Community Gardens in Tulsa - zoning change!

[Rico]

quote:Originally posted by inteller

quote:Originally posted by Breadburner

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

Small and simple change that could have a nice impact on many areas of the city.

What are the negatives?

No one will maintain it once it gets hot and it will turn into a weed plot.....

heh, if it turns into a weed plot I'm sure there will be plenty of people "maintaining" it [}:)]

A Medicinal Water Garden (hydroponic)...


Now that would be "ahead of the curve"...
and yes; it would have quite a few attendants...

A water feature with some benefits.... possible new source of tax revenue.      

Where do I sign up....?

[carltonplace]

quote:Originally posted by inteller

quote:Originally posted by Breadburner

quote:Originally posted by cannon_fodder

Small and simple change that could have a nice impact on many areas of the city.

What are the negatives?

No one will maintain it once it gets hot and it will turn into a weed plot.....

heh, if it turns into a weed plot I'm sure there will be plenty of people "maintaining" it [}:)]

hehe, you crack me up inteller.

[PonderInc]

Learn more about community gardens and the proposed zoning change...  Rich Fisher interviewed Duane Cuthbertson of INCOG and Cory Williams of Sustainable Tulsa on Studio Tulsa.  You can now listen to archived shows online.  Great summary of the issue in an informative interview.

[PonderInc]

Here's the update on the Community Garden ordinence from an email I received from Duane Cuthbertson at INCOG.

The proposed amendment to the City Zoning Code to incorporate Community Garden as a use by right in all districts was presented to the Tulsa Metropolitan Area Planning Commission (TMAPC) this past Wednesday, January 21st.  The TMAPC came to concensus on the language they wish to see moved forward and requested that a final revised edition be presented to them this coming Wednesday, January 28th for a vote of recommendation to the City Council.

There were some modifications made by the TMAPC to the proposed ordinance amendment, many of which were a result of constructive feedback received at the public meeting at the Garden Center and from correspondence from interested citizens since that time.  

Those changes include:

Adding to the definition: Community Garden: One or more lots or parcels of land used to produce vegetables, fruits, flowers, or other plant material for personal use by the property owner or individuals authorized by the property owner."

Adding to Use Condition C: The site shall be designed and maintained to prevent any chemical pesticide, fertilizer or other garden waste from draining on to adjacent properties.

Adding to Use Condition D: An on-site trash storage container shall be provided and located as close as practicable to the rear lot line. Compost bins or piles shall also be located as close as practicable to the rear lot line. Trash shall be removed from the site at least once a week.  --The Planning Commission felt it necessary to ensure that compost bins were placed in a manner on the lot so as to have as little impact on the surrounding neighborhood as possible.  The Planning Commission did not want to regulate composting beyond placement.

Eliminating the requirement: during non-operating hours vehicles used in conjunction with the Community Garden shall be parked off the street on the lot containing the community garden and shall be of a type customarily found in a residential area.  -- The Planning Commission received public input suggesting that this would be overly burdensome on the Community Garden (utilizing space that could otherwise be productively gardened).  It was also presented that there are ordinances in affect ensuring that vehicles parked in a residential neighborhood are of a type customarily found in the residential district in addition to ordinances that prevent a vehicle from being parked on a city street for more than an inordinate amount of time.  It was also discussed that City streets within neighborhoods are adequate for parking vehicles.

Modifying the operating hours for community garden activity to between 5 a.m. and 11 p.m.  -- The Planning Commission received more than several written and verbal requests at the hearing to make the operating hours of a Community Garden consistent with general City park hours.  There was concensus on the Planning Commission that this was a good idea agreeing that Community Gardening is inherently a passive activity and that in the event of a audibly disturbing gathering after hours there are existing City ordinances City police can enforce.

Adding a provision to the Use Conditions that would allow any condition of the Community Garden to be modified by grant of a Special Exception from the City of Tulsa Board of Adjustment.  -- This provision would enable any neighborhood, upon attaining concensus to amend any of the provided limitations.

You will find attached a rough draft of the proposed ordinance amendment illustrating the mentioned modifications.  The final version presented to the TMAPC may have a slightly different format and there may be some minor changes to the wording of the modified sections but this is substantially the way it will be presented.

This coming Wednesday's Planning Commission is not a public hearing.  They received public comment at the previous meeting (this past Wednesday).  They intend to review the proposed ordinance amendment to ensure it is consistent with their direction provided at the previous meeting and then they will vote to recommend to the City Council that the Zoning Code be amended to incorporate Community Garden as a use by right in all districts.

Thank you to those that wrote to the Planning Commission with comments and suggestions (all were received by them).  Thank you to those who also took the time to come down and provide input to the Planning Commission in person.  

Please don't hesitate to contact me with questions, concerns, or comments.

[RecycleMichael]

Up with Salads!

[PonderInc]

It seems that some of the City Councilors fear vegetables, too!

After all the public input, after all the public support, after the BEST public outreach on the part of INCOG that anyone can remember, and an overwhelming show of support from people and organizations throughout the city...

Some of our city councilors are against community gardens in Tulsa!

The sad fact is that this means the city councilors who are against it (apparent from this morning's council committee meeting), did not bother to research or understand the issue at all.  They somehow failed to notice the extensive public outreach, input, and support.

Instead they are leading by...uh...misguided, blind, gut instinct?

I would ask that any councilor who is opposed to community gardens should ask himself what it is, exactly, that he doesn't want to see in his own neighborhood?  

A stronger community?  Bringing people together?  Providing food security to those who might not otherwise have access to fresh, healthy produce?  Teaching kids about long term goals and reaping the rewards of hard work...while learning a bit about science and nutrition along the way?  Bringing natural beauty to blighted areas?

Wake up, fellers.  You got up on the wrong side of the issue this morning, but there's still time to get it straight.

The community gardens zoning amendment will go back before the (hopefully) full council committee meeting next week (March 3), then it's scheduled for the first reading on the night of March 5.

If this is a taste of how the City Council regards vast public input and participation... they need to be held accountable for ignoring the will of the people.  We've got a Comprehensive Plan to impliment in the next year or so.  And we don't need a bunch of autocrats sitting at the breakfast table...ignoring the voice of the people.

[TURobY]

Do you have a list of those that appear to be against this?

[sgrizzle]

I would like to know as well. There seems to be very strong support in North Tulsa for this. South Tulsa against it?

[PonderInc]

Strangely, one of the main opponents was Henderson!  Gomez seemed to be the only definite "yes."  Several councilors were not present.

[PonderInc]

OK, now I've calmed down a bit.  Perhaps it's unfair to say they were "opposed."  But Henderson and Troyer defintely had a lot of issues with allowing community gardens by right in residential districts.  Most of the others didn't really stand up in support of the proposal or the amazing process of public input that got us this far.

Many seemed interested in making community gardens allowed by "special exception" in residential districts.

This would mean that it would cost about $1,000 if you wanted to have a community garden on your property in a RS district.  $750 or so to get before the BOA, and another $250 for a plat waiver.

$1,000 would go a long way towards buying all the seeds and sets needed to get started!

[OurTulsa]

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=298&articleid=20090225_298_0_Twocit882905

Two councilors concerned about community gardens plan

By P.J. LASSEK World Staff Writer
Published: 2/25/2009  9:19 PM
Last Modified: 2/25/2009  9:19 PM

Two city councilors are giving a green thumbs down to a proposed zoning change that would allow community gardens to crop up on privately owned vacant lots.
While the council agreed to further discussion during its weekly committee meetings, Councilor Jack Henderson said allowing community gardens would lead to more salvage yards.

"I know that's a stretch, but you know what I mean," Henderson said.

Henderson and Councilor David Patrick were vocal about wanting provisions that would give residents approval power over whether a community garden would be allowed on private land in their neighborhood.

"I'm not against community gardens, but we need something to protect the neighborhoods," Patrick said.

Duane Cuthbertson, a planner for the city's Board of Adjustment, presented the recommended zoning amendment that had gone through an extensive public input process. He told councilors that nothing currently prevents a private property owner from having a garden that covers an entire vacant lot.

The difference between a private garden and a community garden is that the latter is an organized activity on either publicly or privately owned land.

Henderson said he doesn't know of anyone who wants to move into an area because there is a community garden — "It's schools and parks they look at."

He said approving the amendment could "open doors we shouldn't."

While there are only a few community gardens in Tulsa, they're not new and have been mostly created by nonprofit agencies.

Newsome Community Farms has five locations in north Tulsa, including a senior garden and a church garden, director Demalda Newsome has said.

Assistant City Attorney Patrick Boulden said it would be illegal to give neighborhood residents control over what a person does with private property.

However, the council was told that the gardens could be required to get a special exception from the Board of Adjustment, which would allow neighbors to give input. The cost to apply for a special exception is $750.

Councilor Eric Gomez said a lot of people and neighborhoods want to start gardens to bring their community together.

Going through a board is not only "onerous, but many of these groups are cash-strapped," he said.

The amended ordinance mandates that no sales can occur on a garden site unless it lies within zoning that would allow such activity or unless the group gets permission through the Board of Adjustment.

Councilor Dennis Troyer said he wants the equipment used in community gardens limited to hand-held tools. Cuthbertson said the intent was to allow residential gardening equipment that could be purchased at a home-and-garden store, not industrial equipment.

Mayor Kathy Taylor asked the staff of the Board of Adjustment to create a Community Garden Committee to find away to make the gardens possible.

The committee held a public meeting attended by more than 80 residents where overwhelming support was expressed for community gardens.


By P.J. LASSEK World Staff Writer

[TheArtist]

While I am for community gardens, I do believe we need to think things through and come up with some framework and process that will help mitigate foreseeable problems.

What happens if not everyone on a street wants something like this in their neighborhood?

Yea I know gardens may be a good thing, but there are always the "no" people. "I bought into this neighborhood for a reason and now they are changing the appearance, etc."

What happens if the garden does become an eyesore?

Say people start putting up a really bad looking fence around it. Large whirligigs, "art" pieces, parts of it get weedy, a run down storage shed for tools, tools lying around, ratty looking compost pile, etc, etc.

If they have permission for the garden, and people dont like the way it looks in the first place... Who can then decide it looks bad if it really does turn into an eyesore. What legal recourse would a neighbor have if it really does start to look like an eyesore, and who decides the point at which it starts being an eyesore? What if there is just one thing about the garden that some think needs fixing or being done differently (the way the compost pile is, the structure is falling apart, is attracting mice)

Can there be fences if this is in a front yard? Of what sort? Wooden privacy fence?

Who is responsible or liable if something happens? What if there is an accident? The homeowner? Would this change their homeowners insurance any?

What kind of insurance would a community garden have?

What if someone gets sick from eating lettuce the neighbors cat peed on lol? (if it can go wrong, it will lol) Chemical or pesticide poisoning. Can any chemicals or pesticides be used and where would they be stored and secured? Tools stored and secured so children cant get hurt?

Does there have to be adult supervision? Can the homeowner tell some kids to get out of the yard/garden if those kids are in the community? What about an adult?

You know most of this stuff (except for perhaps the cat pee lol) and a dozen more things as well, will come up and become a fight. It really does have the potential to become a can of worms.

There should be a well thought out set of rules, processes and procedures to make sure things go as smoothly as possible.

[Conan71]

I scanned the World story and didn't see where Henderson backed up his assertion about this possibly leading to salvage yards in neighborhoods.  pancakes, Jack??  

There's no more guarantee you won't wind up with hillbillies buying or renting a house like Artist got in his neighborhood.  That's what code enforcement is for.  I think there's a lot of limited thinking going on here on the part of the council.

This is a really good idea to bring neighborhoods together, for people to meet who might not otherwise do so.  I just really don't see the fear level that is being pumped here.

[TheArtist]

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

I scanned the World story and didn't see where Henderson backed up his assertion about this possibly leading to salvage yards in neighborhoods.  pancakes, Jack??  

There's no more guarantee you won't wind up with hillbillies buying or renting a house like Artist got in his neighborhood.  That's what code enforcement is for.  I think there's a lot of limited thinking going on here on the part of the council.

This is a really good idea to bring neighborhoods together, for people to meet who might not otherwise do so.  I just really don't see the fear level that is being pumped here.

What are the codes in relation to a community garden?

[pmcalk]

quote:Originally posted by TheArtist

quote:Originally posted by Conan71

I scanned the World story and didn't see where Henderson backed up his assertion about this possibly leading to salvage yards in neighborhoods.  pancakes, Jack??  

There's no more guarantee you won't wind up with hillbillies buying or renting a house like Artist got in his neighborhood.  That's what code enforcement is for.  I think there's a lot of limited thinking going on here on the part of the council.

This is a really good idea to bring neighborhoods together, for people to meet who might not otherwise do so.  I just really don't see the fear level that is being pumped here.

What are the codes in relation to a community garden?

The codes with respect to a community garden would be the same as any other code.  Right now, you have the right to grow a garden in your front yard; if it gets overgrown, full of weeds, attracting vermin, etc...., you could be cited.  Community gardens wouldn't change anything that isn't already allowed in a residential area; the only difference would be that someone who doesn't actually live on the property could still have a garden.  

IMO, it is frustrating to see people use zoning laws to try to cure the problem of a bad neighbor.  Someone who doesn't take care of their property is going to be a problem no matter what the land is zoned.  A garden isn't going to be anymore of a problem than an overgrown field, a yard full of trash, or people parking in their front yard.  All of these are code enforcement issues, not zoning issues.