BOK Center - Open House

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by atrue67

Is it seriously that high up on list for ADA?
If there is no parking at all, does it mean they do not have to have anything?

Handicap parking requirements are based on a certain amount of the total parking. So no, they don't have to do anything. The drop-off areas on the south and east sides are above and beyond. Also, ADA only requires that you can attend the events, not access all areas of the building. Handicap access to the upper level is not required as I understand it and therefore many arenas only have stair/escalator access to the upper areas open to the general public.

If parking was based on occupancy, they would have to purchase adjoining land to find a place to put them all. Say on average you have two people per car and you need 5% disabled parking. That is 450 parking spots or roughly a city block in surface parking terms.

The goal of the city is that a large convention hotel gets built shortly and that hotel would most likely feature it's own parking structure which would then have handicap parking spaces available.

[SJC TUL]

Great photos, Porky, Hoss, and AMP!

I was there in the afternoon and took lots of photos.  I'm putting some of them online here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezeiza/tags/bokcentergrandopening/
I'll be putting more photos up in the coming days.

Here's a sample pic:


I think it's a magnificent facility.

[mrB]

quote:Originally posted by Hoss


...Here are my photos.  Not as many as yours, but variety, dontcha know!

BOK Center Grand Opening



Comments
  cp9033 says:
Breaking in the new landscaping? I wonder how long it will survive?
Posted 22 hours ago. ( permalink )
 
  oilerfan07    says:
It was a little funny...just after this photo the security guard came by and took care of that. I was glad to see it. We just got done payin' 200 mils for this thing to have everyone trample on it. Probably people that didn't even live in Tulsa county...

Probably the same idiots that think parking on the grass berms around the Fairgrounds during the fair is their God-given-right!

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by atrue67

Is it seriously that high up on list for ADA?
If there is no parking at all, does it mean they do not have to have anything?

Handicap parking requirements are based on a certain amount of the total parking. So no, they don't have to do anything. The drop-off areas on the south and east sides are above and beyond. Also, ADA only requires that you can attend the events, not access all areas of the building. Handicap access to the upper level is not required as I understand it and therefore many arenas only have stair/escalator access to the upper areas open to the general public.

If parking was based on occupancy, they would have to purchase adjoining land to find a place to put them all. Say on average you have two people per car and you need 5% disabled parking. That is 450 parking spots or roughly a city block in surface parking terms.

The goal of the city is that a large convention hotel gets built shortly and that hotel would most likely feature it's own parking structure which would then have handicap parking spaces available.

I can attest to the dropoff area on Denver; I took my mother, who is in a wheelchair, and though I had to wheel her from 100 West (thankfully all downhill), when the time came for us to leave, I decided to take my chances and pull up to the dropoff zone.   Worked absolutely fantastic.

[MDepr2007]

quote:Originally posted by mrB

quote:Originally posted by Hoss


...Here are my photos.  Not as many as yours, but variety, dontcha know!

BOK Center Grand Opening



Comments
  cp9033 says:
Breaking in the new landscaping? I wonder how long it will survive?
Posted 22 hours ago. ( permalink )
 
  oilerfan07    says:
It was a little funny...just after this photo the security guard came by and took care of that. I was glad to see it. We just got done payin' 200 mils for this thing to have everyone trample on it. Probably people that didn't even live in Tulsa county...

Probably the same idiots that think parking on the grass berms around the Fairgrounds during the fair is their God-given-right!

The Murphy's park on the grass along big splash during the off season []
Wonder if they still get to after the city takes over[]

[Oil Capital]

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

[sgrizzle]

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

There is a minimum level to achieve compliance, going above and beyond gives disabled more and easier access.

[Oil Capital]

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

There is a minimum level to achieve compliance, going above and beyond gives disabled more and easier access.

Like...  no parking?  It is to laugh.  
What about the poor handicapped person who drives him/herself to the arena?  The dropoff arena doesn't do them much good, does it?

Assuming a handicapped person gets over the rather significant access hurdle of actually getting themselves into the arena, how does the arena give them "more and easier access" that would make it "the most ADA compliant arena in the nation?"

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

There is a minimum level to achieve compliance, going above and beyond gives disabled more and easier access.

Like...  no parking?  It is to laugh.  
What about the poor handicapped person who drives him/herself to the arena?  The dropoff arena doesn't do them much good, does it?

Assuming a handicapped person gets over the rather significant access hurdle of actually getting themselves into the arena, how does the arena give them "more and easier access" that would make it "the most ADA compliant arena in the nation?"

Hmm..let's see.  Did you even go to the open house?

Second, as I had to wheel my mother around the arena, I found it EXTREMELY easy to get her where I needed.  Elevators were plentiful and not real crowded.  Bathrooms were ADA compliant (her sister helped with that, but I inquired as to the ease of use), areas for wheelchairs to park in both bowls were quite easy to get to and she felt very comfortable, more so than anytime she's been to a movie theater, or the last time she had to go the Convention Center (which was my High School Graduation in 1985).

She was thrilled to be there and astonished at how easy it was.  She hasn't the strength to wheel herself around due to her condition (subdural hematoma about 24 years ago) but she can walk on her own if needed with the aid of a cane.

If she had an electronic or powered chair, there would be no problems with her getting around in the arena at all, especially with the foresight of having a ramp to access all three levels of the arena.  Hell, these electronic carts I see people using at Wally world would fit anywhere in this building and been able to carry the task out.

And if someone drives themselves to the arena that are handicapped, MTTA has already said they will provide a lift van for that service if you call in advance.  For that matter, this person wouldn't even need to drive their own vehicle; they could schedule the van to come pick them up.  Go figure!

That information was in the flyer given out to people who visited the arena on Saturday.

[Oil Capital]

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

There is a minimum level to achieve compliance, going above and beyond gives disabled more and easier access.

Like...  no parking?  It is to laugh.  
What about the poor handicapped person who drives him/herself to the arena?  The dropoff arena doesn't do them much good, does it?

Assuming a handicapped person gets over the rather significant access hurdle of actually getting themselves into the arena, how does the arena give them "more and easier access" that would make it "the most ADA compliant arena in the nation?"

Hmm..let's see.  Did you even go to the open house?

Second, as I had to wheel my mother around the arena, I found it EXTREMELY easy to get her where I needed.  Elevators were plentiful and not real crowded.  Bathrooms were ADA compliant (her sister helped with that, but I inquired as to the ease of use), areas for wheelchairs to park in both bowls were quite easy to get to and she felt very comfortable, more so than anytime she's been to a movie theater, or the last time she had to go the Convention Center (which was my High School Graduation in 1985).

She was thrilled to be there and astonished at how easy it was.  She hasn't the strength to wheel herself around due to her condition (subdural hematoma about 24 years ago) but she can walk on her own if needed with the aid of a cane.

If she had an electronic or powered chair, there would be no problems with her getting around in the arena at all, especially with the foresight of having a ramp to access all three levels of the arena.  Hell, these electronic carts I see people using at Wally world would fit anywhere in this building and been able to carry the task out.

And if someone drives themselves to the arena that are handicapped, MTTA has already said they will provide a lift van for that service if you call in advance.  For that matter, this person wouldn't even need to drive their own vehicle; they could schedule the van to come pick them up.  Go figure!

That information was in the flyer given out to people who visited the arena on Saturday.

Hmm..let's see, have you ever been to another recently-constructed arena?  None of the features you describe in your post makes the BOK Center in any way different from any other recently-built arena (except that a lot of the others provide convenient handicapped accessible parking.)

On the side note you raised, if MTTA vans were the answer to handicapped access, we could do away with all of those special reserved spots at all of the commercial establishments in town; they have convenient drop-off spots too.)

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:Originally posted by Hoss

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:Originally posted by sgrizzle

quote:Originally posted by Oil Capital

quote:

There is no parking period, therefore no handicap spaces. The area on the south side is meant for drop-off however.
At the time of completion, this is the most ADA compliant Arena in the Nation.

Isn't ADA compliance yes/no proposition?  How can one facility be "more ADA compliant" than another?

There is a minimum level to achieve compliance, going above and beyond gives disabled more and easier access.

Like...  no parking?  It is to laugh.  
What about the poor handicapped person who drives him/herself to the arena?  The dropoff arena doesn't do them much good, does it?

Assuming a handicapped person gets over the rather significant access hurdle of actually getting themselves into the arena, how does the arena give them "more and easier access" that would make it "the most ADA compliant arena in the nation?"

Hmm..let's see.  Did you even go to the open house?

Second, as I had to wheel my mother around the arena, I found it EXTREMELY easy to get her where I needed.  Elevators were plentiful and not real crowded.  Bathrooms were ADA compliant (her sister helped with that, but I inquired as to the ease of use), areas for wheelchairs to park in both bowls were quite easy to get to and she felt very comfortable, more so than anytime she's been to a movie theater, or the last time she had to go the Convention Center (which was my High School Graduation in 1985).

She was thrilled to be there and astonished at how easy it was.  She hasn't the strength to wheel herself around due to her condition (subdural hematoma about 24 years ago) but she can walk on her own if needed with the aid of a cane.

If she had an electronic or powered chair, there would be no problems with her getting around in the arena at all, especially with the foresight of having a ramp to access all three levels of the arena.  Hell, these electronic carts I see people using at Wally world would fit anywhere in this building and been able to carry the task out.

And if someone drives themselves to the arena that are handicapped, MTTA has already said they will provide a lift van for that service if you call in advance.  For that matter, this person wouldn't even need to drive their own vehicle; they could schedule the van to come pick them up.  Go figure!

That information was in the flyer given out to people who visited the arena on Saturday.

Hmm..let's see, have you ever been to another recently-constructed arena?  None of the features you describe in your post makes the BOK Center in any way different from any other recently-built arena (except that a lot of the others provide convenient handicapped accessible parking.)

On the side note you raised, if MTTA vans were the answer to handicapped access, we could do away with all of those special reserved spots at all of the commercial establishments in town; they have convenient drop-off spots too.)

You conveniently avoided answering my question.  Did you go?

And on my side note, you're comparing apples to oranges there.  Smaller establishments absolutely need the parking; you wouldn't shuttle someone 20 feet to the door, now would you?  Shall I talk to the lady I know at work who parks in a handicapped spot and tell her since she comes in at 10 pm, she'll have to park 300 yards away from the door, but so sorry, you'll need to get in by yourself.  That's just plain stupid.

And I have been to the Ford Center, CenturyTel Arena in Bossier City (Shreveport) Louisiana, ScottTrade Center in St. Louis, all within the last three years...shall I continue?  NONE of these buildings had the ease of access for the handicapped as this building does.  NONE.  Sure, you could get in, but it was much narrower in the concourses, the handicapped seating was not near as accessible, and it lacked elevator space.  They all had plenty of elevators, but you need to take into account that these elevators need to be a little oversized to handle the hardware.  Not only that, but only one of these buildings had a surface parking lot with disabled parking; yet that parking was still, distance-wise, comparable to walking a city block.  The other two had NO adjoining parking (ScottTrade, Ford Center), at least at the time I went.  Ford may have joining parking garage now, but I haven't been since they did.

And if it sounds like I get sensitive about the issue, you're damn right I do.  I see people on a daily basis park in handicapped parking spots with no reason to do so.  I've confronted people on it.  I suspect they're in the same situation I am (care for a person who is disabled and have the placard to hang) and use it to their advantage.  Sometimes they don't even hang a placard.  I don't know who is worse.

[Chris]

How I saw it.







lots more...

I really wish the timestamps were gone but I had to  borrow someone else's camera and didn't know it was on.

[Porky]

quote:Originally posted by SJC TUL

 
I was there in the afternoon and took lots of photos.  I'm putting some of them online here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezeiza/tags/bokcentergrandopening/
I'll be putting more photos up in the coming days.

 

Awesome pictures, Steven. Wish there was a way I could see what settings you were using on those indoor shots........absolutely incredible! [8D]

[tulsacyclist]

quote:Originally posted by Porky

quote:Originally posted by SJC TUL

 
I was there in the afternoon and took lots of photos.  I'm putting some of them online here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezeiza/tags/bokcentergrandopening/
I'll be putting more photos up in the coming days.

 

Awesome pictures, Steven. Wish there was a way I could see what settings you were using on those indoor shots........absolutely incredible! [8D]

Actually, you can see the EXIF data if you see an image you like in his stream just click on it, then click on 'More properties' which is on the bottom right under 'Additional Information'. That will show shutter speed, aperture, iso sensitivity settings, focal length, etc.

[Hoss]

quote:Originally posted by tulsacyclist

quote:Originally posted by Porky

quote:Originally posted by SJC TUL

 
I was there in the afternoon and took lots of photos.  I'm putting some of them online here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezeiza/tags/bokcentergrandopening/
I'll be putting more photos up in the coming days.

 

As long as the submitter hasn't edited the photo with a package that strips the EXIF out.  Most don't anymore, but Photoshop in one of it's incarnations had a nasty habit of doing that.  I don't alter ANY of the images I upload.  Probably to my detriment, but if I like them well enough, I'll alter them then and have prints made.

Awesome pictures, Steven. Wish there was a way I could see what settings you were using on those indoor shots........absolutely incredible! [8D]

Actually, you can see the EXIF data if you see an image you like in his stream just click on it, then click on 'More properties' which is on the bottom right under 'Additional Information'. That will show shutter speed, aperture, iso sensitivity settings, focal length, etc.