Tulsa Police Chief Talks About Cuts

[DowntownNow]

And those are straight salaries before any comparable adjustment for cost of living.  You add COL into the mix and TPD is doing quite well compared to the other cities and yet enjoys a greater percentage of non-violent and violent crime in comparison to many of those other cities.

[rwarn17588]

And those are straight salaries before any comparable adjustment for cost of living.  You add COL into the mix and TPD is doing quite well compared to the other cities and yet enjoys a greater percentage of non-violent and violent crime in comparison to many of those other cities.

Thank you. I was about to make that point, but forgot. Tulsa is one of the least-expensive cities to live.

[DowntownNow]

I was bored watching the snow so I went and did it...

Adjusting for the cost of living between the comparable cities to Tulsa's starting pay of $43,744...Tulsa ranks 3rd out of 7 overall when you consider some of the other cities have the same cost of living adjusted starting pay as other cities. 

When you average these starting pays out, the average is $42,415...placing Tulsa's starting pay at $1,330 higher than the average. 

Basis (Cities base starting salaries once adjusted for Cost of Living to Tulsa)

$46,640  Austin, OKC, Tucson and Denver
$43,796  Colorado Springs, San Antonio
$43,744  Tulsa
$39,290  Minneapolis
$39,094  Dallas
$36,347  Kansas City
$35,262  Omaha

[rwarn17588]

I was bored watching the snow so I went and did it...

Adjusting for the cost of living between the comparable cities to Tulsa's starting pay of $43,744...Tulsa ranks 3rd out of 7 overall when you consider some of the other cities have the same cost of living adjusted starting pay as other cities. 

When you average these starting pays out, the average is $42,415...placing Tulsa's starting pay at $1,330 higher than the average. 

Basis (Cities base starting salaries once adjusted for Cost of Living to Tulsa)

$46,640  Austin, OKC, Tucson and Denver
$43,796  Colorado Springs, San Antonio
$43,744  Tulsa
$39,290  Minneapolis
$39,094  Dallas
$36,347  Kansas City
$35,262  Omaha

+1

[Wilbur]

Wilbur is just wrong.

The average starting pay for a TPD officer is $43,744 and is ranked 8th among the 'universe of comparable cities'.  The average pay among the other 10 comparable cities is $45293...for a starting TPD, thats a difference of $1,550 or 3.5% below average, not 22%.

You can't look at just salaries, you have to look at total compensation packages and compare comparable ranks to similar duties without looking at titles.  In other words, a sergeant in Tulsa is the same as a lieutenant in Oklahoma City because of their same duties.

Salaries are only part of the total compensation package.  While most police agencies provide the same parts of the package, they are done in different amounts and different percentages.  These other parts would include health insurance (what percentage/amount is paid by the employer/employee), specialty pay, uniform allowance (is the officer paid and then responsible for their own uniforms?  Or does the employer provide all uniforms and replacement uniforms), overtime rates, holiday pay,.....  The list goes on.  Once all of these things are added into the complete package, Tulsa ranks 9th and 22% behind average.  Even city officials agree.

And I'll say again...  It's not about the money.  Never has been.

Watch how much money they will "find" over the next couple of days.

[nathanm]

Once all of these things are added into the complete package, Tulsa ranks 9th and 22% behind average.  Even city officials agree.

And I'll say again...  It's not about the money.  Never has been.

Watch how much money they will "find" over the next couple of days.

Oh no! 9th! Won't someone think of the officers?!

Now that we've grounded the heli-costers perhaps we can find some funds to shore up our apparently lacking compensation package.

[shadows]

The arguments are well established as this is the way unions negotiate contracts.  They pick the places where they find the highest paid city employees to use as a standard for what the city should pay; including perks and retirement time.  It has come down to where it reflects a group of children saying that he has three quarters and I have only one so make him give me one of his.

Any comparison can only be based on:

Comparing the cities population: 

Their source of income:

Their total budget:

And how the budget is allotted.

In the recent article on the price of trash pickup the city of BA was noted as charging the highest fee in the area.  It was not mentioned that BA furnished plastic trash bags free of charge.   

The comparison of cities is a very poor ruler to measure the benefits derive at cost per capital when submitting comparisons of the original intent to establish police forces.  Now they have the three quarters and are demanding the other one.  Cost of living in the city is very hard to establish as a argument point when over 50% of the employees do not live in the city.

Damn that Bartlett and his running a political bureaucracy as if was a business.

[Wilbur]

The arguments are well established as this is the way unions negotiate contracts.  They pick the places where they find the highest paid city employees to use as a standard for what the city should pay; including perks and retirement time.  It has come down to where it reflects a group of children saying that he has three quarters and I have only one so make him give me one of his.

Both the City and the union agreed on the list of cities.

While I agree the union probably wanted to use cities with the highest salaries, the city wanted to use cities with the lowest salaries.  Negotiations resulted in the agreed upon cities.

[Conan71]

I'm trying really hard to remain objective on the issue, but I'm leaning more toward: the union is coming off as greedy and un-wavering in a PR battle and trying to make the city leadership look like asses, pretty much the same thing they've always done to incumbents.  Bear with me here, public perception is the viewpoint I'm trying to convey, not a lack of appreciation for the TPD nor how difficult it is to run this odd-ball confluence of egos that is the city of Tulsa.  

Where the truth lies is still up for debate in my mind.  Most definitely the planets seem to have aligned in a perfect cataclysm for the TCSD to start running some calls to make up for a sudden short-fall from TPD.  Either that or we are getting ready to find out the new admin had a pre-concieved notion that the TPD was over-staffed by a factor of 155 124 officers.

Take a look at it this way: TCSD deputies are paid considerably less and recieve far fewer benefits.  If you were stuck with the legacy costs of the last few Mayoral administrations, Dade and Broward County models for law enforcement start looking attractive, especially if the admin starts averaging salaries closer to the deputy pay scale versus a rookie TPD's pay.  I'm sure they pay their cops a whole lot more, let's not turn it into who makes what where.  

What's confusing me now is taking the simple math of starting pay scale of $44,000 and assuming all those laid off were at the bottom end only.  This does not take into account all the benefits, cost of the vehicles they drove, etc.  Salary alone comes to $2.8mm  over 5 months.  I'm quite certain the overall costs per officer are probably double that if you amortize out equipment, training, etc.  

[MH2010]

Here is an email from one of the officers that was laid off.  I will remove his name but post the email here in an effort for people to see what he was thinking when he voted... 

As I sit here writing this, it is with mixed emotions. On the one hand, I am relieved to finally be done with what can only be explained as a roller coaster ride. For the past 2 months, I have come to work every night not knowing if I would have a job the next day. Despite this, myself and the Officers I work with have done our best to keep our heads high while working to ensure that the innocent are kept safe and that we all come home safely at the end of the night. We do this because that's the job. We do this because if we don't look out for each other out there, no one else will. It has been an emotional drain given the circumstances, but we have done it. For this reason, I am relieved to finally have some closure. On the other hand, I am broken inside. I am broken because over the past 3 years I have experienced things that the average person will likely never experience. I have entered buildings after hearing shots fired inside, all the while knowing that I'm going to come out ok because myself and the Officers at my side are going to do what has to be done to make sure we all go home to our families. I know without asking that as I enter a dark room looking for the bad-guy, my partner's gun is trained on the dark hallway ahead of us, ever vigilant of the unseen danger. This is a trust and a bond that is difficult to explain to those who haven't experienced it.

Another emotion that I am feeling is disgust. I am disgusted at the way Officers and the futures of their families have been traded and bartered like cheap baseball cards by our Mayor. I am disgusted by the fact that I found out I was being laid off through the media. I am disgusted by the fact that my Chief found out that he was "resigning" through the media. I am disgusted by the spinelessness of a Mayor elected to notify us this way rather than by facing us and delivering the news personally. I am disgusted by the way our Mayor has forced us to choose between altering the lives of the senior Officers forever, or ending the careers of 158 younger Officers.

As for the "option" given by the Mayor to "avoid layoffs," for me it was no option. For those of you who are reading this and do not know the details of his proposal, here it is. The Mayor attempted to sell this to the media as a 5% pay cut with some concessions. However, those concessions were more furlough days, no salary step increases, the loss of the few benefits we have left, and loss of the right to negotiate for 2 years. All and all, when one takes in to account the furlough days that we have already taken this fiscal year, the total pay cut falls between 15-20% depending on how long the Officer has been employed. On top of this, the Mayor refused to guarantee that if we took this deal, he would not turn around and lay us off anyway. I am in the bottom 155 Officers and last night I voted to lay myself off. I did this because I could not in good conscience vote for a 20% decrease in the salaries of many Officers with large families who I know could not afford it. Also, our pension system is based on our average salaries towards the end of our careers. This means that if we were to have taken this cut, the Officers who are near retirement would take a substantial hit in the pension that they require to survive after they retire. I will move on and I will do what I have to do to provide for my wife and I. I will be ok. I have no doubt that there will be many departments who will recognize what we have to offer. For those who voted otherwise please do not get me wrong, I am by no means saying that everyone should have voted this way. I voted my heart and I have no doubt that you did as well and that is all that can be asked.

To my brothers and sisters who are reading this, it has been an honor working with you and it is difficult for me to imagine what next week will be like without you. You and your families will be in my prayers. In just a few hours many of us will report for our last night as Tulsa Police Officers and until the end of the shift, it will be business as usual. We will take calls and we will chase bad guys. When someone calls 911 screaming for help, we will generate complaint calls getting there as fast as we can. And when we get there, we will rush to protect someone who cannot protect themselves... with our lives if need be.

I love you guys
XXXXXXXXXXX

[swampee]

When this thing first started I was all for the police. I am a huge for supporting our police, fire, parks and rec, education, and all our other civil servants. Honestly as this whole affair has progressed my perception has shifted about how the police have handled it. I could be wrong about it but they have come off very self serving in the whole affiar.

[rwarn17588]

OK, it's time for the police posters here to get down to the brass tacks. Sob stories by MH2010 are good and all, but it's time to deal with reality, which the FOP and officers seem reluctant to do so ...

-- If you were the mayor, what would you have done? (And don't give me unreasonable short-term answers, such as raiding the TARP fund or other funds that are dedicated to something else entirely. That is not a long-term solution. And don't give me conspiracy theories of which you have no proof of their existence. And give specifics, not generalities.)

-- If police are so poorly compensated, as you all claim, why did the TPD see the highest fund increases in the past eight years compared to other departments in the city?

-- If the police are supposedly so important in crime-fighting, why is it that the crime rate has stayed flat in the past six years despite TPD fund increases? The numbers have bounced around a bit from year to year, but the trend is basically flat.

-- I keep hearing about peer cities in salary comparisons. Does the FOP consider the cities' cost of living in these comparisons at all? Isn't it dishonest to compare, say, Dallas' police pay to Tulsa's, when it costs thousands of dollars less to live here than there? To provide a baseball analogy, it's about as silly as comparing hitting statistics from the dead-ball era in the early 1900s to the lively-ball era in the 1930s.

-- If you're truly earnest about negotiating with the mayor, don't you think it's disingenuous and inflammatory to call him an "extortionist"? I mean, you guys are in law-enforcement and presumably know the law. Don't you think it's dishonest to call someone an extortionist and it's obvious he isn't?

[shadows]

While the new cry is to start negotiating for next year the charter gives the mayor the power to refuse any negotiations.  "In good faith" is not always considered a standard procedure.    Don't see it that way?   He just did it.  In view of the overdraft on the cities income he could establish the TPD starting wage at the average wage cited by the US Department of Labor.  When bringing to the table of how much cheaper it is to live in Tulsa someone should be prepared to answer why over 50% of Tulsa employees live in the outlining cities.  If they were to move back into the city the lower cost of living would offset a decrease in wages.

Who put up the million dollar ante fee may step forward.  Taking the city's unions to task is proving to be a strip down tactic.  Would believe the best solution "Let it cool off". 

[buckeye]

This whole thing has stunk up the city, it's a political pissing match.  The union will use any tactic, emotional manipulation, hyperbole, etc. in a blind grab for everything it can get; the Mayor tries to establish a reputation as a hard-nosed money manager ready to clean things up - both sides are arrogantly self-interested.  Any benefit or disadvantage laid on the citizens and the officers is just a side-effect of this little sandbox skirmish.

[Wilbur]

OK, it's time for the police posters here to get down to the brass tacks. Sob stories by MH2010 are good and all, but it's time to deal with reality, which the FOP and officers seem reluctant to do so ...

-- If you were the mayor, what would you have done? (And don't give me unreasonable short-term answers, such as raiding the TARP fund or other funds that are dedicated to something else entirely. That is not a long-term solution. And don't give me conspiracy theories of which you have no proof of their existence. And give specifics, not generalities.)

First -  I would have started by keeping all of this out of the media.  The union tried that at first, even though the mayor wouldn't, but the union was getting its a$s kicked, thus, forcing the hand of the union to make it media driven.  Neither side won.  It simply makes the citizens have to hate one side or the other.  Totally uncalled for.  Made both sides look like fools.

Second - If you expect to get the same voting results from the police that you did from fire, try and present the same packages that are even close.  What was presented to fire was so different from what was presented to police, it makes you wonder why the mayor has taken sides.  Even the fire union president said this morning on the radio had the mayor presented the same package to fire that was presented to police, fire would have voted against it.  (If you need details, ask)

Third - don't demand employees take furlough days for a year that doesn't even start for another five months when you don't know what will happen with tax revenues.

Fourth - Agree ahead of time, like you did with fire, that should the tax revenues turn around and come in close to previous projections, you will agree to restore concessions. 

Fifth - Be open to using other funds.  Don't scream being poor when you have millions of dollars sitting around that CAN be used on a temporary basis.

Sixth - Don't tell everyone you need a long term solution, then say you need a short term solution.  It makes you sound like you have no idea.

Seventh - Don't make the City Council have to call you and tell you to sign the concessions the police tried to give up in December.  We all know you were going to use those concessions as a tool in upcoming negotiations.