Maybe the recent backshooting by another security guard is framing my perception, but this seems more a response to an insult.  The "I felt threatened" card is played too often lately.

Also, in its day, Columbine was a model of school security.

[nathanm]

As far as the TPS "officer" involved shooting:  A suspect driving away from an officer does not constitute an immediate threat to the officer.  Sounds like he panicked.  If the car were speeding toward him, absolutely within logic to fire and try to stop the driver.

I'm not sure how shooting a driver in the face stops a car. Seems to me the best course of action in that situation is to get out of the way and then call in the chopper.

In reality, it's now considered OK for an officer to fire at a person fleeing in a vehicle whether it is moving towards the officer or away. You or I would get thrown in prison for shooting someone who didn't present an immediate threat, but we're not cops. Ah, the unintended consequences of redefining the term "deadly weapon" to include things like boots and cars and golf clubs.

[Vashta Nerada]

I'm not sure how shooting a driver in the face stops a car. Seems to me the best course of action in that situation is to get out of the way and then call in the chopper.

In reality, it's now considered OK for an officer to fire at a person fleeing in a vehicle whether it is moving towards the officer or away. You or I would get thrown in prison for shooting someone who didn't present an immediate threat, but we're not cops.

Maybe if the standards for school security guards weren't so atrociously low:
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/video-shows-california-high-school-security-guard-attack-handicapped-student-article-1.1811485

I love how the TPS spokesman makes CLEET certification sound less like a work permit and more like some magical way to weed out the sociopaths.

[Vashta Nerada]

Campus cops are shadowy, militarized and more powerful than ever.

In some cases, these police agencies are "public" enough to be empowered to make arrests, conduct searches and use lethal force but are "private" enough to be exempt from public records laws.  And just like their colleagues in municipal law enforcement, campus police departments have been supplementing their arsenals with hardware designed for war. According to the New York Times, as of last year more than 100 colleges had acquired surplus military equipment including assault rifles, armored vehicles and at least one grenade launcher through the Department of Defense...Some campus PDs even have their own SWAT teams.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2015/07/09/campus-cops-are-shadowy-militarized-and-more-powerful-than-ever/?ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000056