Encouraging Energy Economy in local Government

[Friendly Bear]

With energy prices at all time highs, almost all Tulsans are trying to economize on fuel, electricity and natural gas usage.

Well, almost all of us.

Seems some of our city, county, TCC, EMSA, and TPS personnel may not be economizing on energy usage.

Let's start a thread here to document what appears to be uneconomical usage of fuel and energy.

Then, maybe some eco-conscious individual like TulsaNow favorite RecycleMichael can forward these observations along to the appropriate local government manager responsible for wasting our tax dollars.

Here's a few questionable practices I've seen lately:

1.  Just this weekend, at my Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market, I stop for a few groceries.
Parked outfront is a Tulsa Fire Dept. 30-ton pumper truck.

Truck engine is RUNNING.

While getting my Wal-mart brand groceries to economize, I see the Tulsa Fire Department personnel pushing a shopping cart around, piling up groceries.  A LOT of groceries.

Well, firemen have to eat, too.  

But, do they have to shop with the truck ENGINE left running?

Getting -0- M.P.G. while shopping.

2.  When I drive by East 81st Street and U.S. 169 in the very early a.m., I see EVERY parking light burning on the huge parking lot at TCC Southeast Campus.

Some private parking lots now have motion sensitive lights to trip on when motion (of a pedestrian) is identified.  Apparently not TCC....

Wonder why TCC wants to run up their electricity bill?  

AEP thanks them, however.  

FB does NOT.

3.  While attending a Tulsa Drillers game recently, I notice an EMSA ambulance parked just inside the perimeter fence.

Okay by me.  

Seems logical in case there is a emergency.

The ambulance engine is left running.  For 3 hours, the ambulance engine is RUNNING.

Getting -0- M.P.G.  Does NOT seem logical.

During the game, I notice the two ambulance personnel in the box seat section.  They seem to be enjoying themselves.

I suddenly have a case of indigestion, caused either by EMSA fuel wastefulness or the Driller Dog I've just downed.

4.  During a recent foray downtown, on a sunny WEEKEND afternoon, with all the Tulsa city offices closed, I notice every exterior light burning around old City Hall.  Also, all lights burning outside the city council meeting room.  

24 x 7?

Seems, well....dumb.

But, AEP thanks them. Immensely.

5.  During a recent stop at Quik-Trip, I see the EMSA Ambulance personnel sitting inside their vehicle with their engine running.  One is apparently asleep.

The ambulance is still running when I come back by about an hour later.  Getting -0- M.P.G.

Is it because EMSA personnel are basically homeless, having little in regards to permanent basing, and eschewing any possibility of staging out of our local Fire Stations, whom they view a competitors.

Or, do they just like to waste our fuel?

6. During our recent very cold winter, I see Tulsa PD vehicles parked outside of Quik-Trip, Day-Lite Donuts, McDonald's, etc. with their engines left RUNNING.  The driver is inside getting merchandise or food.

Most normal people have to turn off their car engines when shopping, in order to economize.

Why are Tulsa PD apparently wasting our fuel?

7.  As you go by your neighborhood Tulsa Public Schools, notice on the weekends when NO ONE is there that the air conditioning system seems to still be running FULL BLAST.

Why?

Why would TPS want to be so wasteful of our tax dollars?

8.  City Councilor Bill Christiansen attempted to get an accounting as to the number and justification for civilian take-home cars assigned to city personnel.  He found there were  in excess of 100 vehicles assigned for take-home.

Is there still room for improvement in respect to the city vehicle take-home policy?

#9 New Edit:  

Driving around downtown on SATURDAY nite, I see that the OTC is literally ablaze with lights on all floors save one in that 15 Story White Elephant.

EVERY light in the building left burning.

Next door, the 50-story BOK/Williams Tower is mostly blacked out.  Just a few scattered lights on, here and there.

Wonder why?  

Oh, you say the shareholders pay for the lighting of the Williams/BOK Tower, hence the economy.

And, the TAXPAYERS pay to light the new City Hall at One Technology Center, hence the WASTE.

BIG difference.

Is the city/county/TCC/TPS/EMSA just resoundingly stupid regarding energy efficiency measures, or are they simply rewarding AEP, ONG, and our local fuel refineries for underwriting their local government bond and sales tax issues and renewal campaigns?

The old, old game of "I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine".  

And the Taxpayer pays the freight....??

Take your pick.

Please, let's continue this thread for areas where energy wastefulness can be identified, and hopefully generate useful ideas leading to measures where energy economy can be recommended in local Tulsa government.

[mrhaskellok]

Idea:  Does it makes sense for cities and towns to cap fuel efficiency for vehicles and departments?   The obvious problem with this would be that as a fire department nears the end of the budget year and they run out of funds for fuel, who is going to make them park their trucks and the station and walk... no one.  BUT, there must be something that can be done to keep departments in check.  Could you penalize the department in the following years' budget if they don't meet the requirements?  The biggest problem I see with government waste no matter what it is they are wasting, is there is rarely a penalty for "failing".  After all, who wants to cut the police departments budget?  Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by mrhaskellok

Idea:  Does it makes sense for cities and towns to cap fuel efficiency for vehicles and departments?   The obvious problem with this would be that as a fire department nears the end of the budget year and they run out of funds for fuel, who is going to make them park their trucks and the station and walk... no one.  BUT, there must be something that can be done to keep departments in check.  Could you penalize the department in the following years' budget if they don't meet the requirements?  The biggest problem I see with government waste no matter what it is they are wasting, is there is rarely a penalty for "failing".  After all, who wants to cut the police departments budget?  Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I believe that the City of Tulsa has a "contingency" fund, which is a cash reserve if they overspend their budgeted items.

Kind of like the State's "Rainy Day" fund.

The city council regularly approves moving upspent money from one account to cover a shortfall in another account.

[Breadburner]

I saw one department that has a Hemi Durango....I would consider that overkill....

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by Breadburner

I saw one department that has a Hemi Durango....I would consider that overkill....

Is that a gas hog truck, or what?

[inteller]

airlines reward their pilots based on how much fuel they can save.  Perhaps it is time for the city to start doing the same with fire and police dept.

also, all the police units (probably fire too) have a GPS unit in them to track them.  Send a warning dispatch to the vehicle if it is shown to not be moving for more than 10 minutes with the engine on.

[BierGarten]

I own two SUVs and love them.  

I leave my car running when I go into QT and feel good about getting into a cool car when I come back to it.

I still find you observations to be disturbing and I think we should have the answers.  I am a taxpayer and the city is using my money.  

I also add a note that there seem to be quite a few city trucks driven around town that look like they have never been used as trucks, ever.  Is it time that the city look at its vehicles, how they are used, and consider any changes that seem appropriate.?

[YoungTulsan]

Off the top of my head, I would guess that Police, EMT, and Fire rescue vehicles have tons of technology, computers, radio equipment, etc. that run on electricity, that they could not possible have a battery large enough to not fail if they turned the engines off to park somewhere for three hours.  Their vital communication equipment still has to run when they are parked.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

Off the top of my head, I would guess that Police, EMT, and Fire rescue vehicles have tons of technology, computers, radio equipment, etc. that run on electricity, that they could not possible have a battery large enough to not fail if they turned the engines off to park somewhere for three hours.  Their vital communication equipment still has to run when they are parked.

Other than the EMSA ambulances, parked for three hours with their engines and A/C running, the other city vehicles were parked with engines running for shorter duration.

If a fire truck can't sit for 30 minutes with the engine off while the firemen shop for groceries, then don't send a firetruck for groceries.

Ditto on the TPD vehicles.  

And, FYI, unlike many other major cities which use Fire Rescue vehicles to respond to all types of non-fire and EMT emergencies, Tulsa Fire Dept. does not actually use Fire Rescue vehicles.  They use FIRE TRUCKS, at $400-$600K per.

Most of the ones you see zooming and carooming down our beat up Tulsa streets are responding to EMT calls.  More fiscal folly.





[:O]

[patric]

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

Off the top of my head, I would guess that Police, EMT, and Fire rescue vehicles have tons of technology, computers, radio equipment, etc. that run on electricity, that they could not possible have a battery large enough to not fail if they turned the engines off to park somewhere for three hours.  Their vital communication equipment still has to run when they are parked.

The cop I lived across from near TU left his vehicle running at his residence constantly.  It would only move long enough to refuel.  In the winter I could see exhaust coming from the tailpipe day and night.  I cant begin to imagine what equipment he would need at his home to be constantly running in the street (or how he could spend his shifts sitting at home day in and and out).  Something broken here.

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

During a recent foray downtown, on a sunny WEEKEND afternoon, with all the Tulsa city offices closed, I notice every exterior light burning around old City Hall.  Also, all lights burning outside the city council meeting room.

The mayor's website brags about how they have converted older fluorescent lights to more economical ones, but it doesnt mention that they stay on 24/7.
Of course the biggest waste has involved installing horribly inefficient decorative "Acorn" street lights at a ratio of three Acorns for every Cobra-style light they replace.
As a result, streetlight spending doubled between 2003 and 2005, and yet we accelerated the pace with Vision 2025 spending.

Of course, V2025 doesnt pay for the electricity, just create more demand for it by providing bad lights.  Sort of like a heroin dealer drumming up business by handing out free samples.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by patric

quote:Originally posted by YoungTulsan

Off the top of my head, I would guess that Police, EMT, and Fire rescue vehicles have tons of technology, computers, radio equipment, etc. that run on electricity, that they could not possible have a battery large enough to not fail if they turned the engines off to park somewhere for three hours.  Their vital communication equipment still has to run when they are parked.

The cop I lived across from near TU left his vehicle running at his residence constantly.  It would only move long enough to refuel.  In the winter I could see exhaust coming from the tailpipe day and night.  I cant begin to imagine what equipment he would need at his home to be constantly running in the street (or how he could spend his shifts sitting at home day in and and out).  Something broken here.

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

During a recent foray downtown, on a sunny WEEKEND afternoon, with all the Tulsa city offices closed, I notice every exterior light burning around old City Hall.  Also, all lights burning outside the city council meeting room.

The mayor's website brags about how they have converted older fluorescent lights to more economical ones, but it doesnt mention that they stay on 24/7.
Of course the biggest waste has involved installing horribly inefficient decorative "Acorn" street lights at a ratio of three Acorns for every Cobra-style light they replace.
As a result, streetlight spending doubled between 2003 and 2005, and yet we accelerated the pace with Vision 2025 spending.

Of course, V2025 doesnt pay for the electricity, just create more demand for it by providing bad lights.  Sort of like a heroin dealer drumming up business by handing out free samples.

The remodeled Riverparks walking/biking trail between 21st and 31st Streets has this new Acorn lighting.

They appear to put out much less direct light than the older style street lights.

I presume the next remodeled section between 31st and 51st Streets will have Acorn lighting as well.

Michael Bates had some commentary about the faddish Acorn lighting on his Weblog, FIVE years ago.

But, nothing's changed. It's just gotten worse.  Here's the link:

http://www.batesline.com/archives/2003/09/a-light-unto-my.html

[rwarn17588]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

Michael Bates had some commentary about the faddish Acorn lighting on his Weblog, FIVE years ago.

But, nothing's changed. It's just gotten worse.  

Do you mean the lighting, or the commentary?

[Conan71]

Another area of fuel waste is the timing of our traffic lights.  Never fails if I get stuck on the "red cycle" anywhere between 101st & Yale and 15th, I wind up hitting every single red light along the way.

That would not only help citizens save fuel, but less wasteful idling might help lower our ozone output as well.

Isn't there something which could be done to adjust timing and load sensors to keep from being stuck in perpetual red light hell?

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by rwarn17588

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

Michael Bates had some commentary about the faddish Acorn lighting on his Weblog, FIVE years ago.

But, nothing's changed. It's just gotten worse.  

Do you mean the lighting, or the commentary?

www.Batesline.com commentary is GOOD.

Acorn Lighting is BAD.

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by rwarn17588

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

Michael Bates had some commentary about the faddish Acorn lighting on his Weblog, FIVE years ago.

But, nothing's changed. It's just gotten worse.  

Do you mean the lighting, or the commentary?

[}:)]

But I agree with most everyone here (Mr. Bates included).  Acorn lighting sucks.  You're wasting energy on light that's being thrown skyward, instead of finding a way or fixture to reflect and scatter it where it's needed.