Monstrosity on 25th street

[Mvp53]

There's a little truth in the posts from Conan, Red Arrow and Angie.  I'm originally from the East Coast, born and raised in New Jersey.  I've lived in south Tulsa since 1976, where I've raised a family.  We've also spent a few years living downtown in a very nice renovated loft.  The mid-town area has always intriqued us.  With its mix of architecture and price-points (most are pleasant to look at), the area is so unlike the huge, cookie-cutter McMansons that take up most of south Tulsa.  To me, mid-town and downtown reflect more of what I like about Tulsa; individual, artisitc and diverse. 

Yes, I am very interested in the property and may even put in an offer myself!     At 568k its overpriced, but someone will buy the home for its style and quality workmaship.   This renovation has charcter AND curb appeal.  Hats off to the architects and builders.  Hopefully the buyer will get the builder to come off his price a little.  Like the old saying goes, "You get what you pay for".  I think this house is worth a little more.  And this house on either coast would bring double this price, or more. 

[Conan71]

I loved the house and the style is up my alley.  I love modern and mid-century modern. They absolutely thought of every modern amenity and it's high-end construction.

If money were no object and I felt someone else down the line would be willing to pay as much or more than I did for the house, it would be a cool place to live.  Unfortunately, money is an object and it's a property that will always have a long market time. 

[Red Arrow]

There's a little truth in the posts from Conan, Red Arrow and Angie.  I'm originally from the East Coast, born and raised in New Jersey.  I've lived in south Tulsa since 1976, where I've raised a family.  We've also spent a few years living downtown in a very nice renovated loft.  The mid-town area has always intriqued us.  With its mix of architecture and price-points (most are pleasant to look at), the area is so unlike the huge, cookie-cutter McMansons that take up most of south Tulsa.  To me, mid-town and downtown reflect more of what I like about Tulsa; individual, artisitc and diverse. 

Yes, I am very interested in the property and may even put in an offer myself!     At 568k its overpriced, but someone will buy the home for its style and quality workmaship.   This renovation has charcter AND curb appeal.  Hats off to the architects and builders.  Hopefully the buyer will get the builder to come off his price a little.  Like the old saying goes, "You get what you pay for".  I think this house is worth a little more.  And this house on either coast would bring double this price, or more. 

Another transplant.  I grew up in suburban Phila, PA. 

I don't particularly care for the mix of flat top roof with the original peaked roof and the appearance of "vinyl siding" added on to the original brick.  I don't really care painted brick either.  Too much maintenance.  Why have brick if you are going to paint it.  I do like that the walkway to the front door now goes all the way to the street rather than just the light in the middle of the front yard.

I know I am in a minority here but I have no sympathy for someone who pays too much or puts too much into a renovation for a house and then loses their butt when selling.  Driving the price of housing up serves no one.  If you sell a house for way more than you paid, the next house you buy will cost way more that it is worth too.  What have you really gained unless you severely downsize in the future?  If "you" really want to pay too much for something, I have a 98 Buick I will gladly sell for $200,000.  You mentioned that "You get what you pay for".   I prefer to say you pay for what you get as you don't always get what you pay for.

Anyway, as I said before, welcome aboard.

[Nik]

I've just started a long-term selection process for a prospective move down into mid-town Tulsa in the Summer of 2015.  I going to look long and hard at various areas and get a feel for where they are going before I worry about a specific house.  I've already got several different saved searches in Realtor.com, Trulia.etc., and this scenario is relatively common all over midtown.  A house that sold for $200K in 2012 and was renovated is now on sale for $450K or so, etc.  The mid-century ranch type homes, which just about everybody is saying is going to be the next big boom, are especially feeling this effect.

If you expand the search parameters a bit around this house, you can find similarly priced (but not per-sqft-priced) homes.  The renovator is betting on getting ahead of the trend.   I think he probably over shot on this one, but I agree it's a cool house.

I'm kinda in the same boat. I'm looking to move out of Sand Springs in 2015 (after the wife takes the rest of the year off to stay home with the kiddo). However, like a lot of people, I am very price-conscious and I'm struggling with the decision on a smaller midtown home or a larger home a little further south. Since schools are significantly driving my decision, I'm pretty much restricting our search to either Edison school district or the Tulsa part of Jenks schools. I grew up in midtown, but my wife and I really favor the larger square foot homes further south, but we may not get the larger lot of beautiful trees of midtown. We'll see when the time comes.

[AquaMan]

Take this for what its worth from a former real estate agent and happy homeowner.

Go with what you like. If you try to predict or restrict yourself to what kinds of houses are going to show the greatest gain in value, you'll be disappointed. When I bought my home, it was because I loved the style, craftsmanship, location and relatively untouched (unbotched) condition it offered. I was told by the most seasoned realtor at my office that this area (Maple Ridge before it had protection) had peaked in its growth and I should look farther south. I ignored her. This house has increased in value 6 times its original cost in about 3 decades. And, I got to live in the house I wanted.

Schools rise and fall as well. We figured we may have to put our kids in private school but turns out Lee became a sought after grade school due to an influx of young, educated, employed couples just like us. Then we had our choice of Carver, Edison and Washington, all high output schools. Had the highest scores for years. I would predict that Hoover, Edison and other nearby schools are now about to benefit from the ranch style, mid century trend.

Just go with your gut. You'll find many others who share your tastes. And don't worry too much about overspending on your property. Way over criticized. If the bank and the appraiser aren't offended, ignore the rest. The best and worst homes in a neighborhood are the slowest sellers, but alternatively, the most expensive often offer the best amenities, and the worst offer the most opportunity for increased value.

[heironymouspasparagus]

I know I am in a minority here but I have no sympathy for someone who pays too much or puts too much into a renovation for a house and then loses their butt when selling.  Driving the price of housing up serves no one.  If you sell a house for way more than you paid, the next house you buy will cost way more that it is worth too.  What have you really gained unless you severely downsize in the future?  If "you" really want to pay too much for something, I have a 98 Buick I will gladly sell for $200,000.  You mentioned that "You get what you pay for".   I prefer to say you pay for what you get as you don't always get what you pay for.

There is a very well thought out plan to selling houses for more than they are "worth".... keeps undesirables out.  Used to be a process of 'steering' - now you can put amenities in a house that run up the price for no good reason.  (Granite counters are worth an extra $50k??  Hardly.)  Build in the exclusionary elitism, add a gate at the entrance, and voila, instant filtering of who buys there.  

Pricing by the foot seems to be the scenario.  For any room - perhaps a family room - that is 15 x 20 feet (300 sq ft).  At $75 a foot, that's a $22.5k room.  If it is made 30 x 30, now it is "worth" $67.5k.  For an extra ton of gravel, 5 yards of concrete (about $600), few dozen extra 2 x 4s, a little insulation, some sheet rock, trim, paint,  and 600 extra sq ft of carpet at less than $5 a foot ($3,000).  Not a bad markup - extra $45k for an extra maybe $6k worth of extra cost...

Quantity (volume) over quality.

[Gaspar]

There is a very well thought out plan to selling houses for more than they are "worth".... keeps undesirables out.  Used to be a process of 'steering' - now you can put amenities in a house that run up the price for no good reason.  (Granite counters are worth an extra $50k??  Hardly.)  Build in the exclusionary elitism, add a gate at the entrance, and voila, instant filtering of who buys there.  

Pricing by the foot seems to be the scenario.  For any room - perhaps a family room - that is 15 x 20 feet (300 sq ft).  At $75 a foot, that's a $22.5k room.  If it is made 30 x 30, now it is "worth" $67.5k.  For an extra ton of gravel, 5 yards of concrete (about $600), few dozen extra 2 x 4s, a little insulation, some sheet rock, trim, paint,  and 600 extra sq ft of carpet at less than $5 a foot ($3,000).  Not a bad markup - extra $45k for an extra maybe $6k worth of extra cost...

Quantity (volume) over quality.

Who are the undesirables this conspiracy is aimed at? 

[rebound]

There is a very well thought out plan to selling houses for more than they are "worth".... keeps undesirables out.  Used to be a process of 'steering' - now you can put amenities in a house that run up the price for no good reason.  (Granite counters are worth an extra $50k??  Hardly.)  Build in the exclusionary elitism, add a gate at the entrance, and voila, instant filtering of who buys there.  

Pricing by the foot seems to be the scenario.  For any room - perhaps a family room - that is 15 x 20 feet (300 sq ft).  At $75 a foot, that's a $22.5k room.  If it is made 30 x 30, now it is "worth" $67.5k.  For an extra ton of gravel, 5 yards of concrete (about $600), few dozen extra 2 x 4s, a little insulation, some sheet rock, trim, paint,  and 600 extra sq ft of carpet at less than $5 a foot ($3,000).  Not a bad markup - extra $45k for an extra maybe $6k worth of extra cost...

Quantity (volume) over quality.

I can't tell if you are serious, or just trolling.    The point about steering is legit.  It has happened in the past and I am sure still does.  But that practice has nothing directly to do with whether somebody can (or wants to) afford a house of a specific price point in a specific area.

In almost every industry, it is the incremental/additional services and product flourishes that drive real profit.  In restaurants, it's liquor and dessert. In software (my industry) it's "bundling" together several discrete products to provide a larger solution, and in housing it's things like granite counter tops, stainless appliances, etc.  There is much more profit in the add-ons than the base product, and so it is natural for a vendor to want to maximize their offering as much as possible within the confines of what the market will bear.  This is not some conspiracy.

However, regarding your quantity/quality point, I agree.  American's historically favor "big" over "better", but that's changing.  A great resource/book on home design is "Building the Not So Big House" (http://www.notsobighouse.com/).  Smaller can be better.

[AquaMan]

No different than buying a car as well. If its a new home, the granite and larger rooms add value. You can even pick and choose if you commit early enough. On a rebuild, not so much because the new buyer's tastes may not coincide with the present owner. The cost to bump up space or update kitchens is rarely recovered. That is why you receive less than cost for your improvements on remodels. The idea is to make the home more salable or a faster sell (we don't like the carpet and lighting but its livable and we can replace them later to get into this neighborhood.)

New builders do use these amenities and oversized homes to steer more affluent and more sophisticated buyers into certain developments. So? Their credo is to keep the homes as homogeneous in style and cost as possible so as to not scare away those who worry predominately about resale. Don't have to worry about those pesky "hangers on"  buying the smaller homes and investors buying duplexes that the old developers used as "dessert".

Frankly, these suburban developments that do that are boring. The only differences in the homes are often the color of the roof. What they are selling is way different than what you look for in midtown areas.

[RecycleMichael]

I used to live in midtown, but sold at the right time and was able to get a big house on a really big lot in east Tulsa for the same price. I am still amazed that the bargains found on the west side of Mingo Creek between 11th and 21st. I would still be living there if I could have taken care of the acreage.

Two years ago we bought a big house on a small lot in Sungate just east of 56th and Sheridan. We really love it and got it for less than $40 a foot. There are sidewalks on both sides of the street, buried power lines, and nice trees. I will probably never move again.

There are some nice house for sale in the neighborhood for really low prices. I am thinking about buying the place next door that is 1,920 square feet for $80,000.
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6843-E-56th-St-Tulsa-OK-74145/22173986_zpid/

[AquaMan]

I used to live in midtown, but sold at the right time and was able to get a big house on a really big lot in east Tulsa for the same price. I am still amazed that the bargains found on the west side of Mingo Creek between 11th and 21st. I would still be living there if I could have taken care of the acreage.

Two years ago we bought a big house on a small lot in Sungate just east of 56th and Sheridan. We really love it and got it for less than $40 a foot. There are sidewalks on both sides of the street, buried power lines, and nice trees. I will probably never move again.

There are some nice house for sale in the neighborhood for really low prices. I am thinking about buying the place next door that is 1,920 square feet for $80,000.
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6843-E-56th-St-Tulsa-OK-74145/22173986_zpid/

A footnote about those homes in Sungate, Michael. Many of my co-workers bought new homes there in the early to mid 70's when Cities Service Oil built their new building downtown and moved a lot of mid level executive employees here from out of state. Sheridan was a gravel road that was clogged with traffic from downtown. They were all ecstatic about being able to move from more expensive locales back east into brand new developments. That was the edge of town. Mostly modern designs iirc.

Golden days of growth for Tulsa.

[RecycleMichael]

I love the neighborhood pool. We pay dues so my family can swim there and I am spending one tenth of what it costs me to maintain my own pool at my last house.

The neighborhood association makes quite a bit of revenue charging outsiders to swim there so our annual dues are low and there are plenty of activities. We have a good listserve to communicate and work together to watch out for each other.

[Conan71]

I love the neighborhood pool. We pay dues so my family can swim there and I am spending one tenth of what it costs me to maintain my own pool at my last house.

The neighborhood association makes quite a bit of revenue charging outsiders to swim there so our annual dues are low and there are plenty of activities. We have a good listserve to communicate and work together to watch out for each other.

I agree, great neighborhood and undervalued, IMO.  We lived on 74th E. ave near Salk & Byrd for about six years.

[Cats Cats Cats]

Here is a real "keep the undesireables out" move.  
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1726-E-151st-St-S-Bixby-OK-74008/2108760717_zpid/
Sorry but 151st in Bixby isn't worth $35k an acre.  But there is a gate!!

There are houses a few miles south and east, with a house, for about $20k an acre (if you don't count the house)
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/13845-S-19th-St-Bixby-OK-74008/2110925332_zpid/

[RecycleMichael]

This house near 72nd and Harvard sold for $3 million in January of 2013 and is now listed for $5 million.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/7219-S-Evanston-Ave-Tulsa-OK-74136/22224733_zpid/

Methinks the price is a little unrealistic. I mean, I would give them $3.1 million, just for the gold sinks alone.