Tulsa's new Police Chief is.... Ron Palmer.

[MH2010]

Most officers are relieved Ron Palmer is coming back. The first rumor this morning was that Drew Diamond was the former chief that was going to be hired. After that scare, everyone realized it could have been alot worse.  

Most officers respect Chief Palmer and are glad to see a familiar face in the top office.  No one is happy about the "at will" aspect of his employment and most officers are curious if this will change how he will manage the police department.

As far as the FOP goes, I don't believe the lawsuits will be dropped regarding the hiring of internal candidates and the new "at will" aspect of the chief's position.  In regards to Chief Palmer, the FOP is probably glad he is back in the chief's spot. I think the FOP won 28 out of 32 grievance arbitrations when he was in office.

The more interesting thing to watch will be the reaction of the BOC (Black Officers Coalition).  They have no love for Chief Palmer.  I wouldn't be surprised if the BOC went to federal court in an effort to get an injunction against the hiring of Chief Palmer. There is a section in the Consent Degree that talks about there will be no changes in the promotion process ect.  

The BOC had chosen to stay out of the chief's fight because they thought the mayor would hire someone they could support. However, now that the mayor has rehired Palmer, I hear they are very angry and getting ready to fight to keep him out.

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

Most officers are relieved Ron Palmer is coming back. The first rumor this morning was that Drew Diamond was the former chief that was going to be hired. After that scare, everyone realized it could have been alot worse.  

Most officers respect Chief Palmer and are glad to see a familiar face in the top office.  No one is happy about the "at will" aspect of his employment and most officers are curious if this will change how he will manage the police department.

As far as the FOP goes, I don't believe the lawsuits will be dropped regarding the hiring of internal candidates and the new "at will" aspect of the chief's position.  In regards to Chief Palmer, the FOP is probably glad he is back in the chief's spot. I think the FOP won 28 out of 32 grievance arbitrations when he was in office.

The more interesting thing to watch will be the reaction of the BOC (Black Officers Coalition).  They have no love for Chief Palmer.  I wouldn't be surprised if the BOC went to federal court in an effort to get an injunction against the hiring of Chief Palmer. There is a section in the Consent Degree that talks about there will be no changes in the promotion process ect.  

The BOC had chosen to stay out of the chief's fight because they thought the mayor would hire someone they could support. However, now that the mayor has rehired Palmer, I hear they are very angry and getting ready to fight to keep him out.

Nice to hear from you MH....

My first question regarding this appointment...?

Is this going to be something that has the appearance of the City "thumbing it's nose" at the BOC lawsuit judgment and ongoing monitoring....?

This could turn into somewhat of a clusterf#*k......

With the ongoing lawsuit and the judgment of the BOC lawsuit.... It may give the appearance that the City of Tulsa...i.e. Kathy Taylor.. Is trying to make new law as they go along...

Your opinion is always welcome MH.... Hope the wife is doing well..!

[MH2010]

I don't know exactly how this will be taken by the courts.  I do know that next month there was supposed to be a meeting in federal court concerning the ending of the consent decree.  It was supposed to time-out next year.  However, now that Palmer is back in, I see the BOC really pushing to get the consent decree extended.  I wouldn't be suprised if Lewis Bullock shows up soon claiming new violations and a hostile work environment for black officers.

Councilors Henderson and Turner will probably jump in with the BOC as well.  Yesterday, I heard that they walked out of the press conference in disgust. The Tulsa World is also reporting that today.  Members of the BOC are irrate and are planning something. I will bet that the Henderson and Turner will meet with the BOC and come up with a game plan on what they will want to do.

This isn't over yet.  I don't think Mayor Taylor realized how this would anger the BOC and other people in the black community.

[sgrizzle]

I just have this wacky idea that maybe Taylor hired someone who would make most of the officers happy, get them to quit fighting amongst themselves, and maybe do something about crime in this town.

I've always had this off the wall idea that I should be spending my time trying to make sure my work is done effectively and not thinking up new lawsuits and grievances. Blocking the hiring of Ron Palmer for what is basically a paperwork/terminology disagreement solely because you don't like him is asinine.

[MH2010]

All of this fighting doesn't effect most officers.  The majority of officers know that their jobs are the same regardless of who sits in the top office.  Most Chiefs don't change policies that much so most jobs in the police department stays the same.

[Wilbur]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

I just have this wacky idea that maybe Taylor hired someone who would make most of the officers happy, get them to quit fighting amongst themselves, and maybe do something about crime in this town.

I've always had this off the wall idea that I should be spending my time trying to make sure my work is done effectively and not thinking up new lawsuits and grievances. Blocking the hiring of Ron Palmer for what is basically a paperwork/terminology disagreement solely because you don't like him is asinine.

What 'fighting amongst themselves' are you talking about?  Give us some examples.  

I'd like to go to work and understand who I'm supposed to be fighting with.  I guess I don't have a players' card.

[RecycleMichael]

I spoke to a Tulsa police office this morning at Quik Trip (I was buying myself a donut and he was getting coffee).

I asked him what he thought of the new chief and he said that he wasn't on the force when Palmer was in charge, but that most of the officers he knew that were around then had great respect for him.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010
I wouldn't be suprised if Lewis Bullock shows up soon claiming new violations and a hostile work environment for black officers.

I'd forgotten Bullock was involved in that suit.  He keeps his sailboat slipped a few spots down from mine.  


(in my best Italian dialect) "Do you want I should leave a special stinky present left for him on his boat?"

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by Wilbur

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

I just have this wacky idea that maybe Taylor hired someone who would make most of the officers happy, get them to quit fighting amongst themselves, and maybe do something about crime in this town.

I've always had this off the wall idea that I should be spending my time trying to make sure my work is done effectively and not thinking up new lawsuits and grievances. Blocking the hiring of Ron Palmer for what is basically a paperwork/terminology disagreement solely because you don't like him is asinine.

What 'fighting amongst themselves' are you talking about?  Give us some examples.  

I'd like to go to work and understand who I'm supposed to be fighting with.  I guess I don't have a players' card.

Then you're one of the good guys.

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

All of this fighting doesn't effect most officers.  The majority of officers know that their jobs are the same regardless of who sits in the top office.  Most Chiefs don't change policies that much so most jobs in the police department stays the same.

Yes, but it ties up some officers. Just wish everyone in public service would concentrate on.. well.. serving the public. To me they're just saying "I know the crime rates are up but I need to keep the Mayor from possibly being able to fire the Chief at will, I'll get to that whole 'keeping people from getting shot' thing later."

[Hometown]

In my estimation the mayor had one thing that Tulsa really needed her to do and she has failed.

I'm a life-long Democrat and Taylor is a disappointment.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by Hometown

In my estimation the mayor had one thing that Tulsa really needed her to do and she has failed.

I'm a life-long Democrat and Taylor is a disappointment.

HT- what one thing did we need her to do in your estimation?

You really shouldn't be surprised about Taylor.  She's a political chameleon.  Wealthy Republican type (even donated to "W"'s campaign to "have a seat at the table") with liberal social leanings and somewhat of a penchant for tax & spend.

[Double A]

quote:Originally posted by Hometown

In my estimation the mayor had one thing that Tulsa really needed her to do and she has failed.

I'm a life-long Democrat and Taylor is a disappointment.

                                              Would you support a recall? If violating our charter(The equivalent being unconstitutional at the local level) is not grounds for a recall, what is? BTW, did you have to go to rehab to get the Kool-Aid out of your system or did you kick the habit all on your own?

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I don't know exactly how this will be taken by the courts.  I do know that next month there was supposed to be a meeting in federal court concerning the ending of the consent decree.  It was supposed to time-out next year.  However, now that Palmer is back in, I see the BOC really pushing to get the consent decree extended.  I wouldn't be suprised if Lewis Bullock shows up soon claiming new violations and a hostile work environment for black officers.

Councilors Henderson and Turner will probably jump in with the BOC as well.  Yesterday, I heard that they walked out of the press conference in disgust. The Tulsa World is also reporting that today.  Members of the BOC are irrate and are planning something. I will bet that the Henderson and Turner will meet with the BOC and come up with a game plan on what they will want to do.

This isn't over yet.  I don't think Mayor Taylor realized how this would anger the BOC and other people in the black community.

Suppose that is one reason for the Council meeting not being on TGOV this evening?

I don't know the particulars of the BOC case or what the ruling will be on the "Charter' issue.

That being said; did we really need to conduct a Nationwide search to find Palmer?  Was that because of his tour in Afghanistan? [}:)]

Back to being serious as I feel this is a very serious issue. It won't be going away.

IMHO the Charter issue will side with the Officers. If that winds up as the case does this remove Palmer as the Chief of Police?
If so maybe he will be an appointed "Public Safety Adviser".
The Chief position would then be given to one of the remaining Police officers.?

With Palmer's reported salary and the cost of an additional "Top Cop" that will be something of a hard sell with the "River Tax" so close at hand.


Every so often... another City will have a similar amount of Political intrigue...but not very often.

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

I don't know exactly how this will be taken by the courts.  I do know that next month there was supposed to be a meeting in federal court concerning the ending of the consent decree.  It was supposed to time-out next year.  However, now that Palmer is back in, I see the BOC really pushing to get the consent decree extended.  I wouldn't be suprised if Lewis Bullock shows up soon claiming new violations and a hostile work environment for black officers.

Councilors Henderson and Turner will probably jump in with the BOC as well.  Yesterday, I heard that they walked out of the press conference in disgust. The Tulsa World is also reporting that today.  Members of the BOC are irrate and are planning something. I will bet that the Henderson and Turner will meet with the BOC and come up with a game plan on what they will want to do.

This isn't over yet.  I don't think Mayor Taylor realized how this would anger the BOC and other people in the black community.

Suppose that is one reason for the Council meeting not being on TGOV this evening?

I don't know the particulars of the BOC case or what the ruling will be on the "Charter' issue.

That being said; did we really need to conduct a Nationwide search to find Palmer?  Was that because of his tour in Afghanistan? [}:)]

Back to being serious as I feel this is a very serious issue. It won't be going away.

IMHO the Charter issue will side with the Officers. If that winds up as the case does this remove Palmer as the Chief of Police?
If so maybe he will be an appointed "Public Safety Adviser".
The Chief position would then be given to one of the remaining Police officers.?

With Palmer's reported salary and the cost of an additional "Top Cop" that will be something of a hard sell with the "River Tax" so close at hand.


Every so often... another City will have a similar amount of Political intrigue...but not very often.

I've heard from a few sources that the mayor could not find anyone qualified (during her national search) to commit to taking the job for two reasons.  The first reason was because of the lawsuit and the uncertainty of the outcome. The second reason was because she wanted the Chief to be "at-will" and exempt from civil service protection. Prospective candidates did not want to get to Tulsa and start the job then the mayor not run for a second term (because she decides to run for a state or national office) then they would not have any job security.

Palmer took the Chief position because he quite simply needed a job. It was general knowledge that his consulting business was not going well. That was why he went to Afghanistan ( he didn't like it so he came back.) He was looking for a job when this opportunity came up.  The mayor knew all of this and knew that he would not turn down the offer like Deputy Chief Wells did because he really needed the job, especially one that pays $165,000 a year.

As far as the lawsuit regarding the charter goes, I think that if the FOP wins, she will just hire one of the remaining candidates and then change Palmer's title to Police commissioner, Public safety director ect.  Palmer will then be over the Police chief.  The only question is how the city will pay for a police chief and then the additional position.

Lastly, I found it interesting that the mayor was quoted in the Tulsa World saying, "the increase is warranted, given Palmer's experience and what is offered to chiefs in comparable cities." Now, I am wondering if she feels the same way about the rank and file officers?  Will she now advocate pay raises to get the rest of the officers up to the same level as comparable cities? Further, does she feel that other city employees deserve to be paid a comparable wage to other cities our size?