Mayor Taylor To Give BOK $7 Mil for Great Plains

[RecycleMichael]

I asked my "conspiracy" eight ball for the answer.

The reason there are so many "j"s is because the code word for their black ops is "Plan J"

You've heard of Plan "I" Tulsa. This follows it.

I want to know all about Plans "A" through "H".

[cks511]

quote:
I want to know all about Plans "A" through "H".

Reserved for the river.

[Conan71]

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

I asked my "conspiracy" eight ball for the answer.

The reason there are so many "j"s is because the code word for their black ops is "Plan J"

You've heard of Plan "I" Tulsa. This follows it.

I want to know all about Plans "A" through "H".

They have a permanent display and archive for "A" through "H" at The Meadows in Colorado.  I thought all along you were on the super-secret board and roomed with Colonel Sanders every year when they have their conclave.  That was the Colonel's Macaroni and Cheese recipe, yes?

I'm smelling more than a simple conspiracy here...

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by RecycleMichael

I asked my "conspiracy" eight ball for the answer.

The reason there are so many "j"s is because the code word for their black ops is "Plan J"

You've heard of Plan "I" Tulsa. This follows it.

I want to know all about Plans "A" through "H".

Read Cronley's column in today's Lorton's World.

He recites Plan A through Plan Y for downtown.

Pretty funny.


[8D]http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080701_206_A9_spancl229908

[deinstein]

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

Any time you want to compare the "reach" that I have, or Michael Bates has, to the reach you have, I'll happily play.

If you had that much reach you'd be in office right now, huh?

[deinstein]

Sometimes I question democracy and if people are educated enough to vote, and I get apathetic. Then I see Tulsa voters making sure Chris Medlock can't touch the city council with a ten foot pole and I sleep happily at night.

Sincerely,
20-something age, 20-something salary

[Gold]

quote:Originally posted by deinstein

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

Any time you want to compare the "reach" that I have, or Michael Bates has, to the reach you have, I'll happily play.

If you had that much reach you'd be in office right now, huh?

Good work!

LOL at Medlock.

Then again, he may have been referring to his reach in the tapping/ pounding the miscrophone episode.  Or his success at stopping the F&M bank that he made such a hubub over.

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by swake

The city of Tulsa might technically, legally be able to spend a couple of million dollars on lawyers to get out of this debt that the city council and mayor (a previous version) entered into with Bank of Oklahoma. Then again the city probably would not be able to win such a case and then would also probably be responsible for interest on the debt and maybe even the millions Bank of Oklahoma would spend on legal fees pressing the issue.  

I'm not a lawyer, but, the issue seems pretty simple, the city guaranteed a loan to a second party by putting up collateral that was not legal for them to use as collateral. That was the manner the city used to securitize the loan, it does not mean that suddenly the city doesn't "owe" Bank of Oklahoma on the default.

If the courts were to allow the debt to be removed based on this securitization error then shady borrowers all over the nation would start to attempt to use illegal collateral on loans and then upon "discovery" of the error clear the debt of the loan and walk away with the capital from the loan free and clear. That simply makes no sense and for any court to rule in favor of the city would potentially be very damaging to the U.S. banking system. This case is an easy loser for the city of Tulsa.

Even worse if the fact that pressing a lawsuit on this debt that the city certainly did incur (the only question is that city put up illegal collateral) might well, in fact probably would create an acrimonious relationship with one of Tulsa's largest headquarters company and the city's wealthiest citizen and greatest current philanthropist. A positive relationship with Bank of Oklahoma and George Kaiser has mean something in the range $100 million dollars in charitable donations to city needs in just the last couple of years. Would might a difficult and strained relationship yield? To try to save seven million dollars that the city does morally and more than likely legally owe? What if he stopped donating and moved all or part of his company? Would that have been worth the seven million?

A conservative should see that the city owes this money and should pay it. Simple, pay what you owe. Why is the "conservatives" now want to run to the courts just like kid with the stupid slip and fall in another thread?

Excellent.....*****^

Wonder if Medlock went to TU to work on an A.M. talk show..?

Wonder if he ever finished TU....?

Wonder exactly how he feels he is qualified to tell Tulsa what it should and should not be doing....

When he was on the Council he spent an overabundance of time on the "Great Plains" issue........no smoking gun.. whole lot of fizz and no pop...

When he was touting himself as an alternative to "Bill" he had not finished TU..(clerical error) for sure..

That is before he and Bates were offered $$$ to work for LaFortuna... Then "Bill was the man.


[]

Congratulations...you have attained full idiot status.

Neal, Baker, Sullivan, Martinson and Christiansen denied us the money we needed to get the paper records.

I was never offered a position in the LaFortune administration, let alone money.

Not a clerical error, my error to not go back and check if the clerk had changed the grade. I took responsibility from day one.

I have the same authority to comment on events as Ken Neal or David Averill. That is to say that a professional media corporation is willing to pay me to do so.

As for you, your a petty dilettante who lacks class.

Wah... Wah..... Wah....

Baby want a binky..?

So after the lengthy amount of time you spent on the Great Plains disaster they pulled the plug on spending any more money...BFD
That was the one thing that prevented you from finding out "the truth"....Right
That anything like Karl Rove's "the math"..?

So...............When you called Bates and told him "Billy" wanted to talk....or when you had the "behind closed doors" session with "Billy" to warn him about the threat of Kathy Taylor... you were just acting as a Good ole Republican...
Chris I have to say... If you were not offered any money then you were the only one left out...or so it would seem... "Billy" even offered payola to the FOP membership that he would bring wages for the Police up to where they should be if they would endorse him.

But Chris, I have to say, the one area that you have excelled in is the application of your education to furthering the well being of the citizen's of Tulsa.....
Hey this "Track Kathy's plane thing" love it....

All that education.... all that "Road Scholar" type book learning.... and go all the way to working for Rupert "FOX" Murdock..... That man is untouched by questionable activity.


Bravo...! you have joined the ranks of such illustrious individuals as.....

[Chris Medlock]

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by swake

The city of Tulsa might technically, legally be able to spend a couple of million dollars on lawyers to get out of this debt that the city council and mayor (a previous version) entered into with Bank of Oklahoma. Then again the city probably would not be able to win such a case and then would also probably be responsible for interest on the debt and maybe even the millions Bank of Oklahoma would spend on legal fees pressing the issue.  

I'm not a lawyer, but, the issue seems pretty simple, the city guaranteed a loan to a second party by putting up collateral that was not legal for them to use as collateral. That was the manner the city used to securitize the loan, it does not mean that suddenly the city doesn't "owe" Bank of Oklahoma on the default.

If the courts were to allow the debt to be removed based on this securitization error then shady borrowers all over the nation would start to attempt to use illegal collateral on loans and then upon "discovery" of the error clear the debt of the loan and walk away with the capital from the loan free and clear. That simply makes no sense and for any court to rule in favor of the city would potentially be very damaging to the U.S. banking system. This case is an easy loser for the city of Tulsa.

Even worse if the fact that pressing a lawsuit on this debt that the city certainly did incur (the only question is that city put up illegal collateral) might well, in fact probably would create an acrimonious relationship with one of Tulsa's largest headquarters company and the city's wealthiest citizen and greatest current philanthropist. A positive relationship with Bank of Oklahoma and George Kaiser has mean something in the range $100 million dollars in charitable donations to city needs in just the last couple of years. Would might a difficult and strained relationship yield? To try to save seven million dollars that the city does morally and more than likely legally owe? What if he stopped donating and moved all or part of his company? Would that have been worth the seven million?

A conservative should see that the city owes this money and should pay it. Simple, pay what you owe. Why is the "conservatives" now want to run to the courts just like kid with the stupid slip and fall in another thread?

Excellent.....*****^

Wonder if Medlock went to TU to work on an A.M. talk show..?

Wonder if he ever finished TU....?

Wonder exactly how he feels he is qualified to tell Tulsa what it should and should not be doing....

When he was on the Council he spent an overabundance of time on the "Great Plains" issue........no smoking gun.. whole lot of fizz and no pop...

When he was touting himself as an alternative to "Bill" he had not finished TU..(clerical error) for sure..

That is before he and Bates were offered $$$ to work for LaFortuna... Then "Bill was the man.


[]

Congratulations...you have attained full idiot status.

Neal, Baker, Sullivan, Martinson and Christiansen denied us the money we needed to get the paper records.

I was never offered a position in the LaFortune administration, let alone money.

Not a clerical error, my error to not go back and check if the clerk had changed the grade. I took responsibility from day one.

I have the same authority to comment on events as Ken Neal or David Averill. That is to say that a professional media corporation is willing to pay me to do so.

As for you, your a petty dilettante who lacks class.

Wah... Wah..... Wah....

Baby want a binky..?

So after the lengthy amount of time you spent on the Great Plains disaster they pulled the plug on spending any more money...BFD
That was the one thing that prevented you from finding out "the truth"....Right
That anything like Karl Rove's "the math"..?

So...............When you called Bates and told him "Billy" wanted to talk....or when you had the "behind closed doors" session with "Billy" to warn him about the threat of Kathy Taylor... you were just acting as a Good ole Republican...
Chris I have to say... If you were not offered any money then you were the only one left out...or so it would seem... "Billy" even offered payola to the FOP membership that he would bring wages for the Police up to where they should be if they would endorse him.

But Chris, I have to say, the one area that you have excelled in is the application of your education to furthering the well being of the citizen's of Tulsa.....
Hey this "Track Kathy's plane thing" love it....

All that education.... all that "Road Scholar" type book learning.... and go all the way to working for Rupert "FOX" Murdock..... That man is untouched by questionable activity.


Bravo...! you have joined the ranks of such illustrious individuals as.....

Very narcissistic of you to put O'Reilly's head on your body.

[Gold]

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by Chris Medlock

quote:Originally posted by Rico

quote:Originally posted by swake

The city of Tulsa might technically, legally be able to spend a couple of million dollars on lawyers to get out of this debt that the city council and mayor (a previous version) entered into with Bank of Oklahoma. Then again the city probably would not be able to win such a case and then would also probably be responsible for interest on the debt and maybe even the millions Bank of Oklahoma would spend on legal fees pressing the issue.  

I'm not a lawyer, but, the issue seems pretty simple, the city guaranteed a loan to a second party by putting up collateral that was not legal for them to use as collateral. That was the manner the city used to securitize the loan, it does not mean that suddenly the city doesn't "owe" Bank of Oklahoma on the default.

If the courts were to allow the debt to be removed based on this securitization error then shady borrowers all over the nation would start to attempt to use illegal collateral on loans and then upon "discovery" of the error clear the debt of the loan and walk away with the capital from the loan free and clear. That simply makes no sense and for any court to rule in favor of the city would potentially be very damaging to the U.S. banking system. This case is an easy loser for the city of Tulsa.

Even worse if the fact that pressing a lawsuit on this debt that the city certainly did incur (the only question is that city put up illegal collateral) might well, in fact probably would create an acrimonious relationship with one of Tulsa's largest headquarters company and the city's wealthiest citizen and greatest current philanthropist. A positive relationship with Bank of Oklahoma and George Kaiser has mean something in the range $100 million dollars in charitable donations to city needs in just the last couple of years. Would might a difficult and strained relationship yield? To try to save seven million dollars that the city does morally and more than likely legally owe? What if he stopped donating and moved all or part of his company? Would that have been worth the seven million?

A conservative should see that the city owes this money and should pay it. Simple, pay what you owe. Why is the "conservatives" now want to run to the courts just like kid with the stupid slip and fall in another thread?

Excellent.....*****^

Wonder if Medlock went to TU to work on an A.M. talk show..?

Wonder if he ever finished TU....?

Wonder exactly how he feels he is qualified to tell Tulsa what it should and should not be doing....

When he was on the Council he spent an overabundance of time on the "Great Plains" issue........no smoking gun.. whole lot of fizz and no pop...

When he was touting himself as an alternative to "Bill" he had not finished TU..(clerical error) for sure..

That is before he and Bates were offered $$$ to work for LaFortuna... Then "Bill was the man.


[]

Congratulations...you have attained full idiot status.

Neal, Baker, Sullivan, Martinson and Christiansen denied us the money we needed to get the paper records.

I was never offered a position in the LaFortune administration, let alone money.

Not a clerical error, my error to not go back and check if the clerk had changed the grade. I took responsibility from day one.

I have the same authority to comment on events as Ken Neal or David Averill. That is to say that a professional media corporation is willing to pay me to do so.

As for you, your a petty dilettante who lacks class.

Wah... Wah..... Wah....

Baby want a binky..?

So after the lengthy amount of time you spent on the Great Plains disaster they pulled the plug on spending any more money...BFD
That was the one thing that prevented you from finding out "the truth"....Right
That anything like Karl Rove's "the math"..?

So...............When you called Bates and told him "Billy" wanted to talk....or when you had the "behind closed doors" session with "Billy" to warn him about the threat of Kathy Taylor... you were just acting as a Good ole Republican...
Chris I have to say... If you were not offered any money then you were the only one left out...or so it would seem... "Billy" even offered payola to the FOP membership that he would bring wages for the Police up to where they should be if they would endorse him.

But Chris, I have to say, the one area that you have excelled in is the application of your education to furthering the well being of the citizen's of Tulsa.....
Hey this "Track Kathy's plane thing" love it....

All that education.... all that "Road Scholar" type book learning.... and go all the way to working for Rupert "FOX" Murdock..... That man is untouched by questionable activity.


Bravo...! you have joined the ranks of such illustrious individuals as.....

Very narcissistic of you to put O'Reilly's head on your body.

Keep sinking that political career.

Did you happen to leave that pic on an old computer?

[deinstein]

Unbelievable this guy was on the city council.

[YoungTulsan]

So is it wrong for an elected servant of taxpayers to give away their tax dollars when it is not legally obligated, or is it not?  Why all the poo flinging in here?

[waterboy]

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

So is it wrong for an elected servant of taxpayers to give away their tax dollars when it is not legally obligated, or is it not?  Why all the poo flinging in here?

The question IS one of legal obligation. Were you prepared to see an extended legal battle to find out? The potential losses, as enumerated within this thread, were too great for taxpayers and the whole thing is an expensive distraction. You cut your losses and move on.

When it comes to pragmatism vs legality in the business/government world, pragmatists rule. We decided a couple decades ago to elect business leaders rather than idealogues to government leadership, so, this is the result. And its not a bad result. We can always teach them idealogy during the campaign.[] It is a hard pill to swallow when our leaders screw up but this decision is the correct one.

[Wrinkle]

In light of the settlement described below, the question needs to be asked is why the City of Tulsa does not at least receive [back] the land in question illegally used as collateral for the loan we are now paying off?

We are effectively buying that land to pay off the note as originally prescribed in the equity agreement.



As stated, we are paying for 'unjust enrichment' which cannot be demonstrated. Where's the 'enrichment'?

[cannon_fodder]

+1 Wrinkle.   If we are paying on the theory of unjust enrichment, what did we gain?  Where's the cities $7mil sitting at... as far as I can tell, we have nothing to show for it.

Both the city AND the bank made a bad bet on great plains.  The city entering into a deal with blind zeal, the bank running business as usual on a loan.  But, at the end of the day - the party that enters in to such deals in the course of regular business throws up their hands... and only the city ends up losing money.

Add the interested parties, the dubious nature of being added to the suit really late, and on and on... do the "pay it and move on" people at least see what it's worth looking at closely?  We don't have $6K for a stinking dog park... but can schedule a meeting, vote and appropriate $7mil to pay a non-obligated debt in a week.

*and please, no more chest puffing.  I think it's amusing, but start another thread.