Christian Leader calls OK a Racial Battlefield!

[Hometown]

I have been too busy to follow the news but I understand that Bush has decided to enforce the laws that are on the book.  If this really is the case I think he must be forcing the issue to bring it to a head.  I mean even right wing radicals might take a different stance if they knew they would have to pay $7 for a head of lettuce, if they could find one.

There was a story in last week's World about a local Latin business that had canceled plans to open three grocery stores because of a downturn in business in Tulsa's Latin community.

I hear from one group of friends that people are choosing not to migrate to the U.S.  (There are other job rich destinations.)  

I hear from other friends that there is a labor shortage underway in the agricultural community and that crops in Washington State are rotting in the fields.

I saw some published reports from California growers asking Bush to reconsider enforcement of current laws because of a looming labor shortage.

I wonder how deep this is and how long it would take to go from crops not being harvested to something even more serious?  

[sgrizzle]

Saw this the other day:

[iplaw]

quote:I hear from one group of friends that people are choosing not to migrate to the U.S. (There are other job rich destinations.)

I hear Guatemala is beautiful, especially this time of year...

[iplaw]

quote:Originally posted by Johnboy976

You and I both know that while there is a great need to tighten the borders, eventually racial profiling will become a reality and dilemma for both border patrol and most cities in this country. I am not in support of the latter, so checks need to be put in place immediately, before we start accusing everyone of getting past the border illegally.

What "checks" would you suggest?  To me, even-handed application of the law is the only viable one.

[Conan71]

Let's drop the race card for the time being.  If Michael C wants to keep calling it a racial issue so be it, it's not to me anyhow.

Hometown, there is a hidden undercurrent in Oklahoma that's really hard to judge until November first arrives.  We've heard more and more about hispanic workers throughout our industrial park getting out of the state by November.

The time has long passed for when we should have built "the wall".  There is a need for the labor or else the hispanics would not be here. There are better wages here than back home, so that completes the incentive.

There will have to be a compromise for a path to citizenship or guest workers.  Only the dumbest of rednecks wouldn't get that.  

There should not be an automatic citizenship, but there has got to be a way to accomodate employers and their workers which would prevent causing a major economic cataclysm and will take the impending legal monkey off their backs.  

Only thing I can think of is to make the employers come forward and document ALL of their workers presently on the payroll.  They have provided a large part of the incentive for workers to be here in the first place.  They need cheap, hard-working labor, these people need jobs.

Either come up with a path to citizenship or a registered guest worker program- pronto.

Secondary problem that most of you don't realize is that that companies don't just look the other way when they hire Hispanics.  Most of the workers do supply an immigration and social security card.  It's very easy to get forged social security cards and immigration cards.

There are definitely some problems on the horizon with unknown consequences.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Johnboy976

You and I both know that while there is a great need to tighten the borders, eventually racial profiling will become a reality and dilemma for both border patrol and most cities in this country. I am not in support of the latter, so checks need to be put in place immediately, before we start accusing everyone of getting past the border illegally.

What do you call what the border patrol has been doing for years?

Why is that just now racial profiling?

Because Hispanic activists say it is?

[MichaelC]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

Let's drop the race card for the time being.  If Michael C wants to keep calling it a racial issue so be it, it's not to me anyhow.

It's only a racial issue, if you make it one.  It doesn't have to be, ever.  You say you aren't one of these crazy rednecks that think we're going empty the US of illegals, but you support the same laws they do.  The consequences are yours, whether you like it or not.  So yeah, let's drop it, and get down to business.

Most of what you posted is current federal law.  The path for current illegals in the system, should be through Resident Alien status.  Give them X number of days to register as an RA at whatever locations, after that it's over.  If you're here in an illegal capacity your gone.

RAs can be tracked.  Make it to where they have to reapply for RA status every 4 years, like a drivers license.  If you commit a felony, your gone.  Make it to where after 8 years, you can apply through the regular system for Citizenship under the provision that you keep up RA status.

Shore up enforcement, secure the border, your done.

This the easiest thing to do, it has not been done because no one is demanding this of the Fed, and everyone is turning their rage on the locals and states.  Aiming straight at the gov'ts that can not fix this problem.

quote:There are definitely some problems on the horizon with unknown consequences.

Absolutely.

[guido911]

I am unsure how people on this board will respond to this, but I would give serious consideration to representing an injured, assualted, or murdered U.S. citizen at the hands of an illegal immigrant (like what happended in Newark or Virginia Beach) against any governmental entity or official who overtly supported a "sanctuary" policy towards immigration and that because of such policy the illegal immigrant evaded deportation.

[iplaw]

quote:It's only a racial issue, if you make it one. It doesn't have to be, ever. You say you aren't one of these crazy rednecks that think we're going empty the US of illegals, but you support the same laws they do. The consequences are yours, whether you like it or not. So yeah, let's drop it, and get down to business.

Most of what you posted is current federal law. The path for current illegals in the system, should be through Resident Alien status. Give them X number of days to register as an RA at whatever locations, after that it's over. If you're here in an illegal capacity your gone.

RAs can be tracked. Make it to where they have to reapply for RA status every 4 years, like a drivers license. If you commit a felony, your gone. Make it to where after 8 years, you can apply through the regular system for Citizenship under the provision that you keep up RA status.

Shore up enforcement, secure the border, your done.

You were doing magnificently up until this point:

quote:
This the easiest thing to do, it has not been done because no one is demanding this of the Fed, and everyone is turning their rage on the locals and states. Aiming straight at the gov'ts that can not fix this problem.

The Fed is clearly incapable of dealing with enforcement on their own.  They simply don't have the numbers.  The only way to effectively enforce the laws is to train local PD, just like Tulsa is doing, to assist ICE.  State and Local working hand-in-hand with the Feds is the only workable solution.  

Jurisdiction and legal recourse may still rest squarely with the Feds, but the actual leg-work of enforcement needs to be cooperative.

[MichaelC]

The only way it can be done locally, is through federal mandate.  I think it would be correct to say that local officials would have to be in on it to a degree.  It would have to be a federal requirement placed on locals, because some local gov'ts won't bother.

That being said, if the borders are secured, the problem tends to be self-repairing.  You should, theoretically, constantly have less illegals in the system.

[cannon_fodder]

Michael, you are saying that there is nothing the local can do? Oh great federal government, please solve all our problems.

I really hope the courts rule that such is not the case.  Granted, most local action is a site specific band aid, but enough band aids could stop the bleeding.

[kakie]

Doesn't the charge of racism by a Christian leader of a national organization bother you?  He serve as an advisor to the President of the United States on immigration reform and his organization says it's going to sue our state! In other words, his organization believes it is more powerful that our state laws. Where is the money coming from to wage this war against Oklahoma's right to protect its borders?   This seems so wrong to me and an act that borders on hate itself because of what they are alleging. I think its an insult to every legal Oklahoman.  

I called White House to voice my concern: 202 456-1111

[MichaelC]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

Michael, you are saying that there is nothing the local can do? Oh great federal government, please solve all our problems.

I really hope the courts rule that such is not the case.  Granted, most local action is a site specific band aid, but enough band aids could stop the bleeding.

Certain things, yes.  When you're having to compete with other cities, and some enforce it and some don't, we'll see how that works if you can't fathom an extra federal requirement or two.

Holy carp, it's a fish!  And it goes berserk at the mention of the words "federal mandate."

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by kakie

Doesn't the charge of racism by a Christian leader of a national organization bother you?  

Yep.  It annoys the hell out of me.  It's right out of the Al $harpton, Je$$e Jack$on playbook.

Speaking of mandates, is it the feds or the TCSD who instigated the training of deputies by ICE.  This isn't isolated, it's going on in other places as well:

http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2007/aug/21/collier_sheriffs_deputies_train_identify_illegal_i/

[MichaelC]

You might check into TPD and the Sheriffs dept. and see what they've done on that.  Supposedly, they're going to help out on immigration enforcement.  There's a few coppers on here that might be able to tell you.

Part of the problem of not making it a federal requirement to enforce within limits federal immigration laws, is that some cities and jurisdictions won't do it.  Currently, these so-called "haven" cities aren't enforcing because they don't have to.  That is, currently, a perfectly viable option for pretty much any local or state jurisdiction.