Most Religious States Study

[guido911]

Oklahoma at #7:

http://pewforum.org/docs/?DocID=504

Easy to spot "red" and "blue" states on the chart.

[rwarn17588]

Oklahoma at #7:

http://pewforum.org/docs/?DocID=504

Easy to spot "red" and "blue" states on the chart.

It's also apparent the list shows that a lot of praying and church-going is proportional to a state's poverty and backwardness.

You're seeing a lot of folks in Darwin's Waiting Room in the Top 10.

[Ed W]

You'll see much the same rankings regarding school spending, teen pregnancy, and obesity.  While it's tempting to say there's a correlation, that doesn't presume that one is the cause of the other.  There's a name for that particular logical fallacy, but it escapes me at the moment.

[nathanm]

You'll see much the same rankings regarding school spending, teen pregnancy, and obesity.  While it's tempting to say there's a correlation, that doesn't presume that one is the cause of the other.  There's a name for that particular logical fallacy, but it escapes me at the moment.

It's not just tempting to say there's a correlation, there is in fact a correlation. Causation is up in the air, however. (Correlation is the mere relation of the things, and has nothing to do with causation)

What is it about strong religious observance and race which both correlate strongly with poor school performance, teen pregnancy, and obesity? It isn't money. The smaller, more religious states get more federal dollars back than they send to Washington.

I think it's either (lack of) education, poverty, or both that drive higher teen pregnancy and obesity.

[JoeMommaBlake]

It's not just tempting to say there's a correlation, there is in fact a correlation. Causation is up in the air, however. (Correlation is the mere relation of the things, and has nothing to do with causation)

What is it about strong religious observance and race which both correlate strongly with poor school performance, teen pregnancy, and obesity? It isn't money. The smaller, more religious states get more federal dollars back than they send to Washington.

I think it's either (lack of) education, poverty, or both that drive higher teen pregnancy and obesity.

I think most of this is pretty easy to explain...and while they may all exist together, I agree that they don't necessarily have anything to do with one another.

People in the south are fatter for a simple reason...They eat more food and the food they eat is less healthy. It has little or nothing to do with education or religion. In that part of the country they cook with grease...on a related note, the food in the South is typically better tasting. It's cultural. Seattle and San Francisco are great places for sushi and granola bars. You want fried chicken and gravy? Alabama.

There are more race issues in the south primarily because southern African Americans have been playing "catch up" since the abolition of slavery. They started broke and uneducated. Slaves, by nature, weren't people of means or education. While money and schools exist in the South and are available, it's presumptuous to assume that in the very short amount of time since slavery ended (and a much shorter time since "equality" in the south became the "norm"), southern blacks as a whole would overcome the setbacks and somehow universally take advantage of the education and capitalism to which they now have access. You want the first domino? Wealthy, educated white people treating poor, uneducated African slaves like they aren't worthy of the same pursuits....In fact, they were treated as if they were only worthy of performing menial tasks like washing things and picking things.

None of that has much to do with "religion." The North had as much "religion" as the South for most European immigrants that settled in northern states were Irish Catholic, Italian Catholic, or Jewish. The religion was different, but it was no more pronounced in the South. Today, the South has more protestant, conservative values, but that has little to do with education and more to do with the nature of their "religion." I know this may be hard to swallow, but being a conservative Christian is not synonymous with being uneducated.

As for teen pregnancy, that too is cultural. As a general rule, it happens more in rural areas than in urban ones and more in the black community. The South is loaded with rural areas and black communities. Also, conservative Christians are less likely to have "secret abortions" (though not entirely), so it's also more likely that southern states have more reported pregnancies and full term pregnancies than other parts of the country. Religion may play a part, but mostly I think it's cultural...which goes back to the very origins of the South.

As for those small states getting "federal dollars," I don't think we should qualify that as those states having money. The monies they receive don't put them on par with the states that get fewer federal dollars. It's not even close. Furthermore, federal dollars don't have a strong reputation of being able to fix or help much of anything. Money is a big part of the issue in the South as it's still generally very much about the "haves" and the "have nots" there. That gross imbalance has barely changed since slavery ended. If you visit there for any length of time, you'll find that southern aristocracy tends to be just fine with it staying the way it is. In general, they've never been really happy about losing a war and about being told to treat blacks equally. A-Holes.

[we vs us]

Inequality is endemic to the South.  I'm not sure why, but Southerners tend to prefer a really stratified class system.  Race is part of it, but not all (there're plenty of dirt poor white folk in the south, too).   

[Conan71]

How on earth do you come up with a ranking for "most religious"?  The methodology in these polls is laughable.

[rwarn17588]

How on earth do you come up with a ranking for "most religious"?  The methodology in these polls is laughable.

The methodology is right here:

http://religions.pewforum.org/pdf/report2religious-landscape-study-appendix4.pdf

What's so laughable about it? It's not as if Pew is a fly-by-night operation.

[USRufnex]

Dang, we're number 7?
I thought we were better than that.....

Does this mean we're in danger of not snagging a spot in the BCS (Bible Championship Series) ?

[Red Arrow]

Dang, we're number 7?
I thought we were better than that.....

Does this mean we're in danger of not snagging a spot in the BCS (Bible Championship Series) ?

'fraid so.  Gotta be in the top 4.

[Ed W]

It's not just tempting to say there's a correlation, there is in fact a correlation.

You're right, Nathan.  What was banging around in the back of my head was "correlation is not causation" but it was early, and I was still on my first cuppa.  I'm more awake now, and what's banging around is "ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny." 

I have a mind full of useless junk.

[guido911]

It's also apparent the list shows that a lot of praying and church-going is proportional to a state's poverty and backwardness.

You're seeing a lot of folks in Darwin's Waiting Room in the Top 10.

Translation:  Being religious creates white trashiness. We'll just forget about all that "more religious=more charitable giving" crap.

[Red Arrow]

Translation:  Being religious creates white trashiness. We'll just forget about all that "more religious=more charitable giving" crap.

Part of that generosity comes out of my pocket due to tax deductions. 

[USRufnex]

Part of that generosity comes out of my pocket due to tax deductions.  

Hmmm.  Got me thinking about those church tax deductions......

Rankings from Pew's "most religious" followed by 2004 stats for federal tax expenditures vs. tax burdens:
Mississippi got $1.77 of benefits for every dollar of federal tax money collected in 2004.....

1.  Mississippi          $1.77 McCain-Palin
2.  Alabama            $1.71 McCain-Palin
3.  Arkansas           $1.47 McCain-Palin
4.  Louisiana           $1.45 McCain-Palin
5.  Tennessee         $1.30 McCain-Palin
6.  South Carolina    $1.38 McCain-Palin
7.  Oklahoma          $1.48 McCain-Palin
8.  North Carolina    $1.10 Obama-Biden
9.  Georgia             $0.96 McCain-Palin
10. Kentucky          $1.45 McCain-Palin

Top 10 tax donor states.... followed by their ranking of 1st-46th in Pew's most religious....

1.  New Jersey        $0.55 Obama-Biden (30th most religious)
2.  Connecticut       $0.66 Obama-Biden (42nd most religious)
3.  New Hampshire   $0.67 Obama-Biden (46th most religious)
4.  Minnesota         $0.69 Obama-Biden  (31st most religious)
T5. Nevada            $0.73 Obama-Biden  (34th most religious)
T5. Illinois              $0.73 Obama-Biden  (28th most religious)
7.  Massachusetts   $0.77 Obama-Biden  (44th most religious)
T8. New York          $0.79 Obama-Biden  (39th most religious)
T8. Delaware          $0.79 Obama-Biden  (24th most religious)
T8. Colorado           $0.79 Obama-Biden  (41st most religious)
T8. California          $0.79 Obama-Biden  (35th most religious)