Vision 2025...Part 2?

[heironymouspasparagus]

I wasn't implying anyone on that list is sinister.  I consider many people on that list to be friends and highly respect them.  I was simply stating the Executive Committee and Executive Leadership of the Chamber is the best place to start when attempting to determine the beginnings of most if not all sales tax initiatives for the City of Tulsa and Tulsa County.  The absolute majority of the people on that list believe they are doing the best thing for Tulsa.

I think it was Roger Smith who said, "what's good for GM is good for the US....".


Paraphrasing, "what's good for us in the Chamber is good for Tulsa...."

[Gaspar]

There's a logic problem, Michael, because Gas says the Chamber is largely behind this effort, and that those of us on the left will overwhelmingly support it (that if I understand the innuendo correctly.)  Yet, the Chamber is nothing more than a tool of the Republican elite, you know, the monied end of the Republican party rather than the tea party extremists.  Are we supposed to believe that the disorganized rabble representing the professional left will join forces with the pin-striped-three-piece-suit brigade?  Perhaps this is no more than another over-heated fantasy along the lines of the "dump Joe Biden for Hillary" nonsense. 

The Chamber is for the most part an excellent organization that does good things for this city.  As for you comment about "Monied end of the Republican Party,"  you obviously are unaware of the political affiliations of many of the board members, and still even more unaware of the two organizations (not AA) that benefit the most from Vision2 in dollars.

Vision2 was not a massive chamber effort.  As Mike Neal himself said, It was an effort put forth by a small group of chamber members.  Two of those member's organizations have a chance to make about $100 million in interest on the bonds if it passes. 

The AA piece is corporate welfare, and it represented a "crisis" that some just can't resist.



"Never let a crisis go to waste." -Rahm Emanuel, World's Worst Mayor.

[RecycleMichael]

RM, Do you support the Vision2 initiative?

I haven't seen the final list of projects. Who would decide to support or oppose until there is a list of projects? I am willing to pay extra for stuff I think we need and not for those that I don't think we need.

But you seemed to have already made up your mind.

[heironymouspasparagus]

I have made up my mind on one part of it - if AA gets any part of it, I am against it.  They can just put the rest of it up as another vote without AA if they want any possibility of my yes vote.

[Ed W]

I haven't seen the final list of projects. Who would decide to support or oppose until there is a list of projects? I am willing to pay extra for stuff I think we need and not for those that I don't think we need.

But you seemed to have already made up your mind.

I looked on the webpage for 2025, and frankly I'm astounded at the dearth of information.  Sure, there's plenty about the last iteration, but there's nothing that I could see about this one.

Some of my rules (and they're kind of related if you consider the consequences):
     Never give a toddler a loaded gun
     Never give a teenager free rein with a credit card.
     Never give government a blank check.

Another one: Always carry a knife.  But I lifted that one from Jethro Gibbs.

[shadows]

RM sure is having a problem walking the high wire on the "for or against" over dumping three-quarters billion dollars on the desk of an undesignated trust.

The master of figures in posting throws out the millions of dollars in interest that is involved, planned and paid for in the future by the now new coming teenagers.

We should be thankful that this election is not scheduled in the mid-east.

[Conan71]

Don't worry Ed, I'm sure the cutesy renderings with blue water, boats, unicorns, playgrounds, and oldsters playing penuchle under elm trees will be posted shortly.

Then the commercials of teary-eyed children telling us we are beasts and they will call DHS on us if we don't pass it will follow.

[Hoss]

I looked on the webpage for 2025, and frankly I'm astounded at the dearth of information.  Sure, there's plenty about the last iteration, but there's nothing that I could see about this one.

Some of my rules (and they're kind of related if you consider the consequences):
     Never give a toddler a loaded gun
     Never give a teenager free rein with a credit card.
     Never give government a blank check.

Another one: Always carry a knife.  But I lifted that one from Jethro Gibbs.

Awesome.  An NCIS reference in a TNF post.  I never thought that would have been possible.  Well done sir.

[swake]

There are people paying attention to what is posted here. I think we should seriously take on what we would like to see as part of the projects. I want to see what is planned more than what has been stated to far. So far I am a firm "no" on the vote. But with a solid plan and not blank check I can be convinced.

[carltonplace]

There are people paying attention to what is posted here. I think we should seriously take on what we would like to see as part of the projects. I want to see what is planned more than what has been stated to far. So far I am a firm "no" on the vote. But with a solid plan and not blank check I can be convinced.

I want to add to your list:
Make Boulder Ave, Cheyenne Ave, 2nd and 5th St all two way.

[Gaspar]

I want to add to your list:
Make Boulder Ave, Cheyenne Ave, 2nd and 5th St all two way.

+1

When us Southies come downtown for an event it becomes 2 way anyway.

[DTowner]

There are people paying attention to what is posted here. I think we should seriously take on what we would like to see as part of the projects. I want to see what is planned more than what has been stated to far. So far I am a firm "no" on the vote. But with a solid plan and not blank check I can be convinced.

If it were just the deal closing fund and the airport property improvements (no funds to private companies for tools, equipment, etc.), I would probably hold my nose and vote yes.  The current tax does not expire for 4 years, we should take our time to develop a list of quality of life projects that are targeted to our priorities and needs (and even discuss whether a city or county tax is the best way to do it).   I voted yes on both of Mayor Savages' failed projects, Vision 2025 and the River Project.  As Vision 2 is currently conceived, I will vote no.

[Vision 2025]

www.Vision2025.info is NOT a campaign web site.  We are in the process of updating the site to provide factual materials regarding the upcoming vote. 

I understand there is a temporary site up regarding the campaign but at I don't have the url. 

[Teatownclown]

www.Vision2025.info is NOT a campaign web site.  We are in the process of updating the site to provide factual materials regarding the upcoming vote. 

I understand there is a temporary site up regarding the campaign but at I don't have the url. 

Sheeesh, can't even launch a fact sheet correctly.

[Ed W]

www.Vision2025.info is NOT a campaign web site.  We are in the process of updating the site to provide factual materials regarding the upcoming vote. 

I understand there is a temporary site up regarding the campaign but at I don't have the url. 

If it's not a campaign website why does it remain up?  All it does is convince people that there's little of substance in this upcoming vote, yet we're smart enough to realize it wouldn't have progressed this far without an actual plan.