Smart Cars

[nathanm]

That's why we have the high voltage transmission lines. AC is easy to step up and down using transformers.  DC is not quite so easy.

Yes, I'm quite aware of transmission losses increasing with amperage.

It is true that without modern technology, converting DC voltage relies on things like rotary converters and other large mechanical devices. AC was by far the better way to go for long distance transmission. These days, with semiconductor based transformers, DC can be stepped up or down pretty much as easily as AC, and you gain quite a few benefits when using DC, including less loss for a given amperage and wire gauge. (and the need for less wire).

[Cats Cats Cats]

DC has its uses.. Anyway, the great thing about electric cars is that most of them could be charged off peak at night.  The transmission grid probably wouldn't need a major overhaul for that.  I am unsure at what point the charging power would cause the higher priced power plants to come online.  But anything under that would be fine.  Now if everybody charged their cars on the hottest time of the day we would have a problem.  As far as "selling power back to the grid" well that is kind of stupid honestly unless prices for electricity were REALLY REALLY high.  I certainly wouldn't want to come out from work to find out that I didn't have any charge in my batteries but I made $2.50.

[nathanm]

  As far as "selling power back to the grid" well that is kind of stupid honestly unless prices for electricity were REALLY REALLY high.  I certainly wouldn't want to come out from work to find out that I didn't have any charge in my batteries but I made $2.50.

You don't sell power from your car's battery, you sell it from the wind turbine on your roof when it's done charging your car. (Or the solar cells or whatever)

Although to my mind, distributed generation is more important because I'm fairly certain that our electricity infrastructure will receive maintenance and upgrades about like Oklahoma's roads, which is to say too little too late. Generating at the point of consumption requires less of the transmission and distribution network.

[Red Arrow]

DC has its uses.. Anyway, the great thing about electric cars is that most of them could be charged off peak at night.  The transmission grid probably wouldn't need a major overhaul for that. 

My late (died last fall) uncle said that a mass exodus to electric cars could not presently be supported by the electric companies and the grid.  He was well respected in the Electrical Engineering field.  Fortunately, the car population cannot change that fast. It does mean that a major overhaul in the electric transmission grid probably would be necessary.

[dbacks fan]

Here is a video if you haven't seen it of a crash test of a Smart by the British TV show 5TH Gear.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ju6t-yyoU8s

[Hawkins]

The late 80's Honda CRX-HF got 40mpg city, and 50 hwy.

I'll take one of those over a "smart" car any day.

Makes me wonder why Honda stopped making them. I have my theories...

[Hoss]

The late 80's Honda CRX-HF got 40mpg city, and 50 hwy.

I'll take one of those over a "smart" car any day.

Makes me wonder why Honda stopped making them. I have my theories...

My ex and I had an '89 CRX si.  I loved that little car.  I believe it was 29 city/38 hiway.  We averaged about 34 in that car.

[rwarn17588]

The late 80's Honda CRX-HF got 40mpg city, and 50 hwy.

I'll take one of those over a "smart" car any day.

Makes me wonder why Honda stopped making them. I have my theories...

Because somewhat bigger cars at the time were selling much better and were more profitable?

I'm not going down the conspiracy road. Sorry.

[Hawkins]

Because somewhat bigger cars at the time were selling much better and were more profitable?

I'm not going down the conspiracy road. Sorry.

Perhaps you are right. I mean, its not like the car companies, tire companies, and oil barons actively worked toward buying up all the nation's trolley systems to promote their products.

Wait. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_American_Streetcar_Scandal



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[Red Arrow]

Perhaps you are right. I mean, its not like the car companies, tire companies, and oil barons actively worked toward buying up all the nation's trolley systems to promote their products.

Wait. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_American_Streetcar_Scandal

Maybe GM should start making Streetcars/Trolleys.  The rubber tire companies could re-start some steel companies.  Trolleys have tires, they are steel. Oil barons could become electric barons.   

[bugo]

The late 80's Honda CRX-HF got 40mpg city, and 50 hwy.

I'll take one of those over a "smart" car any day.

Makes me wonder why Honda stopped making them. I have my theories...

If the CRX were built under the current safety standards, it would probably weigh 500 pounds more than the 80s model, which would kill the fuel economy.

[Hawkins]

If the CRX were built under the current safety standards, it would probably weigh 500 pounds more than the 80s model, which would kill the fuel economy.

Subaru gets 5-star crash safety ratings, but they are making their cars lighter. They have all-wheel drive all the time, however, and high gearing. Thus, they get terrible gas mileage.

Honda is an industry leader, and if they wanted to, they could have kept up with the CRX's gas mileage numbers. Instead, they made a hybrid (the Insight), and made it super ugly and weird looking.

Its as if they were onto something there, but didn't want too many of them sold at the time. There was no reason not to make a normal-looking Honda CRX or Civic a hybrid from the start, but oddly, the U.S. population has been slowly eased into this line of thinking.

Not understanding why Honda made their first hybrid, the Insight, look so stupid, I can only come up with conspiracy theories. Not major ones, just something along the lines of oil company deals and kickbacks that are paid in 10-year contracts to stall certain developments.

I could be wrong, but I can't understand the slow development of hybrid vehicles in any other terms at this point.

I can't understand the lack of development of electric cars either. With the average commute of the Tulsa driver, there is no reason for these little "Smart Cars" not to plug into a wall and have a limited range on them. They would get people to work and back home everyday, and they wouldn't have to buy ANY gas for them.

But producing a battery-powered car is a big NO NO in the industry, although I suspect they would sell such vehicles in droves. GM had a good one in test stages, but canceled it.

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[Red Arrow]

I can't remember where I read it but the hybrids were made to look different (ugly) to set them apart from regular vehicles for people wanting to make a statement about their green-ness.

Battery technology still has a way to go before people buying electric only cars in droves would buy a second one.  Cheap to run until you need to replace the battery set.  I've heard it will be thousands of $ to replace the batteries even in a Prius.  Haven't heard any numbers for the Honda.

Electric cars make good sense for short range vehicles. It remains to be seen what it will actually cost to run them compared to gasoline or diesel powered cars. I expect the immediate cost to be a lot less but it won't be nearly free.  It sitll takes energy to go down the road.

[Gaspar]

I can't remember where I read it but the hybrids were made to look different (ugly) to set them apart from regular vehicles for people wanting to make a statement about their green-ness.

Battery technology still has a way to go before people buying electric only cars in droves would buy a second one.  Cheap to run until you need to replace the battery set.  I've heard it will be thousands of $ to replace the batteries even in a Prius.  Haven't heard any numbers for the Honda.

Electric cars make good sense for short range vehicles. It remains to be seen what it will actually cost to run them compared to gasoline or diesel powered cars. I expect the immediate cost to be a lot less but it won't be nearly free.  It sitll takes energy to go down the road.

The battery stack in the Prius lasts over 100k and costs $2,500 to replace.  Toyota makes great electronic components.  I believe you also have to pay a disposal fee for the battery.  Not to big of a hit.

[Red Arrow]

The battery stack in the Prius lasts over 100k and costs $2,500 to replace.  Toyota makes great electronic components.  I believe you also have to pay a disposal fee for the battery.  Not to big of a hit.

I agree, $2500/100,000mi isn't too bad.  I remember hearing about $7500.  I could be totally wrong on the $.