Brady Theater vs. The Joint

[dbacks fan]

I've beeen thinking about this and after looking at some of the other casinos around the country and the acts they have coming up, I think alot of acts and performers are willing to do the casion route because the will probably get paid the same amount if it's SRO or half house in sales, because the casinos can cover it with the revenue from the games and food and beverage sales. Where as with the Brady and other venues, the performer will get paid regardless of what they take in gate and food and beverage and hope that it's enough to cover all of the expensess and make some profit out of it. And unless Oklahoma has some sort of shared revenue agreement with the tribes very little that goes in comes back.

[bmuscotty]

But wouldn't Las Vegas, Hollywood and Biloxi be considered more vacation destinations? Is Tulsa? Not really. As for people coming here from places like Joplin, the have casinos in Miami that draw some pretty good names to. They wouldn't have to drive down here unless is someone they really want to see and is not booked there. Some of the casinos in and around Oklahoma City draw good names from all types of music. Think of all the casinos in the state that have concert halls. Over saturate the market? They may end up cutting their own necks. Loss of taxes for the city and cutting in on the Brady's bottom dollar sucks. Think to about some of the acts that have played Million Dollar Elm. Like Styx. They were there last year I think. Wouldn't they have done well at the Brady?

[dbacks fan]

But wouldn't Las Vegas, Hollywood and Biloxi be considered more vacation destinations? Is Tulsa? Not really. As for people coming here from places like Joplin, the have casinos in Miami that draw some pretty good names to. They wouldn't have to drive down here unless is someone they really want to see and is not booked there. Some of the casinos in and around Oklahoma City draw good names from all types of music. Think of all the casinos in the state that have concert halls. Over saturate the market? They may end up cutting their own necks. Loss of taxes for the city and cutting in on the Brady's bottom dollar sucks. Think to about some of the acts that have played Million Dollar Elm. Like Styx. They were there last year I think. Wouldn't they have done well at the Brady?

Las Vegas definitely a vacation spot. Biloxi MS yeah I can see that, you're not far from New Orleans, Mobile, Gulf Port, and there is an Air Force Base there, and it is on the water. Hollywood Fla? It's between Ft. Lauderdale and Miami, and a large retirement area for the northeast, maybe a destination if you're already on vacation in the area. But other than Vegas they're not a first pick destination. Will the HR Tulsa draw people? Yes it will draw on the HR name and the fact they have the ability to run acts through on short order so there is something new every weekend. But I'm sure there are acts that will still go to The Brady, Cains and Spirit(maybe Spirit) I think it's going to change where people will go see performers, but I don't think it will kill of The Brady. Like I said HR has the ability to shuffle through all of it's locations different acts.

The next big area I have found that is embracing Indian Casinos is upstate New York in the Catskills area. They are starting to build Racinos, horse track/casino/resort on the sites of the old Jewish resorts, and some of them will also offer snow skiing using the old slopes built by the former resorts. I will look for some more info to include on this.

http://500nations.com/New_York_Casinos.asp

http://devsoc.cals.cornell.edu/cals/devsoc/outreach/cardi/publications/upload/01-2009-RPB.pdf

[DTowner]

The Hard Rock is the only local casino that is really positioning itself as a regional destination location, with the connected hotel, new events center and adjacent golf course.  I hear they draw a lot of visitors from Kansas, Missouiri and Arkansas.  However, I suspect a majority of the casino business is still being drawn from the local market.  The concerts would seem to draw mostly local audiences, although that may depend on the show itself.

Under compacts with Oklahoma, the casinos share a small portion of revenue with the state only on class III games.  Most of the machines are class II and Oklahoma gets no revenue share from them.  Everything else at the casino (food/beverage/hotels/event tickets/merchandise, etc.) cannot be taxed by the state/county/city.

[tulsascoot]

As long as the Brady management can sell the venue to the booking agents, it will be no problem. I've seen concerts in dozens of venues all over the country, and the Brady is still one of the best theaters to see a show. There's not a bad seat in the room, and the acoustics are fantastic. Many musicians will prefer an old mainstay with a great sounding room over a glitz and glamor modern Casino theater.

The Brady will live on. I usually see 8-10 concerts per year in OK, TX, MO, and/or AR, and have been doing hat for over 10 years. There are few rooms that compare to the Brady.

[heironymouspasparagus]

All;
You are missing the big picture.  The casino is a complete destination package.  Look at Riverwind casino in Norman, OK for a blueprint of what is going to happen here.  They have a 1500 seat concert hall and get acts like the following list.  Just think what 2800 seats would do?

Willie Nelson
Moe Bandy
Boys II Men
Howie Mandel
Reba
Train
Lyle Lovett
The Temptations
Ronnie Milsap
REO Speedwagon
Gary Allan

These are not all just little tiny acts.  Very lucrative events to an area, I would think.

Second thing this proves is the lie about how Tulsa couldn't possibly get big name events without a couple hundred million arena.  The Casiono Dudes are doing it all the time.  Guess 20 million is just fine.  Hmm....wonder what it would have cost to refurbish the existing civic center to get bring it up to world class??

Brady is great!!  Could use paint.

[sgrizzle]

I saw a story on the construction of this place and a lot of their seating was in suites and party areas. This place is half club/half theater and will not directly compete with the brady. It is more a place to get hammered with friends while bands from the state fair circuit play on.

[Hoss]

All;
You are missing the big picture.  The casino is a complete destination package.  Look at Riverwind casino in Norman, OK for a blueprint of what is going to happen here.  They have a 1500 seat concert hall and get acts like the following list.  Just think what 2800 seats would do?

Willie Nelson
Moe Bandy
Boys II Men
Howie Mandel
Reba
Train
Lyle Lovett
The Temptations
Ronnie Milsap
REO Speedwagon
Gary Allan

These are not all just little tiny acts.  Very lucrative events to an area, I would think.

Second thing this proves is the lie about how Tulsa couldn't possibly get big name events without a couple hundred million arena.  The Casiono Dudes are doing it all the time.  Guess 20 million is just fine.  Hmm....wonder what it would have cost to refurbish the existing civic center to get bring it up to world class??

Brady is great!!  Could use paint.

Willie DID play the arena; he opened for Beck, IIRC.

And these guys may have been A-listers 20 years ago, but fame is fleeting.  Can't market these acts to the large arenas now.  And some don't even like to play in them.

So when Osage Hills gets Paul McCartney or the Eagles to play in the 2800 seat arena, you call me.

You BOK naysayers crack me up.  It's been a profit maker for two straight years (unheard for public buildings like this).  People hate admitting they were wrong, even when it's for the good of the community.

[Conan71]

Willie opened for Dave Matthews last Oct. 2.  Prior to that he played to about 800 to 1000 people at the Cain's the previous November with Billy Bob Thornton (Yes, THAT Billy Bob Thornton).  Great show at the Cain's.  He sucked at BOK.

None of the acts Heir listed are bread and butter Brady acts with the possible exception of Train and Lyle Lovett, though they might be able to sell enough seats for the convention center.  They would never be able to pack the BOK as headliners.

[joiei]

I found this info

Fair shows and Casino shows are typically called "soft ticket" concerts. This means the ticket sales of the event are not the sole or main stream of revenue for the event.

A typical show must sell X many tickets to cover all expenses, mostly the artist fee. However casino and fair events have many sponsors or ulterior means to pay for the event. Therefore, these artists that play this circuit are way overpaid...

Devo for $50k anyone?

I might be way off, but I'll take a stab at it and say $25k. Bands that frequent that circuit might play 8-10 in a summer/fall season, or regulars (like ASIA, BÖC, etc) might make tours out of casinos, fairs, private and corporate events, and radio festivals.

here  http://ask.metafilter.com/69349/How-much-do-the-musical-acts-make-on-the-county-fair-circuit

[bmuscotty]

Saw this listing on Pollstar the other day. Wonder if this is the first act to play The Joint?

Thu 09/30/10   Doobie Brothers  Hard Rock Hotel & Casino Tulsa (Catoosa)   

[Ihearttacos]

Lyle Lovett and his big band are playing the PAC in July...Chapman Music Hall has about 2,300 seats...about 500 less than Brady.   

Love the Brady and would see a show there over going to Claremore for a 'glitterfied' casino experience.

[Conan71]

Ironically to this conversation, the owner of the Brady is the keyboardist for "Bradio" aka "Brady St. Orchestra" which plays at the River Spirit Casino on a somewhat frequent basis.  I've gone to see them there a couple of times, but I just can't handle the smoke so I won't be going back.

[Rico]

Ironically to this conversation, the owner of the Brady is the keyboardist for "Bradio" aka "Brady St. Orchestra" which plays at the River Spirit Casino on a somewhat frequent basis.  I've gone to see them there a couple of times, but I just can't handle the smoke so I won't be going back.

It sounds as though you may be acquainted with the fellow that owns Brady..?

Are there still plans for a remodel that would construct the portion left out of the original blueprints?

I have heard this fellow has quite the art collection tucked away in the basement of the Brady.
Not so much in value$$ but in the subject matter.

[Conan71]

It sounds as though you may be acquainted with the fellow that owns Brady..?

Are there still plans for a remodel that would construct the portion left out of the original blueprints?

I have heard this fellow has quite the art collection tucked away in the basement of the Brady.
Not so much in value$$ but in the subject matter.

We bike together and my company overhauled the heating system in the basement a year or so back.  Actually, I've never seen an art collection in the basement proper, but I'm sure he's managed to cull a pretty good stock of memorabilia over the years.  I'm not aware of any additional expansion plans but I will ask.  You'd be amazed at the damage left behind when the people he leased the place out to flaked out so that took a fair amount of time and money to fix.

Oh, I also noticed Bradio is playing at Summer's 5th Night tonight at Utica Square, should be a fun show.