Rep. Kern's Statements

[Cirage]

quote: originally posted by tulsa1603 THey're taking over Brady Heights as we speak!!

Oh Lord! Why didn't someone tell me!?
If anyone actually cares about Rep. Kerns' statements anymore, pick up a utw for her interview as well as community reaction.
I guess it's nice to see that people are finally taking advantage of the comment section.... although the commenters seem a little Worldy to me.

[Ed W]

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

I've discovered the Gay Agenda -- it's to improve the housing market single handedly!!!

Actually, they're out to take over our country.  Then they'll redecorate and we'll all have to dress nicer.

Seriously, many businesses actively solicit gay customers because their demographic has more disposable income.  That's not an endorsement of the lifestyle.  It's simply business sense.

[patric]

Forget "Big Oil" or "Big Business"
The crazy lady from OKC is rolling out "Big God"!


Kern says she'll accept help from Christian law firm
Associated Press - March 20, 2008 9:35 AM ET

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) - An Oklahoma state representative who has been criticized for saying homosexuality poses a bigger threat to the U.S. than terrorism says she'll accept help from a Christian law firm.

Rep. Sally Kern says she accepted the offer from the Thomas More Law Center in Ann Arbor, Mich. The nonprofit public interest firm would represent the Oklahoma City Republican should legal action be filed against her because of her comments.

A spokesman for the firm says it would not charge Kern to represent her and that her local attorney would be Bill Kumpe of Tulsa.

The remarks by Kern gained nationwide attention after they were recorded and posted on the video sharing Web site YouTube by the Washington, D.C.-based Gay & Lesbian Victory Fund earlier this month.

[we vs us]

quote:Originally posted by Ed W

quote:Originally posted by NellieBly

I've discovered the Gay Agenda -- it's to improve the housing market single handedly!!!

Actually, they're out to take over our country.  Then they'll redecorate and we'll all have to dress nicer.

Seriously, many businesses actively solicit gay customers because their demographic has more disposable income.  That's not an endorsement of the lifestyle.  It's simply business sense.

And this is the best indicator that a group is becoming/has become mainstream.  When segments of the business community begin to formally market to them, they're in, no matter what the God Squad might say.

Just the fact that the Bravo network exists and is popular is a testament to the fact that Teh Gheys are just like the rest of us schlubs.

[rwarn17588]

<start clip>

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) - An Oklahoma state representative who has been criticized for saying homosexuality poses a bigger threat to the U.S. than terrorism says she'll accept help from a Christian law firm.

Rep. Sally Kern says she accepted the offer from the Thomas More Law Center in Ann Arbor, Mich. The nonprofit public interest firm would represent the Oklahoma City Republican should legal action be filed against her because of her comments.

<end clip>

Legal action? You mean there might be consequences for recklessly saying that homosexuality is worse than radical Islam?

Other than exposing how stupid you really are? [}:)]

[MDepr2007]

quote:Originally posted by rwarn17588

<start clip>

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) - An Oklahoma state representative who has been criticized for saying homosexuality poses a bigger threat to the U.S. than terrorism says she'll accept help from a Christian law firm.

Rep. Sally Kern says she accepted the offer from the Thomas More Law Center in Ann Arbor, Mich. The nonprofit public interest firm would represent the Oklahoma City Republican should legal action be filed against her because of her comments.

<end clip>

Legal action? You mean there might be consequences for recklessly saying that homosexuality is worse than radical Islam?

Other than exposing how stupid you really are? [}:)]

Wow !!!  It's a good thing you're around. You have such great insight about recklessness[:O]

Still got plastic couch covers?

[dsjeffries]

quote:Originally posted by azbadpuppy
The term 'gay' as used to describe homosexuals dates back to the 50's, not the 80's in the U.S., long before the rainbow flag came into being. The flag was first introduced in 1978 in San Francisco as a symbol for gay pride, but has long been displayed in many cultures around the world as a sign of diversity and inclusiveness.

Exactly, and I'd like to add some more about the 50s... With the year 1950 also came the basic idea of homosexuality as we know it today.  Until Henry Hay founded the Mattachine Society in 1950, there was no collective group of gay men and women who considered themselves to be a repressed minority caused by the ways in which their lives are arranged.  When people started arranging their lives not based on the nuclear family and what the parents and local community expected of them but instead how they actually were inside; after WWII was over and children began to leave their parents' homes en masse for the first time, the time that the suburbs began to boom with young families who wanted a fresh start; that is when 'gayness' as we know it today, was formed.  Until this time, people didn't collectively organize their lives around their sexuality.

The Mattachine Society's goals were:
Unify homosexuals isolated from their own kind;
Educate homosexuals and heterosexuals toward an ethical homosexual culture paralleling the cultures of the Negro, Mexican and Jewish peoples;
Lead the more socially conscious homosexual to provide leadership to the whole mass of social deviates;
and assist [our] people who are victimized daily as a result of our oppression.

It appears self-evident that these goals are similar to ANY group which identifies itself as oppressed.  The development of the Mattachine Society led to the creation of several gay groups around the country, and was very gung-ho on championing its causes until the Stonewall riot in 1969.  The entire gay community had been shaken up and began to take on a less controversial role in things and began to fade away.

quote:Here we go with this so called agenda again. Why is it that because there are political action groups, like the Human Rights Campaign, that wish to promote tolerance, understanding and equality for everyone, this is somehow construed as 'evil' or 'wrong'?

That's because the Christian "Peace on Earth and Goodwill Toward Men" actually includes an asterisk* at the end of the line which includes who the peace and goodwill are directed toward [], or more appropriately, who is excluded.

quote:Gay rights groups are certainly not trying to place themselves on the 'forefront of governmental policies'. They are trying to gain equal rights for all Americans, which are supposed to be granted by the constitution.

Does this NOT make sense to anybody?  Is there also an asterisk at the end of this phrase?

quote:We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

(Insert asterisk and stipulations here?)

quote:... — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness... when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

Emphasis on the bold.

quote:Also, the only people I know that refer to anyone's 'lifestyle choice' as you put it, are people that think it is a choice, such as yourself. I personally think referring to anyone's sexual orientation as a 'lifestyle choice' is derogatory and offensive, not to mention completely uninformed.

+1

quote:Let me be the first 'gay' to apologize to you for taking pride in being who I am, and for not being embarrassed anymore.

The one thing I disagree with you on... I for one am not going to apologize, no matter how sarcastically, for being gay, for being me, the way I was made.

Anyone who thinks that homosexuality is a choice should consider the following:

quote:"At support group meetings, young people frequently tell of parents crying, "How could you do this to me?" As if it is the parents who have been victimized.  As if their children would purposely relinquish their claim to mainstream respect and invite a lifetime of stigma, discrimination, and physical danger as a sort of selfish, rebellious frolic." -Straight Parents, Gay Children

Ask yourself who would choose to bring that upon themselves and I bet you'll come up empty-handed.

[Townsend]

wait for it...wait for it...

[Wingnut]

Az,
One final question...

Are you or are you not responsible for your own actions?

This is a simple yes or no question. The answer would be something like....
Yes, I'm responsible for my own actions,
or
No, I'm not responsible for my own actions.

Thanks.

[TURobY]

Let me rephrase the question back to you...

Wing,

Are you or are you not responsible for your own preferences (tastes, colors, whatever...)?

This is a simple yes or no question. The answer would be something like....
Yes, I'm responsible for my own preferences,
or
No, I'm not responsible for my own preferences.

Thanks.


The way it was previously written was to lead to a fallacy of many questions (a loaded question, if you will). Regardless of how Az answered, I could see you twisting it into a strawman argument. If you want a fair and intelligent debate, you have to avoid these logical fallacies.

[Wingnut]

quote:  Let me rephrase the question back to you...

No. Typical evasion argument. Answer the question with a question so you don't have to answer. It wasn't even directed to you.

quote: I could see you twisting it into a strawman argument. If you want a fair and intelligent debate, you have to avoid these logical fallacies.

No twisting, like your doing. All I want is an answer and thats all. No debate or arguing.

[TURobY]

quote:Originally posted by Wingnut


No. Typical evasion argument. Answer the question with a question so you don't have to answer. It wasn't even directed to you.

The question wasn't directed at me, so of course I didn't answer.

quote:
All I want is an answer and thats all. No debate or arguing.

If you don't want a debate or discussion, then this doesn't belong in a forum. It belongs in a private conversation between you two.

[cannon_fodder]

Really Wingnut, if ever there was a false dichotomy or a loaded question.

I choose to drive a Ford.  I choose to type on the internet.  

But the question you want to ask is:  Do you choose to be gay?  Or do you want to know: Are you responsible for acting on your own gayness?

Just ask the question, don't try to set it up.  It's been asked and answered repeatedly in this thread.  If you want to know this posters opinion, just ask - no one is waiting for an AH HA! moment.

Do you choose to be sexual attracted to women?  Either way, is it a choice to act on that drive?

Of course it is, but 99.9% of people chose to act on their sex drives.  So the relevant question reverts to do you chose your sexual orientation.  I don't think I do, but maybe some people are not hard wired and can chose either way...

[we vs us]

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

Really Wingnut, if ever there was a false dichotomy or a loaded question.

I choose to drive a Ford.  I choose to type on the internet.  

But the question you want to ask is:  Do you choose to be gay?  Or do you want to know: Are you responsible for acting on your own gayness?

Just ask the question, don't try to set it up.  It's been asked and answered repeatedly in this thread.  If you want to know this posters opinion, just ask - no one is waiting for an AH HA! moment.

Do you choose to be sexual attracted to women?  Either way, is it a choice to act on that drive?

Of course it is, but 99.9% of people chose to act on their sex drives.  So the relevant question reverts to do you chose your sexual orientation.  I don't think I do, but maybe some people are not hard wired and can chose either way...

Wingnut makes the assumption that gay folk would secretly RATHER have sex with the opposite sex, but have chosen not to.  In other words, there IS no such thing as truly "gay" in Wingnut's world; there're only straight people and "depraved" straight people calling themselves gay.

Did I get that right, Wingnut?

[cannon_fodder]

In not so many words, that is kind of what I was thinking too.  Which is why I put in the "do you choose..." language.  There is room for honest curiosity and opinion on that point.

Since I am not gay and men have no sexual attraction for me I really don't understand homosexuality.  I can't.  So I have to reason it out for myself and/or ask people who are gay - which both lead me to believe it is NOT a choice.

But, like I said, there is at least a reason for him to raise that question.  It is a state of being that he does not understand (not faulting you wingnut, I bet you don't understand women either []).  But just do so bluntly or state your opinion on the matter..  If nothing else this is an open conversation and in that context it could be constructive.

Setting up an "I got ya'" is generally not (though I admit to loving it, especially if goading RM about Hillary).
- - -

Off topic and probably way off base.  BUT, since this thread seems to be a hot bed of gay issues...

Why are so many gay men Hillary fans?  Every gay man I have talked to (I really don't know any lesbians I talk politics with) is a die hard Hillary supporter.  When I ask why, the reasons vary, but if the topic of gay rights comes up they don't deny that Obama will probably take the same lines as Hillary.

Does anyone have any ideas, opinions, or seen any articles on this or is it just in my micro world of gay contacts in which this phenomenon exists?