An Open Letter To Conservatives

[Gaspar]

I seem to hear O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Limbaugh, Coulter, Palin, and others use name calling pretty much constantly. It is by no means a "liberal tool." It's called frustration. I'm sure you're familiar with it.

You are correct there are "entertainers and commentators" that use the tactic.  I was thinking of politicians.

I love that you snuck in Palin.  That was crafty of you.  I think the only name she ever hung on her opposition was "socialist."  That may have been an unfair moniker, however when I read the definition, I'm not sure the current administration would be able to defend against such a label?

SOCIALISM a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Are these goals not aligned with the current administration's actions?

[Conan71]

Tea Bagger is/was a neo-con term.  I hope HazMat pays more attention in the job (CFO??) than does to casual reading here.

Just kind of a cute euphemism for people who scream and clamber for something, when they already have it.  And apparently don't even know they have it.  Still amazing.

There's got to be a Godwin's law of some sort for using Neo-Con and Tea b***** in the same sentence.  Congratulations, your non-partisan stance is duly noted.

Sorry guys/gals that term is incredibly demeaning and sophomoric, it's used far more by liberals as a derisive term than it is by any one affiliated with the Tea Party.

[Conan71]

I seem to hear O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Limbaugh, Coulter, Palin, and others use name calling pretty much constantly. It is by no means a be the "liberal tool." It's called frustration. I'm sure you're familiar with it sgrizzle refers to.

FIFY

[Townsend]

I love that you snuck in Palin.  That was crafty of you.  I think the only name she ever hung on her opposition was "socialist."  That may have been an unfair moniker, however when I read the definition, I'm not sure the current administration would be able to defend against such a label?

I looked to see if there was any name calling from Palin.

You're right, I couldn't find any where she was name calling.

She defended it though:

Comedy Central funnyman Stephen Colbert put Sarah Palin's "satire" defense over the word "retard" to the test Monday night - and used it to describe the former Alaska governor.

"We should all come to her defense and say that Sarah Palin is a f---ing retard," Colbert said.

"It's satire."

The comic jab came after Palin, who lobbed criticism at White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel for calling liberal activists "f---ing retarded," later forgave Rush Limbaugh for doing the same thing, calling his use of the term "satire."

"Our politically correct society is acting like some giant insult's taken place by calling a bunch of people who are retards, retards," the conservative talk show host said on his radio show.

"He was satirical in that," Palin said on Fox News Sunday.

Her defense of Limbaugh seemed to contradict her spokesperson, who said last week, "Governor Palin believes crude and demeaning name calling at the expense of others is disrespectful."

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2010/02/09/2010-02-09_stephen_colbert_defends_sarah_palin_on_colbert_report_calls_her_a_fing_retard.html

[nathanm]

SOCIALISM a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Are these goals not aligned with the current administration's actions?

Are those goals not the ideal of the entire nation? I think pretty much everyone supports the economic freedom to start their own business, and therefore own part of the means of production.

[Gaspar]

Are those goals not the ideal of the entire nation? I think pretty much everyone supports the economic freedom to start their own business, and therefore own part of the means of production.

Interesting.
My wife and I own a business.  My community does not own it.  You are part of the community and while I may value your opinion, you have no power over my business except with which you choose to pay for my goods or services.

For some the trappings of socialism are intoxicating. . .The concept of community control and ownership. . .The hive.

Unfortunately it is a short lived system.  It always degrades into tyranny because it cannot tolerate freedom. 

The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings. The inherent blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery. – Winston Churchill

The fatal flaw in socialism is twofold: first, the conceit inherent in the desire to plan the lives of others; second, the force necessary to impose that plan on unwilling subjects. This is not a formula for freedom but for tyranny. – Jim Peron in The Ideals of Tyranny

There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialism -- by vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide. – Ayn Rand, LA Times, 9/2/62

[nathanm]

Interesting.
My wife and I own a business.  My community does not own it.

I take it you are not part of the community, then? If we all own businesses, we all own part of the means of production. Our little part.

You know, "in the community as a whole," as opposed to "concentrated in the hands of a few individuals or government."

[Gaspar]

I take it you are not part of the community, then? If we all own businesses, we all own part of the means of production. Our little part.

You know, "in the community as a whole," as opposed to "concentrated in the hands of a few individuals or government."

You're not getting it, but that's ok.

[nathanm]

You're not getting it, but that's ok.

I could have written that post about you.

[heironymouspasparagus]

Who was it calling people "pussies" on another topic here?  Oh, yeah....one of the more conservatives.

Palin just can't quite bring herself to call names.  Too many syllables to all the good names.  Socialist.  Communist.  Pussy.  Baby Killer.  Traitor. 

All those letters.... oh, my Gawd!!

No wonder she couldn't finish the job Alaska elected her to do.  The stress of using all those letters was just too much.

And wasn't she saying something about "family values" here a year or two ago?  And then working overtime to keep the "evil" father of her grandchild from seeing his child.  Yeah, that's the Palin family values -  sounds kind of like the Adam's Family Values.  Without the humor.

[Red Arrow]

Are those goals not the ideal of the entire nation?

No

[nathanm]

No

So what's all that about expanding homeownership and encouraging small business that comes from both the Democrats and Republicans?

[Red Arrow]

So what's all that about expanding homeownership and encouraging small business that comes from both the Democrats and Republicans?

I don't believe it involves the community owning and controlling the means of production and distribution of capital, land etc. 

If you want to sell your house, the "community" tells you that you cannot discriminate based on race, religion, etc who you sell to but does not say you must sell it to a particular person/entity.

If you own a business, you have to share the benefits of your success in paying taxes.  The community does not tell you to sell to Joe and not Jake. The community does not help sweep your floors or clean your toilets.

[nathanm]

I don't believe it involves the community owning and controlling the means of production and distribution of capital, land etc. 

If you want to sell your house, the "community" tells you that you cannot discriminate based on race, religion, etc who you sell to but does not say you must sell it to a particular person/entity.

If you own a business, you have to share the benefits of your success in paying taxes.  The community does not tell you to sell to Joe and not Jake. The community does not help sweep your floors or clean your toilets.

The community is a group of individuals.

The alternatives are state control or control by an oligarchy.

[Gaspar]

The community is a group of individuals.

The alternatives are state control or control by an oligarchy.

Nathanm,
You really aren't getting it.  What Red and I are saying is that the system we operate under is not socialism.  Yes there are an increasing number of socialist programs and principals that have crept into our current system.  This is natural, it's the natural evolution of government to degrade into socialism over time, and then be reborn.

Many, especially the young, find themselves in agreement with Socialist philosophy, and again this is part of the natural progression of governments.  Across the span of history we have come to understand that all free forms of governance where the people are empowered by the right to vote eventually collapse.  Once the people learn that they obtain funds, and redistribute wealth through the power of their vote, they begin to vote for the candidates who promise the most benefit from the public treasury.  As those candidates become increasingly liberal, and entitlement programs become more progressive, the population in general becomes more dependent. 

The framers of our constitution understood this, and put in safeguards that have slowed the progress, but these too are being eroded.  I'm doubtful that we are wise enough or disciplined enough to preserve a free society for ever, but we must try, and that battle takes place in the mind.  Understanding this cycle is the first step.

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship.

The average age of the world's great civilizations has been two hundred years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence: from bondage to spiritual faith, from spiritual faith to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependency, from dependency back to bondage." - (mostly attributed to ) Tyler