And two years of IDL construction begins..

[Townsend]

Tunnels can have exits to the surface. 

Then the morlocks come at night.

[YoungTulsan]

If you had a few billion dollars to burn this is how you could kill off the IDL:



Kills the BA from Lewis to Peoria, kills the south leg of the IDL, kills the east leg of the IDL.  Continues the BA along the train tracks (with the tracks integrated into the highway just as they are from Sheridan to Lewis) up to the NE section of downtown where it meets 75 & 244.  That cluster of ramps would need to be redone as well.

All of the green areas could redevelop, downtown could be walkable all the way from the BOK center district to Cherry Street.

All we need is a few billion dollars, lol

[nathanm]

If you had a few billion dollars to burn this is how you could kill off the IDL:



Kills the BA from Lewis to Peoria, kills the south leg of the IDL, kills the east leg of the IDL.  Continues the BA along the train tracks (with the tracks integrated into the highway just as they are from Sheridan to Lewis) up to the NE section of downtown where it meets 75 & 244.  That cluster of ramps would need to be redone as well.

All of the green areas could redevelop, downtown could be walkable all the way from the BOK center district to Cherry Street.

All we need is a few billion dollars, lol

So let's just kill the area along the train tracks because it's already not great?

I know! Why don't we turn 71st Street into a grade separated highway? Wouldn't it be nice to have another way from 169 to 75 north of the evil toll road?

I'm not intending to be mean about it, but that's the worst idea I've heard yet regarding the IDL. Moving the problem is not a solution.

[YoungTulsan]

How is that moving the problem?  That is replacing existing highway with about 1/3rd the footprint in new highway.

[nathanm]

How is that moving the problem?  That is replacing existing highway with about 1/3rd the footprint in new highway.

You're basically just moving the wall somewhere else. Moving it to places that are already having problems, no less.

[YoungTulsan]

Hmm well I was thinking of that path as more of an old warehousey-type of area.  I guess you are referring to the neighborhoods there as being troubled?

With new construction you can get it right, at least by building it in a less obstructive way as opposed to the IDL in its current form.  It opens the walls between Cherry Street and downtown though, could you just imagine that entire space with good infill development and walkability?

Also, look at the BA through midtown.  It really isn't as bad as other highways in that stretch from Sheridan to Lewis, much less Berlin-Wallish than 244 or 44 are.  You could also do what CF mentioned with the IDL, on that new stretch of the BA with connective streetscapes on bridges over a recessed freeway.

[nathanm]

Also, look at the BA through midtown.  It really isn't as bad as other highways in that stretch from Sheridan to Lewis, much less Berlin-Wallish than 244 or 44 are.  You could also do what CF mentioned with the IDL, on that new stretch of the BA with connective streetscapes on bridges over a recessed freeway.

Oh, it really is just as bad, although not as wide, it's just that the rest of the highway isn't in a trendy part of town we're trying to make pedestrian oriented, so nobody talks about it.

As far as linking Cherry Street to downtown, the aforementioned bridges with buildings would solve that issue pretty easily. That part of the IDL is almost all below grade. Pearl and OSU-Tulsa are much worse off. About like the areas farther down the BA, actually, just scarier in some people's minds because they believe that all bad things in Tulsa happen downtown and in north Tulsa.

Edited to add: The problem isn't the highway. It's already easy to get between downtown and cherry street. I've walked and biked in that area in the not too distant past. The problem is Peoria being pretty uninviting north of the BA. Fixing up the bridge over the BA would help there. I haven't been under the tangled web at 13th street, though, so I can't really say what that's like. The underpass on 11th doesn't bother me, though. Looking at the satellite images, it seems like 13th would be a nicer route as there is less bridge to go under.

[perspicuity85]

I wouldn't get rid of it I would just advocate burying it like the south leg.  Uptown and downtown are fairly well-integrated because the IDL is below grade at this location. 

Agreed.  There have actually been plans made by the city to suppress the north leg.  I'm assuming this isn't what is being done now though.  It would be nice to see the Brady District flush with OSU-Tulsa.  If OSU-Tulsa ever opens student housing, they could really incorporate student life with the Brady District and the rest of Downtown.

[Hoss]

Agreed.  There have actually been plans made by the city to suppress the north leg.  I'm assuming this isn't what is being done now though.  It would be nice to see the Brady District flush with OSU-Tulsa.  If OSU-Tulsa ever opens student housing, they could really incorporate student life with the Brady District and the rest of Downtown.

I don't know what the city could do to 'suppress' the north leg, seeing how, like I've said earlier, it's part of the National Interstate Highway System.

[sgrizzle]

I don't know what the city could do to 'suppress' the north leg, seeing how, like I've said earlier, it's part of the National Interstate Highway System.

We were going to pay it hush money.

[TheArtist]

I dont think the IDL is that big of a deal. I think we just need a change in mindset here.

I see a lot of talk on here about connecting this area with that, or complaints that areas that were connected and great, were disconnected and ruined once the IDL was put in place.

I think these areas can still be great, though perhaps connected to different areas than they once were, or connected in different ways than they once were. Or, lets even consider that its ok that they arent connected in a certain way.  Areas dont HAVE to be pedestrian friendly/connected, they can be wonderfully unique, distinct areas. I am reminded of downtown and uptown in Dallas, each is a distinct collection of areas bisected by a large mass of highways. Some of the most expensive and desirable highrise lofts are actually the ones on either side of the highways looking across to the buildings on the other side. The highway becomes a spacer which allows for an incredible view. That view is very desirable in an urban environment, especially as it becomes more dense and your other likely view might be the building next to you. I have seen LOTS of examples like this where the buildings line up along the highways like lining a beach front, each of them now having this great skyline of buildings on the other side. (if I were buying one of those new contemporary lofts on Cherry Street, I would want one facing the highway so that I could have a view of downtown, not a building next to me.) In other words, take the situation we have and work with it. As downtown infills and eventually starts going up, people are gonna like those view potentials, and the gaps the highway creates will not seem as large.

Now thats just part of the picture. The other thing to consider is, some areas can be perfectly fine not connected the way they once were. Why does Cherry Street Have to be Connected to downtown for instance? Think Urban Villages, small urban nodes connected by mass transit, or just via bike/scooter. Again, Uptown Dallas and Downtown Dallas each are thriving, though you wouldnt want to walk from one to the other, but there are plenty of places to walk to within each area. The whole city doesnt have to be walkable from one end to the next. Hopefully it will have lots of walkable nodes, but you dont HAVE to be able to walk from one node to the other. If you can, great, if you cant, no big deal.  Even within the IDL there is the potential for many pedestrian friendly nodes which could be connected to each other. Downtown can be perfectly fine as a distinct urban village, or villages, all on its own. Though I dont believe the "disconnects" between neighboring areas are as bad as people make them out to be. No it cant be connected to the different areas the way it once was, but it doesnt have to be, nor do those areas have to be connected to downtown the way they once were and can become urban villages connected to other areas in their own rights.

The Pearl district and a potential east village for instance. If the Pearl really grows the way they imagine it, it wont need to be connected to downtown the way it once was. The Pearl can connect to TU down 6th and 11th streets, and to Whittier Square. Though I also contend again, that once these areas truly infill, the gap the highway makes wont seem as large and can actually act as a welcome break creating distinction between different areas/"villages". The East Village can be more connected to whats in the rest of downtown. Downtown within the IDL is plenty big, and can still be connected in certain areas. The Pearl-TU-Whittier Square area is plenty big. Each "Urban Village" a trolley ride away from the other. They dont have to be one huge mass.

I think what many are really complaining about is more our current lack of infill and "build up" within each area, versus, connections between the areas. Or people trying to connect things the way they were, versus connecting different areas. People will only walk so far, whether they walk in one direction or another is not the question, its whether the area they are in, is worth walking in. Take a trolley or bus to the next area if you want. Encourage each area that can connect to another in a pedestrian friendly way, to do so.  Things dont have to be exactly the way they once were in order to still be great.

[Nik]

Well, it looks like this project will be completed relatively on time. I can't imagine this last phase, which began in 3Q2010 not being completed by the end of the year. The ODOT website says it will be complete in "early 2011." Does anyone have a better idea of when that is? I'd consider the 1Q of the year to be the "early" part of the year. Mainly, for selfish reasons, I'm most concerned about the Sand Springs Expressway to North Leg part.

[sgrizzle]

Well, it looks like this project will be completed relatively on time. I can't imagine this last phase, which began in 3Q2010 not being completed by the end of the year. The ODOT website says it will be complete in "early 2011." Does anyone have a better idea of when that is? I'd consider the 1Q of the year to be the "early" part of the year. Mainly, for selfish reasons, I'm most concerned about the Sand Springs Expressway to North Leg part.

That west side will likely be done first, the north side has many bridges with no decking at all on them still.

This will all rap up just in time to start the 244 bridge construction whhich will again reroute IDL traffic in new and fun ways.

[Townsend]

Announced open today.

By 3 p.m. today, all legs of the Inner Dispersal Loop were opened to traffic for the first time since mid-2009.

Barriers on the eastbound lanes of the loop's north leg came down about the same time local, state and federal officials celebrated the highway's dedication at ONEOK Field.

The dedication, meant to celebrate the $75 million stimulus-funded repaving project, was moved inside because of the rain.

It included representatives of the Oklahoma Department of Transportation, Tulsa Mayor Dewey Bartlett, Gov. Mary Fallin and U.S. Rep John Mica, R-Fla., who heads the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee.

"What is a Republican who voted against the stimulus package doing here," Mica asked.

Mica and Fallin voted against the stimulus bill while in Congress.

Mica said that he wanted to celebrate one of the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act's success stories.

"The sad part is we don't have more of those," said Mica, adding that only 7 percent of stimulus funds -- about $63 billion -- went to infrastructure projects. "We've taken a congested loop ... and we have rehabilitated it and restructured it so we can get around in this community."

The IDL project, the largest single project ever awarded by ODOT, repaved about six miles of highway and 43 bridge decks. Minor work on the loop will continue for several weeks

[Nik]

The drive into work was so much nicer today! No backed up traffic coming into downtown from the west.