Listen Up Jack-Wagons! New Geico Commercial

[Conan71]

I guess he has the same rights as Jane Fonda...
But as far as professional decorum, even past commander-in-chiefs dont even dump on sitting ones.

Someone forgot to tell former Presidents Carter and Clinton about that protocol.  Maybe that didn't count since Bush stole the 2000 election and he was not legitimately our President.

[Red Arrow]

Someone forgot to tell former Presidents Carter and Clinton about that protocol.  Maybe that didn't count since Bush stole the 2000 election and he was not legitimately our President.

You are forgetting about the political criticism diode.

[Conan71]

You are forgetting about the political criticism diode.

I do tend to suffer from selective amnesia.  Much like libs when you get them into a debate

[guido911]

Have you noticed, Guido, that active service military personnel studiously avoid discussing politics in public?  They generally remain mum until they're no longer in the military.  Now, from over here on the left end of the political spectrum, it's troublesome that they have to give up their free speech rights as part of their government service.

Baldwin and Ermey have the same right to speak their minds that you and I enjoy.  But their positions as actors, and in Ermey's case, a decorated veteran, doesn't mean their opinions carry more weight that your's or mine.  There's a name for that particular fallacy, though it escapes me just now.

Are you suggesting that active military personnel should be permitted to criticize their commander in chief in a public forum?  If so, I'd be very surprised.  Like I said, it's troublesome that they have restricted free speech rights, but perhaps someone with more direct experience with the military will comment on that.  

Look Ed, all I did was post a vid of Ermey criticizing your man and you (and a few others) got your collective nuts all twisted up over it. Did I say or suggest that his opinion means more than yours? Come on, you are so much better than this.

As for criticizing the government while active duty, I did write a letter to my base commander when I was in my first year critical of something I do not really recall. I do know it was critical of the government though. I got a very thoughtful and respectful response from the CO. So, no, you really do not give up your first amendment rights when you go in.

[Ed W]

Look Ed, all I did was post a vid of Ermey criticizing your man and you (and a few others) got your collective nuts all twisted up over it. Did I say or suggest that his opinion means more than yours? Come on, you are so much better than this.

As for criticizing the government while active duty, I did write a letter to my base commander when I was in my first year critical of something I do not really recall. I do know it was critical of the government though. I got a very thoughtful and respectful response from the CO. So, no, you really do not give up your first amendment rights when you go in.

Nuts twisted up?  Hardly.  I just pointed out a few obvious problems, but chief among them is the false authority fallacy (and yeah, I had to go look it up!) with a secondary comment about the inability of active duty personnel to publicly criticize their civilian superiors.  Alec Baldwin, Stephen Baldwin, R. Lee Ermey, and Jane Fonda are all equals when it comes to political commentary.  That is, they're each well beyond their area of expertise.

As for your letter to the commander, I have to assume it wasn't meant for public consumption.  Otherwise, the CO may have taken a different tack.  You're no doubt aware of that.

So while you and I are authorities in our fields - your's is law, I think, while mine is...um...women - our opinions are of little consequence outside our specialties.     

[guido911]

Nuts twisted up?  Hardly.  I just pointed out a few obvious problems, but chief among them is the false authority fallacy (and yeah, I had to go look it up!) with a secondary comment about the inability of active duty personnel to publicly criticize their civilian superiors.  Alec Baldwin, Stephen Baldwin, R. Lee Ermey, and Jane Fonda are all equals when it comes to political commentary.  That is, they're each well beyond their area of expertise.

As for your letter to the commander, I have to assume it wasn't meant for public consumption.  Otherwise, the CO may have taken a different tack.  You're no doubt aware of that.

So while you and I are authorities in our fields - your's is law, I think, while mine is...um...women - our opinions are of little consequence outside our specialties.     

"Hanoi Jane" Fonda=R. Lee Ermey?



I cannot believe you would draw such a disgusting comparison.

[Ed W]

"Hanoi Jane" Fonda=R. Lee Ermey?

I cannot believe you would draw such a disgusting comparison.

Sorry, Guido.  I didn't intend to get your nuts all twisted up.  But are you saying that Ermey and Fonda do not have the same right to speak their minds, or are you saying that one or both are well within their area of expertise when they've commented on geo-politics?

[guido911]

Sorry, Guido.  I didn't intend to get your nuts all twisted up.  But are you saying that Ermey and Fonda do not have the same right to speak their minds, or are you saying that one or both are well within their area of expertise when they've commented on geo-politics?

Show me a pic of Ermey hanging out with the enemy in Vietnam (probably can't since he was busy fighting them), because Ermey's take on the problems with our economy is nowhere near the same as aiding our enemies.

Is the reason your comparing a traitor to a decorated war veteran because Hanoi Jane once twisted your nuts or something?

[Red Arrow]

... because Hanoi Jane once twisted your nuts or something?

Maybe he was an extra in Barbarella.   

[Ed W]

You sidestepped the questions very nicely, Guido, but what I think of Fonda, Ermey, or the Baldwins is irrelevant.  So I'll ask again.  Do they enjoy the same right to speak their minds as you and I?  Does their fame and positions as actors lend them greater credibility when speaking on geo-politics?

[guido911]

You sidestepped the questions very nicely, Guido, but what I think of Fonda, Ermey, or the Baldwins is irrelevant.  So I'll ask again.  Do they enjoy the same right to speak their minds as you and I?  Does their fame and positions as actors lend them greater credibility when speaking on geo-politics?

If you equate what Fonda did during a time of war with what Ermey said about the economy, I can't help you. Nor will I answer whatever question you are positing because such is indeed a mega-false equivalence. Hell, even that moron Fonda eventually concluded her behavior was wrong.

One other thing, do you really believe that Fonda sitting on a North Vietnamese AA gun used to shoot at our soldier's planes was an expression of speech? If so, I don't ever want to hear another TNF b!tch about Citizen's United.

[Hoss]

You sidestepped the questions very nicely, Guido, but what I think of Fonda, Ermey, or the Baldwins is irrelevant.  So I'll ask again.  Do they enjoy the same right to speak their minds as you and I?  Does their fame and positions as actors lend them greater credibility when speaking on geo-politics?

What did you expect, Ed?  He's a registered Reeepublican AND an attorney at that?  They're good at spinning.

[Red Arrow]

What did you expect, Ed?  He's a registered Reeepublican AND an attorney at that?  They're good at spinning.

Cute.... but irrelevant.

[Hoss]

Cute.... but irrelevant.

How is it irrelevant?  Ed asked him a question.  He skirts the answer by asking Ed another question.  How's that not relevant?  He's good at spinning.  He's an attorney and a Republican.  Pretty damned relevant.  To me.  Maybe not to a fellow Republican spinner.

[Red Arrow]

How is it irrelevant?  Ed asked him a question.  He skirts the answer by asking Ed another question.  How's that not relevant?  He's good at spinning.  He's an attorney and a Republican.  Pretty damned relevant.  To me.  Maybe not to a fellow Republican spinner.

You found a song with the word "spinning" in it.  Big deal.  Now, if you found a video of a ballet dancer or figure skater spinning, that would have been good.  Just my opinion.